Are the Palestinians the Jews NOT expelled from Judaea after Bar Kochba Revolt?

For the Y-chromosome, all Jewish groups, except for the Ethiopians, are closely related to each other. They do not differ significantly from Samaritans (0.041) and Druze (0.033), but are different from Palestinians (0.163), Africans (0.219), and Europeans (0.111).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_studies_on_Jews#The_Samaritans

 

I am sorry, Jonstar, but that is such a unlikely professional quote because the Y-Chromosome contains literally many dozens of clades and subclades, so I am grossly suspicious of a quote that attributes such numbers to non-specific “Y-chromosome". As Erskine Childers advised in 1961, always check the facts related to claims concerning Jews/Palestinians, so I checked your Wiki reference.

Here are some other quotes from your reference which you omitted:

You left those out.

So how is your quote (which was indeed present) explained? Firstly I believe you might have engaged in some mild cherry-picking in selecting your quote.
Secondly I believe the answer lies here, in Elhaik’s recent work:

I believe that MS Openheimers comments were in line with these recent studies.

So the reason for the closer relationship of the Ashkenazi and Samaritans with each other than with the Palestinians, is that both have had admixtures (and significant amounts at that) with European populations. Ask Gwyneth Paltrow where she believes her blonde hair and blue eyes come from.

 

they certainly don't come from the Khazars, as this silly ideas has been debunked long ago.

 

Well, I am glad to see that, with the weight of evidence provided to you, you have ceased to claim that genetically the less-admixtured Jews and the Palestinians are all but indistinguishable. They are brothers, genetically, as Ariella Oppenheimer noted.

So it seems that you are finally down to the claim that the Khazar link had been debunked years ago, I refute the validity of that old conclusion in the light of modern results. Now I know that these are most inconvenient for the Zionist supporters, but I am afraid that I am disinterested in this inconvenience. So …. to get to the rebuttal of your “debunking” … it would appear that you have not been following the recent theme of evidence in this thread. Brace yourself because here it comes ….. once again:

Eran Elhaik - July 2013 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3595026/pdf/evs119.pdf incorporated for the first time detailed genetic studies on Khazar links, and findound as follows:

Khazar admixture confirmed.

 

If the Ashkenazi Jews are TRULY descendants of the Khazars, they would share lots of genetics with the local Armenians, Caucasians, Circassians, Dagestanis, Chechnyans, and Ossetians.....for that is where the Khazars lived.

And yet, Ashkenazi Jews do not bear a striking genetic resemblance to these peoples.

You fail. Ashkenazi Jews are more similar to groups in the Mediteranean than the Caucuses.

 

and what is their conclusion??????????

Our findings support the Khazarian hypothesis depicting
a large Near Eastern–Caucasus ancestry along with
Southern European, Middle Eastern, and Eastern European
ancestries, in agreement with recent studies and oral and
written traditions. We conclude that the genome of
European Jews is a tapestry of ancient populations including
Judaized Khazars, Greco–Roman Jews, Mesopotamian Jews,
and Judeans and that their population structure was formed
in the Caucasus and the banks of the Volga with roots
stretching to Canaan and the banks of the Jordan.


any claim that the Ashkenazi Jews are simply just Khazars who converted to Judaism, is a lie.

 

Where does your copy of Elhaik's "Our findings ...... and the banks of Jordan" show a claim that the Ashkenazim are "simply just Khazars"? It clearly states that they are a "tapestry" including Khazars.

You claimed that this had been debunked. It clearly hasn't. Why are you wasting our time?

 

The "Khazar" theory is that the Ashkenazi are predominantly descended from Gentile Khazars that converted to Judaism centuries ago. That the great majority of their ancestry, is Khazar.

That is a lie.

 

Obviously!!
But it is now equally evident that all Jews originate from dominantly Israel is equally a lie

 

A majority of Jews have genetics coming from the Middle East/Mediteranean region.

We are more genetically similar to each other than to the neighboring Gentile communities.

Jews from India, Egypt, Morocco, Lithuania, and Germany have more in common genetically with each other than with Gentile Indians, Egypians, Moroccans, Lithuanians, and Germans.

 

Exactly!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Now people who are trying to dislocate us from our ancestral home, have tried all kind of shenanigans and euphemisms in the past and failed... we have been the punching ball of all kind of Jew haters and anti Semites it is not even funny. From now on I will not acknowledge Klip Kap unless he offers something of substance ... so far all his copious efforts to delegitimize Israel have failed and will fail in the future

 

Just because the majority of our genes are Middle Eastern/Mediteranean doesn't mean we are "natives" of Israel.

 

I care less of what you think we are... We are here, we live, we work, we are fruitful, we make a living, we fight, and we will be forever after the Jew Haters have turned to dust.

 

nice speech. Want a medal?

 

So far, genetics is not a very clear science, and the one thing we know absolutely is that Zionists always lie. Not only were the colonising Zionists not native, everything suggests that only a tiny proportion of their ancestors ever were, even two thousand years ago.

 

You misspelled "Palestinians".

 

Not really, I earned my medals in the Israeli Navy. Medals are not bestowed they are earned!

 

Duw, there's BRILLIANT! Ew want to go higher than those bogwalls, honest ew do, mun!

 

Who told you that ? Are you a geneticist ? Was the study funded by Zionists ? Who compiled the report _ Jews. ?

Would you believe/.accept the results of a genetic study funded by very wealthy Saudis + carried out a team of international muslim geneticists ?


While , there may be SOME - a Jewish minority (perhaps Cohens etc) with genetic links to people -of the Levant, including the Palestinian , but to say its the majority is totally ridiculous.

Excuse me for not accepting a so-called scientific study to promoted/justify a political agenda. However , I'd ask you to put your prejudices aside for a few minutes and consider this :

"The shared genetic heritage of Jews and Palestinians"

The Times recently carried this unusual report on an Israeli Jew (Tsvi Misinai, a retired computer expert) who's hoping to prove that Palestinians are descended from Jews. Apparently, he thinks that proving this will help to stop the bloodshed. His idea is that modern Jews are descended from emigration in the first few centuries of the Christian era. The Jews who stayed put in Palestine converted to Islam, and became Palestinian Arabs. There's hope that genetic tests might be able to prove this.

Well, there is good news and bad news on that score.
The good news is that the genetics of Arabs and Jews have been pretty extensively researched. The classic study dates to 2000, from a team lead by Michael Hammer of University of Arizona. They looked at Y-chromosome haplotypes - this is the genetic material passed from father to son down the generations.

What they revealed was that Arabs and Jews are essentially a single population, and that Palestinians are slap bang in the middle of the different Jewish populations (as shown in this figure).

Another team, lead by Almut Nebel at the Hebrew University, Jerusalem, took a closer look in 2001. They found that Jewish lineages essentially bracket Muslim Kurds, but they were also very closely related to Palestinians. In fact, what their analysis suggested was that Palestinians were identical to Jews, but with a small mix of Arab genes - what you would expect if they were originally from the same stock, but that Palestinians had mixed a little with Arab immigrants. They conclude:

We propose that the Y chromosomes in Palestinian Arabs and Bedouin represent, to a large extent, early lineages derived from the Neolithic inhabitants of the area and additional lineages from more-recent population movements. The early lineages are part of the common chromosome pool shared with Jews (Nebel et al. 2000). According to our working model, the more-recent migrations were mostly from the Arabian Peninsula...
So, as far as male lineage goes, the genetic story is very clear. Palestinians and Jews are virtually indistinguishable.

Women are a bit more tricky...
Up until last year, the matrilineal heritage of Jews also seemed pretty clear. Analysis of elements in mitochondrial DNA (which is passed from mother to daughter) seemed to show that Jewish populations around Europe, North Africa, and the Middle East were derived from at least 8 unrelated 'founding mothers'.

Where they came from wasn't clear, but the most likely explanation was that they were from local populations that bred with immigrant Jewish males. Their offspring became absorbed into the Jewish community.

In 2008, a more sophisticated analysis was published that made use of whole mitochondrial DNA sequences. They found no evidence for the genetic bottle necks that indicate founding mothers in the large Jewish populations. Instead, they found a complicated picture with a very diverse gene pool suggesting intermarriage both with local populations and other Jewish groups.

The overall conclusion is that the female Jewish line deviates a lot more from the Palestinian heritage than the male line, but the heritage is still there.

So that's the good news. Jews and Palestinian Arabs are blood brothers - although this close genetic relationship probably stems from pre-Judaic times, rather than any more recent conversion of Palestinian Jews to Islam.

And the bad news? Well, this basic story has been known for the best part of a decade now. But, perhaps unsurprisingly, it hasn't lead to the warring sides laying down their weapons and engaging in a group hug.

This is a ( political /religious conflict, not a genetic one.

Mr Misinai is, sadly, on a hiding to nothing.

.http://epiphenom.fieldofscience.com/2009/01/shared-genetic-heritage-of-jews-and.html

I'm reading another interesting report which I shall post later.

.. cheers..

 

have there ever been any genetic conflicts?

 

are you saying that scientists who are of the Jewish faith are incapable of being honest regarding genetic studies of Jews????

 

Not all scientists , however , those who come up with the sort of reports you're quoting and trying to present as "evidence " apparently are Jewish or /and funded by some pro-Zionist groups.

He who pays the piper calls the tune - WOT ?


btw - let's not mix/confuse or expect " honesty " from any studies intent on serving a political agenda.

Genetic make up has sweet f- all to do with land ownership.

If some scientist told me I had traces of genes linked to Norman/ or Jutes/Saxon/Hugenots whatever , how does that entitle me to claim land ownership rights in Holland/Belgium /Jutland/Saxony or Normandy ?

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Only when Jews choose to make it so . To justify their crimes, their criminal dispossession/displacement of non-Jewish Palestinians in order to create Herzl's "DER JUDENSTAAT ".


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wow, you really do hate Jews.

- - - Updated - - -

so Jews=Zionists?

that's not fair. Are all Muslims Al Qaeda?

 

NO - I did NOT - please do not distort my words .


. AFAI can tell , while the muslims who agree with the methods/Aims of Al Qaeda , appear to be a MINORITY , on the other side , again AFAI can tell, the overwhelming MAJORITY , of Jew -worldwide - totally support the ZIONIST project and its ideals .

Take a look at Indonesia - the world's largest - Muslim democracy - the majority population couldn't care $hit about Al-Q , or the Palestinian/Zionist conflict. While in America + elsewhere in "the WEst " you'll find most Jews
fully supportive/defensive of whatever criminal activities permitted by Israel Jews against non-Jewish Palestinians.


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