US led battle group deploys to Poland.

Discussion in 'Latest US & World News' started by zoom_copter66, Mar 26, 2017.

  1. tecoyah

    tecoyah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It is Obvious that Russia(Putin) does not wish to negotiate diplomatically preferring instead the tactics of old. Virtually every nation has opened this door and had it slammed in their face sometimes with enough force to break the windows or worse, as in the case of Georgia and Ukraine. There simply comes a time that the harsh lesson is learned and no one knocks anymore.

    Eventually the entire block is avoided and people just move away.
     
  2. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Donor

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    There was hope of Russia becoming democratic after the USSR was gone, but then Putin came along. Dictator-for-life Putin. I hear he controls your media and will be shooting for a fourth term next year. Is any of this demonization or misrepresentation? Or is it just uncomfortable reality? Whatever democratic reforms Russia has undergone, people are still fleeing Putin's Russia, still coming westward for a better life.

    And good god - no proof of Russia's acts of military aggression?? What kind of bubble are you living in there, buddy?

    As for NATO, let me know when NATO actually violates Russian sovereignty the way Russia has violated Georgian and Ukrainian sovereignty..
     
  3. Ninian

    Ninian Banned

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    Oh really? 'obvious'? You telling this yourself every morning, or only when a russian accuses USA of acting as agressor?
     
  4. Ninian

    Ninian Banned

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    Well, present them here, then. If they are so common, so well known, so public and at everyone's disposal - present them here, it should not be taking much of a time, if they are that commonly accessible.

    Well, give me actual proof - not a rumor.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2017
  5. Ninian

    Ninian Banned

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    The Putin's presidental ranc or his potential possiblity of presenting himself as one of candidates on elections is not a reason for military presence on my country's borders. And yes, saying he is a dictator for life - is a misinterpritation. He has chance of being a candidate and competing for presidency - he does not has guarantees of winning it. And the more incompetence he and his office will be showing, the lesser that chance becomes.
     
  6. tecoyah

    tecoyah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I should have said Obvious to everyone not watching Russian State Run Media.
     
  7. Ninian

    Ninian Banned

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    By the way, excuse me - since when is my country not democratic? Since we have corrupted crooks in government? Well, you have such kind too.
    We fight our crooks, we deal with them. We are a patient nation, that is slow to stand up - that is true. That does not means we are going to stop now. And we would've stood up much earlier, if not for foreign pressure, spooking elderly in support of ruling party. We, I remind you, went through a horrible times in nineties. Ruthless, mercyless time with no help from abroad, when elites fought among themselves like criminals - and plenty of them literally were criminals, released from sovet jails through amnesty, people with criminal thinking - while markets and grocery stores were empty, where buying a carton of milk was a struggle because there was no milk in stores.

    Dissolution of Union wasn't easy, and memories of that time are fresh. We lived in it. I grew up in it. It took years to recover, years during which many people were much more worried about their family's wellfare, than about state. Up untill 2011, when 'Russia United' took majority of seats in parlament and protests started - that continued in 2012 and 2013, now being against Putin's 3rd presidency... ...up until the Euromaidan. Collapse of ukrainian government and coup - that allowed to scare population in obedience, due to a poor results of that political change.

    While you worry about RF acquiring Crimean republic, I worry about neo-nazy in Ukraine openly writing manifests to the president.
    http://www.pravda.com.ua/news/2017/03/16/7138320/
    Armed, radical barely controllable people, participating in military conflict on east of Ukraine and orchestrating the blockade of coal supplies from ukrainian facilities in Donbass to ukrainian power plants, sabotaging the diplomatic resolve of that conflict.

    Imagine, if KKK takes arms and forms a few battalions of 'self defence'. Would you not be concerned about that? Yet that part of event in Ukraine remains not presented to public - while being hazardous to population.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_Battalion#Human_rights_violations_and_war_crimes
    [​IMG]

    You want such people to be ignored and let to be? You want have such face for democracy?


    I do not say, that my government never did anything wrong, I say that we right now face problems that should not be ignored. With situation with refugees in Europe, such elements in Ukraine may spread to other european countries, and fact that government does not opposes them - is concerning. And it explains, why separatists and why crimean referendum's result have support among people not in RF - but in Donbass and Crimea. They do not feel welcome in Poroshenko's Ukraine.
     
  8. Ninian

    Ninian Banned

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    ...because watching US state run media is so much better.

    I too can be accusing people. Proove first, that our media is state run, or at least that I watch it. I am, somehow, intuitively have feeling that if I say that I do not watch TV, and that I try to avoid governmental media sources, and that yet I feel exactly as I fee and exactly state what I state, you will not believe me, because I am russian. Though, if I am wrong there, be welcome to relieve my grim expectations.
     
  9. Silver Surfer

    Silver Surfer Banned

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    If anyone needed an example of intellectually dishonest post just read the one above. Aren't you tired of posting the same old nonsense for many years? Anyone with modicum of intelligence realised long ago that U.S neoconservatives do not wish to negotiate and prefer further confrontation. U.S neoconservatives are the biggest threat to the world peace.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2017
  10. tecoyah

    tecoyah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Being a Russian citizen has nothing to do with my commentary as it specifically addressed the State Run Media. Truth be told I simply do not care what you think or why you think it. When reviewing the many international news sources and comparing the results to RTS it is extremely clear that there is massive inconsistency and my choice based on previous activities from your country lead me to believe the 10 sources vs, the one.
     
  11. Ninian

    Ninian Banned

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    So basically, you are not interested in opinions - you interested in media. Media of countries-members of EU and NATO, or wishing to become members of these organisations. You interested in media of countries, sanctioning RF and opposing it on constant basis.

    You interested in the media of one side, and discarding the other - along with my personal knowledge and opinions.

    Explain, why should I not be afraid of people, who are so reluctant to receive both sides of story?
     
  12. tecoyah

    tecoyah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I am interested in factual data in order to form MY OWN "Opinion" and do not feel the RT is factual enough to form it. Admittedly I am pro NATO and western civilization which automatically makes me somewhat anti-Russia as they are opposed to both.
     
  13. Pycckia

    Pycckia Well-Known Member

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    That is the way conspiracy theorists think.
     
  14. Ninian

    Ninian Banned

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    What a peculiar approach. I surely understand opposition to NATO - formed against Soviet Union it now threatens one of it's former republics - but 'western civilization'..? What is a 'western civilization', if I may ask? What is a definition of it?
     
  15. zoom_copter66

    zoom_copter66 Well-Known Member

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    Yes the internal issues is all the moskali infiltrators in govt and defense.
     
  16. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Donor

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    Vlad the Bad regards these protests as "attempts at destabilization in the RF" and claims that they need to be stopped ( https://news.mail.ru/politics/29220719/ ). Protests are the norm in free, democratic countries, and are never treated as "destabilization" by our governments. On the contrary, they are regarded as a right and as an important part of democracy. People out protesting Trump don't need some kind of approval from Trump himself, and not even Trump is saying what Putin is saying. Herein lies the fundamental difference between democracy and dictatorship. Dictatorships will often enough try to create the illusion of freedom and democracy, but in the end that's all it is, and such governments can't handle the downfall of the dictator.
     
  17. zoom_copter66

    zoom_copter66 Well-Known Member

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    Same can be asked of Soviet/russian civilization, what is it?
     
  18. tecoyah

    tecoyah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Firstly please note the "Former" in your comment and understand no one can "Threaten" your former holding unless they invade it...kinda like Ukraine.
    Western civilization implies free peoples with government protected rights.
     
  19. Ninian

    Ninian Banned

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    First of all, I do not call your president a 'Trunk' or our ex-president, pardon me, 'the Bush', so let's not be calling names people who are not in that conversation. And yes, Putin did disliked these rallies, because they are sign of discontent, that hardly pleases him. That does not means rallies are going to stop, or loose in scale. But they are unusual for our country - at least in scale of a massive country-wide rally. This is not even because of some sort of 'tyranny', this is because of our patience. This is part of our national nature - we let people be, for the most part. But when we stand - we stand. Putin is not a de jure dictator, and de facto he will be proven not to be one.

    After all - did lack of approval for ralliy in Moskva stopped it from happening..? Thousand of peoples on Tverskaya street and Pushkin's square prove it didn't.
     
  20. zoom_copter66

    zoom_copter66 Well-Known Member

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    How did you grow up in the SU, when your profile states you were born in early 91, or is this BS on your part? Those people that take up arms in the theory of "Nazis" like you say is basically long memories of Soviet barbarism, the one you claim never happened and constantly tell others to prove, as I said before this part of history has never been explained to you, and you constantly dismiss it as "propaganda", well the truth is a b**** sometimes Ninian, isn't it?
     
  21. Ninian

    Ninian Banned

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    Russian Federation - Russian Soviet Federational Socialistic Republic, before the reformation and dissolution of USSR - is one of former states of Soviet Union, and is currently threatened by NATO.
    Second - with such definition - rather unimpressive in my opinion - 'western civilization' currently applies to the most of states on the planet, among them - to Russian Federation. Our government might not be ideal, yet it does protects the rights of the citizens for the most part - just as does government of the USA. If you will argue about events when it does not - I counter that argument with how USA government protected right of japanese USA citizens during second World War, by sending them in internment camps. Unless you state that western civilisation in the definion of yours formed only after that event in United States history, claims that my government is different in it's general approach to citizens, is basically invalid.

    Therefore, apparently Russian Federation hardly can be called 'opposing' the 'western civilization'. We absorb part of your media, we basically have English as one of widely used secondary languages, and there I am - on your forum, demonstrating the lack of good arguments in support of alienating my nation from the rest of the world.
     
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  22. tecoyah

    tecoyah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Internment was an unfortunate reaction to war an nobody died. People strangely die whenever they become a powerful voice of opposition to Putin....that is NOT freedom.
     
  23. Ninian

    Ninian Banned

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    I grew up in nineties - that I told about in my message, and I presented links to support my claims about nazy danger in the Ukraine. I continue to stand my claims - Ukrainian neo-nazy have armed 'self-defence' batallions, created blockade of coal supplies -
    http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2017/...-issue-ultimatum-ukraine-170227172545227.html
    - that eventually not been lifted, but instead supported by government -
    https://www.ft.com/content/276f3fd8-098c-11e7-ac5a-903b21361b43
    - and then, along with ultra-right parties presented a manifest to Poroshenko.

    These events demonstating excessive power these movements got - movements of hatred and lies, that should be restricted in civilized world - and how they threaten to continue influencing actions of ukrainian government.

    My claims stand - people in Donbass and Crimea have reasons to not feel welcome in Ukraine anymore, they have right to not be wishing to be part of that state.
     
  24. Ninian

    Ninian Banned

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    That is conspirology.
     
  25. tecoyah

    tecoyah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Actually that is documented fact...did they not report the latest on RT....it happened last week.
     

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