Defeating the bogeyman of single payer healthcare

Sounds to me like your problem isn't health insurance but capitalism.

 

The extant superior paradigm of all advanced, democratic nations vs Aynrandistan.

Ideologues who rail against pragmatists,empirical reality, and progress have yet to cite a single alternative among the nearly 200 nations on earth that covers everyone at far lower cost than the US squanders.

 

i prefer access based on ability to pay instead of equal access for everyone.

Insured Americans get the best care in the world.

 

You didn't answer my question. And right, increasing the power of the state over our lives and having it take over 1/6 of the economy is "progress".

 

That is still around 42 million people!

Paying for that 14% IS WHAT THE ISSUE IS ALL ABOUT!!!

Do we continue with the current model of massive infusion of medicaid dollars to fill that gap, or do we move to actually one of controlling costs on both the insurer side and the provider side? That's the issue.

And as has been repeated ad nauseum, you want more healthcare, YOU can pay for it, even with universal healthcare.

Because health care as we have come to know it did not exist in 1789! DUH!

Neither did nuclear weapons or weather forecasting. Progress kinda works that way and thankfully our forefathers created a living document that can be adjusted to meet future needs, in spite of the ignorances of the masses.

 

Yes, you need to do plenty of it!

 

So this is it...in other words, if you're sick, hurry up and die.

Wonderful example there of humanity at work!

At least I applaud you for your honesty, but that is a hard sell for the rest of America to buy.

 

The first half of your post is what we currently have.

The second, on what do you base that on?

 

Medicaid is single payer.

Of the 42 million less than 10 million could actually not afford health insurance. 10 million paid for their own health care, 10 million young adults preferred to go on vacation rather than pay for health insurance, and 10 million were actually eligible for existing gov programs.

Do your homework before embarrassing yourself.

 

Those countries do it by rationing health care spending to a level which is ~ half of what is spent in the US. That is the reality. Health coverage is not the same as health care. That is also the reality.

 

What's sad is that the advocates of single payer based on professed "success" in other countries refuse to do their homework on the health care spending levels in those countries. They dishonestly confuse health coverage with health care. Pathetic.

 

Again, a statement with NOTHING to back it up.

Plenty of other nations are able to provide for everyone of their citizens' health care, but because of entrenched ideologues that continue to pound their chests on the false belief in capitalism and the gulf of ignorance about modern medicine, we continue to get nowhere.

 

And so is Medicare.

If you really believe a free-market model will cover everyone, show us an example.

 

Do your homework. The data is readily available. Why the reluctance to look up how much per capita is spent by OECD countries per year ?? I would think anyone arguing for single payer would have the curiosity and initiative to know and understand this data.

 

And both Medicaid and Medicare are not accepted by many health care providers. Why is that ?? It's because the gov payments do not cover the costs of the treatments.

The US is as close as it comes. I linked to a Kaiser page which listed the costs of all procedures. The R health care reforms include a requirement for publishing prices on all procedures.

 

And of those 42 million uninsured for whatever reason, YOU are paying for indirectly when they eventually get sick and show up in the ER!

What part of this do you not understand???

The only one embarrassing themselves is you, who cannot seem to get through your thick skull that whether you pay for it directly or indirectly, YOU ARE STILL PAYING FOR IT!

The issue is the costs of healthcare and which model makes it more efficient for EVERYONE, not yourself. You are preferring to pay for everyone else who was as reticent as you in your youth to get coverage and expects everyone else to pay when you show up as a catastrophe in the ER.

Seriously, I cannot fathom that degree of illogic, let alone lack of empathy for those who would be shut out under a Darwinian system.

 

In general, the person making the claim provides the citation.

That you refuse to post one shows your are speaking out of your ass.

 

See the thing is it is not about savings, how many people are covered, or even how good coverage is. The simple fact is that it is not the role of the federal government to provide insurance. Medicare and medicaid is already going farther then the stated powers in the Constitution.

If a state like California wants to implement a single payer system then I say go for it and more power too them. Then if a state like Idaho does not then good for them. It is clearly stated that the powers not given to the fed is given to the states. Why can we not allow the states to decide?

 

Private health insurance premiums are higher by 1 - 2% due to people without health insurance not paying their bills. Most do.

Private health insurance premiums are higher by much more to make up the difference between Medicaid and Medicare payment defiencies.

You and all others espousing the benefits of single payer are completely misguided and cannot justify your arguments with any economic analysis nor will you do basic homework on how other nations control spending by rationing health care spending to a level half of what is spent in the US.

 

In general, about 9 out of 10 physicians accept medicare assignment.

And please, do tell, how will that lower costs?

How does a non medically trained person, who is sick and possibly in pain, sift through all that to make a rational cost effective decision?

 

That's funny - you argue for a system which you know nothing about. Sad.

 

That is correct, I have worked in the industry for over a decade and we rarely make money on insurance. Instead we make all of our money on investments. It is considered a fantastic achievement to make a profit on written premium. paying out 98c for every dollar we take in is considered a boom period for our companies.

 

Why not 10 out of 10 ?? And what is the Medicaid acceptance rate ??

Competition. With help from family, trusted friends, and the internet.

 

Yes, the profit margin in health insurance is very low.

 

AGAIN!

Where the hell are you getting this stuff!

This is just plain FALSE!