Is all morality subjective?

Hope is probably the only emotion which CAN be associated with survival tactics. That's the point of those tactics, after all - to secure 'hope' (for the future).

 

Hmm, how about cannibalism? Two skinny people have to eat one fat guy or they will die.
They are trapped in a plane wreck in the Himalayan mountains, with lots of snow outside and nothing to eat.
The fat guy made aggressive sexual advances towards one of the girl survivors and they don't feel comfortable with him around but there's nowhere else for them to go.

He's 400 pounds... plenty of meat to keep the rest of them full for several weeks.
Plus at 400 pounds, they think he probably doesn't have a long expected lifespan anyway.

 

You are aware of what Christianity believes on this subject?

(And no I'm not referring to anything supernatural)

 

I think you have a naively optimistic view of human nature.
Have you read about any of the things the MS-13 gang has done in Mexico and the US?

Why don't you visit the Africa section of this forum and just take a little look at some of the horrible stories there?

 

Well I think if you’re killing someone who doesn’t want to die then it’s murder. At least in that situation.

 

MS-13 gang members are not normal healthy people.

And again, it's all subjective.

Look what the Mayans did. Was the Mayan civilization evil?

You are viewing this in an optimistic/pessimistic manner. I am not.

Please stop snipping my replies. Reply to the whole post or ignore it. K?

 

But is it immoral?

We have historical reference with the Donner Party.

 

I guess it could be an is what it is kind of situation at best.

 

Which suggests morals are subjective.

 

I don’t know if that’s really subjective because it certainly isn’t ideal. No one should feel good about it.

 

Well, if you can't conclusively decide, and go with "it is what it is," how is that not subjective?

Objectively, cannibalism is either moral or immoral. Comparing the Donner Party to Jeffery Dahmer should convince anyone that it is indeed subjective.

 

Well eating the fat guy to survive could be seen as necessary for survival while needlessly cannibalizing people in your apartment isn’t necessary at all. But both are still bad situations.

 

Agreed, but we're discussing morality and whether it's subjective.

A motorcycle accident is a bad situation, but not immoral.

 

Well it’s bad of the people to eat the fat guy. I’m sure they could maybe even find another way to survive.

 

Nope. The Donner Party were stranded in 20 ft. of snow. No plants, and the animals were killed first. They ate each other.

 

Maybe it was the right thing to die then.

 

And it always is to one degree or the other. Note a slave yet retains his humanity but a slaveowner always becomes a monster.

 

Morality is not subjective. It's objective. Like math. Some moral problems are easy (don't murder, lie, steal, cheat) and some are more difficult. The fact that most societies throughout recorded human history have enshrined the basics into moral codes is a great indicator that morality is objective.

We've discovered moral behavior that leads a society to thrive, much like a mathematician might derive or discover a new branch of math. Departing from that morality drastically causes the society to not thrive. The effect of that deviation is not subjective, it's empirically observable.

 

For the most part, yes it is subjective and relative. If I murder you on the street, I could get life. If I am wearing a police or military uniform, I could get a commendation.

 

Situational ethics/morals does not mean that morality is subjective. Let's not confuse "murder" with "killing".

 

Ergo, that is morally subjective.

 

Nope it's a psychological problem. The belief that one can create utopia is a mental defect.

 

???

You're lost. We're talking about morality being subjective. I have no clue where you pulled that out from, and don't tell me. Don't need to know.

 

Except the point is survival.

It matters not how you want to characterize it.

If Tribe A gains a survival advantage by enslaving people from Tribe B, that's what they're gonna do. Monstrous maybe, but that's irrelevant. What's relevant is in our DNA.

A slave retains his humanity? Did you really say that? Smh.

 

there are no absolutes. cannibalism is generally amoral and unhealthy, but for the donner party .....

slavery has been bandied about in this thread, but slavery, the breeding of slaves, and sadistic and sexual abuse of slaves has a long history of support from religion. the judeo christian god seems to approve.