The Post-Pax-Americana World

Here's a question---when did that "confidence" cease to exist?

 

The erosion began when Trump announced we were leaving, and accelerated when Biden confirmed our intent to depart.

 

I think that arriving at a withdrawal agreement with the Taliban without allowing the Afghan government to participate was more than an "erosion".

 

Fair enough. I won't quibble.

 

It doesn't happen here very often, but we seem to agree.

 

Bret Stephens is (once again) mourning his lost empire. But America can't police the world, or even Afghanistan any more. We are an exhausted ex-empire, that doesn't quite know it yet, but will probably learn that lesson soon.

 

One of the big issues is that we're trying to combat non-state enemies, and that's more difficult than confronting governments.

 

True but we used to know how to do that. But that's hard, and if we're not going to do things because they're hard, it's safe to say that we're out of the great power business.

 

Empires have been exhausted before, but I think we're seeing something totally new here. As I see it there are many new facets to current events. Forgive me if I ramble, but I'm still trying to organize this in my own mind.

First, America found itself in a unique position after WWII. The rest of the industrial world lay ravaged but we were essentially ok. If you wanted to buy a car, a radio, a train, an airplane, a refrigerator, etc... you had to buy American. We became rich in a way unknown in the world. Now the world has recovered and we are no longer totally in charge of the only store.

Second, technology has spoiled us. We can get our food delivered with a phone call. We can communicate globally instantly. We used to struggle to get information. Now we struggle to manage the massive amount of information at our fingertips. We don't chop wood to heat our homes, we just set the thermostat. We don't have to work hard to be comfortable. Technology makes it easy to be comfortable. And now that our government is inclined to throw money at everyone whether they work or not, whether they are legal citizens or not, and for any reason from invading viruses to irresponsible debt accumulation to simply "buying votes", there is no reason to maintain a "work ethic". Our people are quite content to sit at home an play X-Box, collecting free government checks. The government decreed China Virus quarantines have exacerbated this problem. The "traditional American" conjures up images of a burly construction worker creating skyscrapers, dams and bridges... pioneering scientists defeating infection and getting us to the moon... inventive souls creating whole industries by growing ideas into industries from cars to telephones to airplanes.

The concept of the "modern American" invokes the image of a lazy individual stuck in front of a big screen and producing little or nothing at all. Boredom makes people restless and unhappy so they whine a lot. With nothing better to do they tear down statues, loot Macy's and burn businesses owned by people that prolong the evil "work ethic". It takes lots of energy to organize a march across a bridge screaming "Dead cops! When do we want them? Now!" and "Fry 'em like bacon!" That energy used to be directed towards providing food, shelter and care for oneself and one's family. With trillion dollar government giveaway programs easing that burden... our energies have been redirected. Ideology and emotionalism has replaced practicality and necessity, We are not an "exhausted empire". If anything, we have more energy than ever. We just have the freedom to pursue the "easier wrong" rather than the "harder right" now.

All that is bad enough. But our enemies have risen from the ashes of WWII and stand waiting, expectantly, for our weakness to peak. I would suggest that with our inability to defend our borders, our disastrous military defeat in Afghanistan, our inability to protect our citizens overseas, our inability to "provide for domestic tranquility", the rising support for criminals and the decreasing support for law and order.. that our enemies won't have long to wait before they decide to grab the brass ring.

 

Well it sounds as if you don't disagree with me.

 

The term Pax Americana is quite misleading. My understanding is that it refers to that period following WWII with the Allied victory and the ensuing US leadership.

Since WWII the US has been at war almost non-stop. Korea, Vietnam, Central and South America, most of the mideast. How can that be called peace? Our Global War Of Terror since 911 is not peace.

 

The term derives, I think, from the Pax Romana of the Roman Empire. During that peace, as well, Rome's legions were nearly constantly at war somewhere on the frontier to maintain peace for everyone else.

 

Central and South America? Oh... that huge tank battle in Honduras... and the sinking of dozens of ships in the Battle of the Chilean Coast? Ok.

 

The Monroe Doctrine

Never Forget!​

B.C. c'est
54'40"

 

A wonderful analysis, except for the final paragraph. Our enemies haven't risen from the ashes. They are here, and have been here since the end of the war slowly degrading and destroying the nation. Study the Red Scares. There was damn good reason to be scared. Slowly they infiltrated every significant institution in the country and have destroyed it from the inside. Politics, Education, Finance, Media, Entertainment, Business etc. No foreign enemy, not Germany, Japan, Russia, or China could do the damage that the Communists/Socialist/Liberals whatever you want to call them have already done.

We really screwed up. We had the chance to crush Communism in 45, but of course Truman and Churchill gave them half of Europe. I wonder who influenced them to do that?

 

Huh? What relevance does the Monroe Doctrine have here? And America grew from east coast to west coast. So what? Try to stay focused and explain what you are saying. Thanks.

 

There is a little more to it than that. For example, consider the events USMC Smedley Butler was involved in. Consider what he said about those things.

Consider what our boys did in Panama, Colombia, Chile and elsewhere. Sweetness and light it was not. Peace building it was not.

 

Wow... I love listening to "experts" whose only experience with war is a Rambo movie. I was in Panama... were you? Chile? What happened in Chile? Bubble wrapped civilians talking about war is akin to a nanny waxing philosophic on how to be an astronaut.

Just an old West Point grad here... Commanded troops in CONUS and USAREUR... served 2 years in Iraq... had a small vacation in Grenada... keep talking about war snowflake... I'm lovin' it. You should stick to what you know... gay rights and transgender issues.

 

And the next time you see a Soldier... walk up to him and call him a "boy" to his face. Let us know when you recover.

 

Everybody's a boy to me, son.

 

There never was a Pax Americana. We never had a true and UNQUESTIONED world hegemony. Almost as soon as we defeated our only real rival in the Cold War we suddenly found ourselves fighting all these "asymmetric" conflicts where the whole idea is that one side is "too big to lose"

And besides, Americans just aren't good at being Imperial. We're pretty good soldiers but shitty conquerors. We give kids chocolate, not rape little girls

 

There certainly was a "Pax Americana". World War II was a war. Millions died. Whole nations were levelled. Then, for years, there were no such conflicts. Oh, a small group of Americans were snatched in Tehran... a small group of Marines grabbed a medical school in Grenada... and a tyrannical drug dealer was deposed in Panama. But millions were not driven from their homes, major cities were not razed, and most submarines just sat and waited. I was an Army Officer in the late 1970's through the 1990's. We sat endlessly around checking dipsticks and trying to keep our bored Soldiers from getting into trouble with drugs. The conflicts that came along after that did not rival battles like Kursk, the Battle of the Bulge, or Stalingrad. The casualties were more reminiscent of Chicago on any given Saturday night.

"Pax Americana" wasn't perfect peace, but relatively speaking, it was definitely a peaceful time.

 

Wow... Does God think He is you?

 

"Unquestioned" sounds an awful lot like "perfect'. Perfection does not exist in this life. But some things come close. Closes is as good as gets in this life. If you want "perfect" or "unquestioned"... you'll have to wait until after you get to the NEXT life.

 

You might not have read the writings of Smedley Butler USMC, so your perspective is limited.

Quite the hero you are, killing muslims after invading their countries under fraud. Don't worry about it troop. I saw the same thing in Vietnam back in 1970. Ah yes, the glories of military aggression against foreign countries!