Russia will stop 'in a moment' if Ukraine meets terms - Kremlin

Current Russian demands for end of hostilities(03-07-2022), probably will not be excepted at the moment. I would expect something of this nature before the end of 6 months to end the conflict.

 

Oddly apropos...

 

We cannot allow Putin to win this war. No country, even nuclear power, should have the ability to redraw borders using military power.
Boris Johnson was absolutely right.

 

Clearly the conflict is not going as Russia hoped so they have come back with proposals to save face. I hope these terms are excepted and I fully understand Russia's point of view in demanding that Ukraine stay neutral. The alternative is the destruction of Ukraine and thousands of deaths on both sides

 

Also curious if that means Donetsk and Lugansk guaranteed entire oblasts. I would assume so.

 

So, let's reason a bit about these "terms": [according to the linked article]

* to change constitution to enshrine neutrality
* acknowledge Crimea as Russian territory
* recognise the separatist republics of Donetsk and Lugansk as independent states.
* And Russians are finishing the "demilitarisation of Ukraine".

Now, actually the first point is the one to be totally beyond the limit of international relationships: how can you impose neutrality to a sovereign country, even requiring a modification of its Constitution?

Territorial changes are not so rare in history and an agreement about them is always possible [but it's not said they are definitive]. Italy has known some of these agreements in its not so long history [meaning the history of the Kingdom and the Republic]. But to change a constitution is a choice that only a sovereign people can make. It would require a referendum and if Ukrainians will vote "NO" no foreign power will be allowed to say a word.

For the rest, if Putin wants to go on holiday in Crimea this summer, it's not a so great deal ...

Obviously, Ukraine will play the card of the autonomous regions, to avoid to divide the country.
But I repeat, territories are not a so great problem. A solution can be found, following common sense. But the matter of neutrality is a well different matter.

 

None of these terms are acceptable. It's a terrorist state making terrorist demands while it brutalizes a peaceful country for no reason.

And Russia created these fake republics through military force leading up to this. This can never be accepted or legitimized.

 

Well, there would be also that solution: territorial integrity for Ukraine and an agreement about the status of the Russians living in it [maybe with the perspective to see them move to the Russian Federation]. I honestly find it difficult to think that after this war Ukrainians and Russians will cohabit without problems.

 

Ha. If the Russians had wanted that, they could have had it years ago, of course, and they could do that now. The whole trouble was stirred up in Crimea and the Donbas precisely to facilitate theft of land and provide a pretext for this invasion.

Putin wants to use force and expend human lives to achieve something he deems great for himself and Russia. There is no negotiating with him in good faith. He lies and manipulates to get what he is after, and he is never openly honest about what he is after.

 

Lol, they also guaranteed Ukrainian independence when they took away the nuclear weapons. Not that Ukraine could actually use them, but still. I wouldn't give Russia an inch if I were Ukrainian. They'll be back in a few years to bite off a little more. Better to bloody their nose now and make them bleed for every mile they take.

 

Russia's terms are essentially a codification of the status quo ante, which suggests the Russians know they can't win. In 6 months the Russians and Ukrainians will likely be negotiating safe passage out of Ukraine for remnant Russian forces.

 

"accepted" not excepted!

 

Ask Japan. Remember when a certain country dropped Nukes on them? And the same country still has military there.

What Russia proposed is very reasonable. It's basically no Ukraine in NATO....and Crimea is undisputed. If the US doesn't like the deal, then that means the US planned to put bases in Ukraine all along....which justifies Russia's action in the first place.

 

What the Russians missed, and still don't grasp, is the Ukrainians' near unanimous willingness to fight and (if necessary) die to defend their country.
Ukrainians are fighting a people’s war — and everyone is involved, from top to bottom
Opinion by Nataliya Gumenyuk

 

That resolve and willingness to fight on is what Russia wants to break with this ongoing destruction, killing and general chaos and terrorism. They just want to force Ukraine into concessions at this point so that they can walk away claiming some kind of victory.

 

I believe it is beginning to dawn on the Russians that they cannot win.

 

This was probably their "plan B" from the beginning if they couldn't get the quick win and topple Zelenskyy's government. I just hope they don't have a plan C.

 

You forgot demilitarized...

Which is like a mugger moving in with you, talking a 1/3 of the house, and keeping a knife at your throat.

Completely reasonable, if you don't believe that Ukrainians should have rights or freedom...

 

The Russians are losing.

• 
  Ukraine success underscores 2 emerging trends in the war

 

Any territorial changes to Ukraine requires a referendum, as per their constitutional law. That change must be approved by the majority of voters from all of Ukraine. Ukrainian president has no authority to make such decisions.

 

I thought Putin was going to de-natzify Ukraine? Now he only wants crimea and Donbas? So basically Putin is a liar and we shouldn't trust what he says.

 

Screw Russia

 

Oh, so now you want to get all constitutional and stuff. They took a fat dump on their Constitution in 2014 when they illegally removed the democratically elected President so they can do it again. Speaking of voting, the Ukrainian Constitution says all citizens are allowed to vote but that hasn't happened since 2014, so cry me a river.

 

If that democratically elected president had not had protesters fired on and beaten, he might not have been deposed.

 

Ex-Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko: We've seen Russia kill civilians with our own eyes

Ex-Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko tells CNN he believes Russian forces are purposely targeting civilians and says his battalion witnessed a family killed while they were evacuating.​