Anti-vaxxers crumble as every prediction fails to come true

Sigh. Just off topic repetition. You are not the arbitrator of what is evidence. Period.

 

LOL. You picked every topic.

No, I’m not the arbiter. That’s why I’ve presented the definitions of “opinion” and “evidence”.

You have admitted you decide whether or not to believe a thing based purely on preconceived bias. That’s really all we need to know. I’ve shown your opinions conflict with known evidence.

Are you the arbiter of what constitutes evidence?

 

Just off topic repetition. You are not the arbitrator of what is opinion or evidence. You deceptively keep making claims of what I "admit". YOU are not a "WE".

 

I’ve never claimed to be the arbiter of what constitutes evidence. You telling me I’m not the arbiter is fallacious because I’ve never claimed to be the arbiter.

I’ve not been deceptive. You openly admit to deciding whether to believe something or not based on preconceived bias.

If we decide something based on how we perceive the messenger of that thing, that IS BIAS. What you “think” is BIAS.

Again, this is a public forum and you are engaging multiple posters on this issue. As a forum, “we” have learned you make decisions about what you believe on preconceived bias. You posted that here for “us” to see. It’s a permanent record on PF. No sense trying to deny it now….


When you were in middle school and a teacher introduced some knowledge you were previously unaware of, and provided evidence it was accurate, did you put the wrong answer on the test and use the excuse “the teacher is not the arbiter of what evidence is” to protest the red marks that resulted? I’m just the educator here. Providing evidence for things you don’t know.

 

Is this misinformation? Please read this post gets deleted.
https://x.com/lawrie_dr/status/1763258047672078508?s=61&t=D-EWq7-iy4JmgRu_bLfR3Q

 

The quotes are in the links I provided. Sorry I didn’t make that clear.

Trump did much more than just eff up in comparison to Dr Fauci and the CDC.

The problem is when people call Fauci a liar with all sorts of fake claims about him and at the same time treat Trump like some kind of deity even though he is a chronic liar — that is glaring hypocrisy.

Fauci and the CDC didn’t lie, they basically got things wrong and corrected what they got wrong as knowledge of the virus increased. Trump outright lied and his pandemic lies cost people their lives.

By his own admission, he was told of the dangers of the virus but despite this he intentionally misled Americans about the risk and intentionally compared it to the seasonal flu — https://www.factcheck.org/2020/09/trumps-deceptive-comparison-of-the-coronavirus-to-the-flu/

On January 30th, 2020, a memo to Trump from his trade advisor said:

"The lack of immune protection or an existing cure or vaccine would leave Americans defenseless in the case of a full-blown coronavirus outbreak on US soil,...This lack of protection elevates the risk of the coronavirus evolving into a full-blown pandemic, imperiling the lives of millions of Americans.”

He said it would be gone by the spring — https://www.factcheck.org/2020/02/will-the-new-coronavirus-go-away-in-april/

And he told many more lies — https://americanjournalnews.com/don...lies-white-house-briefings-pandemic-covid-19/

Fauci initially advised people not to wear masks very early in the pandemic. It wasn’t clear at that point how contagious the virus was nor how it spread. At the time, nobody was aware that up to 45% of people were asymptomatic and large numbers were getting infected from people who had no symptoms. When this was known, Fauci advised people to wear masks. When a scientist gets something wrong because scientific knowledge is insufficient, it’s not lying when new knowledge replaces older knowledge and directives are altered. It is lying to suggest that the virus was similar to the flu or that it would be gone by the spring etc as Trump claimed.

Fauci often said that directives could change as more was learned.

As far as the BS about Fauci causing the Pandemic because he funded research in Wuhan that was supposedly weaponizing the coronavirus with gain of function research. That is a lie. He said funding was provided but it wasn’t for gain of function research. Yet, this is repeated over and over to take the spotlight of the real liar — Trump.

As a bioweapon, coronavirus wouldn’t be the choice to inflict damage onto the world. Ebola has a mortality rate of 50 - 90 percent and any bioengineering of Ebola could make it extremely dangerous. Why would the Chinese engineer a coronavirus to have a one percent mortality rate of mostly old people and people with chronic illnesses? Why would the Chinese engineer a virus that mutated rapidly into something less deadly? Why on earth would Fauci as well as others (it wasn’t him alone) in the US government provide funding for gain of function research which would end up killing Americans eventually. At the end of the day, Rand Paul and his asinine assertions are nothing more than manufactured lies to take the spotlight off Trump and is mishandling of the pandemic situation which caused over a million deaths in the USA.

Blaming Fauci, pointing the finger at the Chinese does the job of diverting the spotlight from Trump’s idiotic, meandering, and chaotic response to the pandemic. Anything to take the direct attention off Trumps deliberate lies to the American public.

 

Yet you are stating what is and what isn't information and evidence!

There, a lie. NOWHERE have I said anything of the sort! There is absolutely no bas at all in stating that somebody, when making themselves look a fool, is unlikely to be lying when they do so!

That's just complete nonsense.

Noise, yet again.

 

I’ve attempted to educate you on the difference between unsubstantiated opinions and evidence. That difference can be ascertained by looking at EVIDENCE in the form of formal definitions I’ve provided. I’m not the arbiter.

Cats are not dogs. I can educate you on differences between the two species. But I’m not the arbiter of what is a cat and what is a dog. Same with opinion and evidence. I’m simply educating you on the difference.

A lie? You posted this.

That’s textbook bias.

No, it’s an apt description of what bias is. Your response is appeal to the stone fallacy. Look it up.

It’s education to help posters create content that is fact based, not based on unsubstantiated opinions.

 

Noise, off topic. Do try to move on, nobody cares.

Yet you deliberately missed out context which shows no bias at all, just logic. Go look it up!

 

I see. Yes there were Trump quotes in the cites. If you had followed PF rules instead of simply posting links without pull quotes or comment directing readers to specific content in the links that would have been avoided. That’s a rule for a reason.

Still your cites did not support the claim I’ve been addressing from the other poster that Trump disregarded all advice from Fauci etal. And evidence from your cites conflicts with your premises on travel restrictions from the Trump administration.

Fauci and the CDC told many intentional lies. Most people aren’t well versed enough in virology or epidemiology to spot them.

Well, I obviously don’t treat Trump like a deity. And EVERY criticism I’ve made of Fauci and the CDC I’ve backed up with irrefutable evidence.

Don’t you think advising people to NOT use N95 masks when they were readily available cost lives? Or are you of the opinion N95 masks don’t have the ability to save lives?

Since my whole posting history on the last few pages is based on the premise Trump isn’t trustworthy, I’m not sure why you are preaching to me. I’m in the choir.

I just happen to know enough about epidemiology and virology to understand Fauci and the CDC told lies as well.

Well, it was clear to epidemiologists other than Fauci. Japanese epidemiologists were figuring it out a month before Fauci went in 60 Minutes and advised against masks on March 8.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7156812/

The Japanese could see transmission in pre-symptomatic and asymptomatic cases was a problem. They took concrete measures in February based on this information. It took 2 more months for Fauci to change his “position” on pre and asymptomatic spread.

South Korean epidemiologists were working with government, subsidizing and rationing N95 equivalent masks in February of 2020 before Fauci recommended against masks on March 8.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/01/opinion/covid-face-mask-shortage.html

By March SK was increasing assistance to its citizens because it was clear quality masks were a viable mitigation.

Either Fauci was a dolt, or he was lying because epidemiologists around the world were relying on solid evidence to recommend and supply masks to their citizens months before Fauci made his anti mask comments.

When Fauci was asked about masks in July of 2020 he said this.

https://www.instyle.com/news/dr-fauci-says-with-all-due-modesty-i-think-im-pretty-effective

We’ve already seen epidemiologists around the world knew masks were a viable mitigation and that pre and asymptomatic transmission was a factor.

But let’s look at Fauci’s July 2020 statement closer. He claimed changing his mind to recommending masks involved discovering cloth and homemade masks were as good as medical grade masks. Obviously this is false. First, there was never any evidence for this. Second there was evidence to the contrary. Third, if cloth masks were as effective as medical grade masks, public health officials wouldn’t have said we needed to prioritize N95 type masks for healthcare workers. Workers could have just used cloth masks.

Also, he lied that PPE was sufficient when he finally recommended masking. Quality masks were still in short supply then. It’s why he and the CDC said they should be saved for healthcare workers. His statements are contradictory.

Masks (domestic production NIOSH certified N95) would become widely available to anyone who wanted them by January 2021, but in July of 2020, March of 2020, and April of 2020 there was a shortage.

So, to recap, Fauci claimed asymptotic transmission wasn’t known in March of 2020. This was false. The Japanese were basing policy on asymptomatic transmission a month earlier. Fauci claimed in July 2020 cloth masks were equivalent of N95 type medical grade masks being saved for healthcare workers. This was false. There was never any evidence for this. And if it were true, healthcare workers wouldn’t have taken priority over citizens, they could have just work homemade masks. Finally, anyone who knows virology knows the overwhelming majority of respiratory viruses transmit asymptomatically. The only common exception being smallpox (that’s how smallpox was eradicated). It would be gross negligence to assume a novel coronavirus wouldn’t transmit pre and asymptomatically.

Knowledge did not change between March 8 and early April when masks were finally recommended. Other countries were on record acting on knowledge Fauci claimed didn’t exist.

Both are “real” liars. They both made statements that are known not to be supported by evidence. I have no real interest in the gain of function debate. It’s semantics.

The worst lie about masks was the lie that there was a shortage of N95 masks here in the US after January 2021. In fact there was such a surplus that couldn’t be sold, manufacturers were facing bankruptcy sitting on hundreds of millions of certified masks on their warehouse shelves. The CDC told people not to use them until finally relenting in September of 2021. For 9-10 months thd CDC and Fauci etal. told Americans not to buy N95 masks because there was a shortage. This was a lie. I’ve posted voluminously on the subject, even helping people find places to purchase masks in February 2021 because the CDC was still preventing their sale at online retailers like Amazon and telling people there was a shortage (a lie). Here’s an example.

To be clear, I’m not saying the virus is engineered or released intentionally. But it’s not illogical to see it as a bio weapon. China has a problem with an expanding elderly population sucking up national resources.

It’s illogical to want to kill 90% of the population. China depends on us to consume their products. Covid made us more reliant on them.

Again, I’m not arguing the virus is a weapon. Just pointing out it makes sense as an economic weapon.

Well China has a bad record on infectious diseases. Could just be bad luck. The last outbreaks of SARS1 were “lab accidents” in China.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7096887/

A majority of pandemics through history seem to have originated in China.

It is what it is. But I really don’t care. It’s unfortunate but I’m no China hater over it.

Hope this clears things up. Anything you want further evidence on I can supply.

There is more content on the lies told here in this thread.

http://www.politicalforum.com/index.php?posts/1074651197/

Posts #248, 249, 250 in this thread. Don’t feel like reposting.

 

Is this misinformation? Please read asap before it’s deleted.
https://x.com/jimmy_dore/status/1763625590786286069?s=61&t=D-EWq7-iy4JmgRu_bLfR3Q

 

I dare you to watch this…
https://x.com/stkirsch/status/1763439744338596042?s=61&t=D-EWq7-iy4JmgRu_bLfR3Q

 

Hahahahahahahaha…

 

Don't you ever bother checking things?
Nutrients | Free Full-Text | Preventive Vitamin D Supplementation and Risk for COVID-19 Infection: A Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis (mdpi.com)
"In terms of the severity of COVID-19, it has been observed that individuals receiving vitamin D supplementation exhibit a lower incidence of serious complications and a reduced requirement for intensive care, while no difference was noted in terms of overall mortality. It is therefore conceivable, though not yet demonstrable, that vitamin D supplementation may play a role in reducing the occurrence and complications of the pathology. However, it should be noted that the initial benefit may not be substantiated in individuals who still develop the pathology. Nonetheless, this conclusion is drawn from a small number of studies, and for this reason we believe it is useful to carry out further studies and measurements before being able to make concrete hypotheses."

"The only RCT evaluating vitamin D supplementation prior to COVID-19 infection and subsequent mortality was performed on 66 participants. People receiving vitamin D (in this case, a single bolus of 80,000 IU) had significantly lower mortality after adjustment for all potential confounders. No other covariables were associated with mortality (OR 0.163, 95% IC 0.0.32–0.832)."

 

Right then if you want to get all school marmish about the rules, try following the one related to not posting misinformation.

 

LOL. I posted no misinformation! I’ve been correcting YOUR misinformation!

Everything I post is supported by irrefutable evidence. Evidenced by the fact your post to me here is void of evidence and contains pure fallacy. If I posted misinformation it could be shown to be misinformation. You wouldn’t have to respond with fallacy, but could provide evidence my posts are inaccurate.

Well, we add your posts to the “science denier” side of the ledger! Check.

 

False equivalence fallacy. You aren't a teacher. You are the equivalent of another pupil yelling your opinion in my ear when I am studying another subject, then continuing doing so, over and over again.

I need no education from you, you are not providing anything worthwhile except off-topic noise.

Off topic baiting and once again YOU are not a "WE".

It would be but that's called the strawman fallacy. Nowhere have I done that and you continue to create disruption to this thread accordingly by goading and baiting people.

It is 100% logical to base acceptance of a statement when it implicates the person saying it - Trump - as an incompetent jackass. Your inability to understand this totally obvious thing is your problem You seem unable to move on from this bullshit off-topic derailing,

 

Only in your own mind.

 

Well, I’m here imparting knowledge you and others lack. I’ve been paid by tertiary educational institutions to instruct on biological sciences. I don’t know what definition of teacher you’ve made up but I’m definitely instructing you and others on epidemiology and virology. You can choose to be a student, or not, but my choice is to teach.

I’m providing information on epidemiology and virology you and others are unaware of. It’s ok if you don’t want to learn.

Fallacy. Never claimed to personally be a we. I speak for those of us on PF and outside PF who desire the general public to have a better understanding of public health so in the future less people die and are permanently injured from viral diseases and pandemics in general.

Directly quoting YOU and responding to that quote is not strawman fallacy. Quite the opposite.

This is bias as well as a formal LOGICAL FALLACY known as genetic fallacy. I already explained that to you.

No. That’s a logical fallacy. The opposite of logic.

Sorry. I don’t engage in using logical fallacy to justify bias. That’s your department.

 

No. None of it from my mind. All from documented government records, peer reviewed studies, and on the record statements by Fauci himself.

You have posted a lot of unsubstantiated opinions. Everything I’ve posted is supported by verifiable evidence. It’s irrefutability is evidenced by the fact all you have to post in response is ad hominem fallacy.

 

Okay then, in your own mind derived from your own opinion that you know everything. You might believe you are imparting knowledge but you are imparting an opinion and finding cherry picked information to support your opinion. Perhaps, you just can’t see that you might actually not be in the possession of irrefutable evidence. It’s pointless to discuss anything with people such as yourself, so off on ignore you go. You have taken this thread way off topic with irrelevant points and you act like you are in sole possession of the truth. You are combative and come across as really unpleasant so not somebody I want to spend my time on.

 

I accept your concession that your incorrect opinions are refuted by the evidence I’ve provided. I accept your concession that you can not refute any of the evidence I’ve provided.

Your accusation of cherry picking is classic. If I was cherry picking there would be massive volumes of available evidence that conflicts with what I’ve posted. Since you can’t find any such evidence you have resorted to ad hominem fallacy. This demonstrates your accusations of cherry picking are not based on evidence, but are purely fallacious.

I accept the concession that ignoring evidence that can’t be refuted is ignored by those who deny science.

Thanks for the dialogue. It’s been interesting.

 

I will move on when the misinformation and disinformation in your posts has been sufficiently addressed.

You care enough to keep replying. Others care enough to follow the conversation. I care about correct information being available on PF. Are you saying we are all nobody?

Everything I’ve posted addresses YOYR topics directly.

What you refer to as logic is a formal logical fallacy referred to as genetic fallacy.

 

All my content has been in direct response to YOUR content. If it’s off topic, you took it there, not me. If you don’t want YOUR content addressed I suggest not putting it on a public forum that encourages debate.

Continued ad hominem fallacy content of your posts duly noted.

 

No concessions have been given to you whatsoever! That is a very deceptive thing to do.