Santorum on Israeli settlements - 'There is no Palestine'

MYTH ALERT!!! MYTH ALERT!!! MYTH ALERT!!!
The war by the Arab nations only started on 15th May 1948.
By that time 70% of the Palestinians in what was to later become Israel, had already been forced to abandoned their settlements by actions related to the Israeli/Zionist military and terrorist organisations.

If you want to debate the validity of my statement, please issue a rebuttal.
Need to know your history Meneer. Onkunde is geen verontschuldiging.

 

In the aftermath of the adoption of the United Nations' partition plan, the manifestations of joy of the Jewish community were counterbalanced by protests by Arabs throughout the country and after 1 December, the Arab Higher Committee enacted a general strike that lasted three days.

A 'wind of violence' rapidly took hold of the country, foreboding civil war between the two communities

According to Benny Morris, much of the fighting in the first months of the war took place in and on the edges of the main towns, and was initiated by the Arabs. It included Arab snipers firing at Jewish houses, pedestrians, and traffic, as well as planting bombs and mines along urban and rural paths and roads. Morris also says that by the end of March 1948, the Yishuv had suffered about a thousand dead

The first casualties of the war were passengers on a Jewish bus driving on the Coastal Plain near Kfar Sirkin at 8:20 on 30 November. An eight-man gang from Jaffa, led by Seif al-Din Abu Kishk, ambushed the bus killing five and wounding others. Half an hour later they ambushed a second bus, southbound from Hadera, killing two more. Later that morning, Arab snipers began to fire from Jaffa's Manshiya neighbourhood into southern Tel Aviv, killing at least one person. Shots were also fired at Jewish buses in Jerusalem and Haifa

On 22 February 1948, supporters of Mohammad Amin al-Husayni organised, with the help of certain British deserters, three attacks against the Jewish community. Using car bombs aimed at the headquarters of the pro-Zionist Palestine Post, the Ben Yehuda St. market and the backyard of the Jewish Agency's offices, they killed 22, 53 and 13 Jewish people respectively, and injured hundreds

While the Jewish population had received strict orders requiring them to hold their ground everywhere at all costs, the Arab population was more affected by the general conditions of insecurity to which the country was exposed. Up to 100,000 Arabs, from the urban upper and middle classes in Haifa, Jaffa and Jerusalem, or Jewish-dominated areas, evacuated abroad or to Arab centres eastwards

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1947–1948_Civil_War_in_Mandatory_Palestine

Need to know your history indeed, sweety.

 

Oh but we do; 'Irgun and Lehi followed a strategy of placing bombs in crowded markets and bus stops...' (From later in your source) Does that sound like terrorism to you? Sweety.

 

Sure does. There was a civil war, it was started by the Arabs, at every step of the way it was escalated by the arabs, the attacks on civilians were started by the Arabs, at some point of time they nearly succeeded in starving the entire civilian jewish population of Jerusalem to death. Jews had nowhere to run, the Arabs did so they ran from the war that they started. Cry me a river about Jews fighting back and not letting the second Holocaust in less than 10 years to occur.

 

Pure fantasy.

 

The Holocaust is not an excuse or justification to hate or murder Semites. The sooner Israel realizes this, the better for everyone. You seem to rely far to heavily on Holocaust misuse and abuse in defense of racism, and far to little on facts and logic to defened your position.

 

' Creative ' is their preferred term.

http://www.politicalforum.com/lates...iv-named-one-worlds-most-creative-cities.html

 

I've already posted elsewhere the man is an idiot, he's gone unnoticed until now because no sane person believed he had any chance of winning the republican nomination let alone defeating Obama...he's as dumb as a post/Palin but Palin was running for VP so her stupidity quickly came into focus...

 

What sane person promotes ' representative democracy ' when it frequently elects an idiot ?

 

WE do indeed The Bo-Rat like most of his ilk is in denial, + carefully taught to DENY - DENY + LIE .
He mentions Benny Morris BUT FAIL (perhaps deliberately ) to post Morris precise words which I learnt from Jews for Justice in the Middle East.

Ethnic Cleaning


“Following the outbreak of 1936, no mainstream (Zionist) leader was able to conceive of future coexistence without a clear physical separation between the two peoples — achievable only by transfer and expulsion. Publicly they all continued to speak of coexistence and to attribute the violence to a small minority of zealots and agitators. But this was merely a public pose..Ben Gurion summed up: ‘With compulsory transfer we (would) have a vast area (for settlement)...I support compulsory transfer. I don’t see anything immoral in it,’” Israel historian, Benny Morris, “Righteous Victims.”

Ethnic cleansing — continued


“Ben-Gurion clearly wanted as few Arabs as possible to remain in the Jewish state. He hoped to see them flee. He said as much to his colleagues and aides in meetings in August, September and October [1948]. But no [general] expulsion policy was ever enunciated and Ben-Gurion always refrained from issuing clear or written expulsion orders; he preferred that his generals ‘understand’ what he wanted done. He wished to avoid going down in history as the ‘great expeller’ and he did not want the Israeli government to be implicated in a morally questionable policy...But while there was no ‘expulsion policy’, the July and October [1948] offensives were characterized by far more expulsions and, indeed, brutality towards Arab civilians than the first half of the war.” Benny Morris, “The Birth of the Palestinian Refugee Problem, 1947-1949”

Didn’t the Palestinians leave their homes voluntarily during the 1948 war?

“Israeli propaganda has largely relinquished the claim that the Palestinian exodus of 1948 was ‘self-inspired’. Official circles implicitly concede that the Arab population fled as a result of Israeli action — whether directly, as in the case of Lydda and Ramleh, or indirectly, due to the panic that and similar actions (the Deir Yassin massacre) inspired in Arab population centers throughout Palestine.

However, even though the historical record has been grudgingly set straight, the Israeli establishment still refused to accept moral or political responsibility for the refugee problem it — or its predecessors — actively created.” Peretz Kidron, quoted in “Blaming the Victims,” ed. Said and Hitchens.

---

btw - Benny Morris' life was made unbearable hell and the poor sad man was later forced to grovel + recant some of his earlier writings in order to continue earning a living - anywhere.

...

 

American electorate always get the clown's they deserve.


......

 

Borat is dodging the real question. Regardless of how all those Palestinian (sorry, Arab) refugees were generated, what is true is that Israel passed a series of laws forbidding them from returning to their land and giving Israel the right to "buy" the land and sell/give it to Jewish settlers. How many of those refugees would have returned once the war was over IF THEY HAD BEEN ALLOWED TO BY ISRAEL!?
Explain that bit of history away, Borat.

 

What does that mean? Whether a Palestinian identity existed in 1948 is entirely irrelevant. There was no German identity in 1848, and yet now there is. Do you deny that Germany exists, since in 1848 there was no Germany? Unthinking supporters of Israel amuse me and disgust me simultaneously.


PS. It is a competition in the Republican party about who can say they most ignorant, inflammatory, simplistic things possible. Nuance and intelligent thought is seemingly banned. If a person says something even slightly nuanced or thoughtful, they are branded a rino!!

 

You think Americans ought to pay to have children murdered then? How does that fit with the enslaving-women-to-encourage-back-street-abortion drivel then?

 

Like the ever do? They are are Israel first, boot lickers.

 

Utter Rubbish - Zionist Jews are not descended from Judeans or Samarians - they are bi-products of Khazar/Slav/Hungarian - central european goulash ..


.....

 

No I'm sayng your a hypocrite. If the Palestinians had won you would've been dancing in the streets saying bye bye to the hated Israelites. Instead Israel won and you hypocritically are pissed that they did the same to the Palestinians that would've been done to them had things been different. The fact is Israel was nicer to the Palestinians than the Palestinians would've been to Israel had they won.

 

Lol...Comedy gold.

 

That is actually very misleading. Everybody knew what would happen after the partition. Arab officials warn that they would refuse to recognize the resolution, and take whatever measures necessary. Although, you do realize that ‘one attack’ did not just start the war. Palestine was a land of violent strife when the resolution was taken up by the UN already. The partition resolution resulted into demonstrations and a general strike by the Palestine Arabs, while celebrations from the Jews, that is true. Although, in Jerusalem, Haifa, Tel Aviv, Jaffa, and similar areas where Arabs and Jews lived in close proximity, fighting between the two communities broke out. This then spread and become more serious with time. Charges and countercharges developed, with each side blaming the other for precipitating the disorders and each side accusing the British of helping its opponent. The chaos that ensued was ideal for extremists in both sides, who were frequently able to take law into their own hands during the disorders. The British generally tried to maintain order in the territories but they were not always successful. In fact, both Arabs and Jews attempted to seize control of the areas being vacated in stages by British troops as a result of a British decision to evacuate Palestine completely by May 15, 1948, armed clashes between opposing sides were inevitable. Outrages were committed by both Arabs and Jews. Between December 1, 1947, and February 1, 1948, according to a UN report there were 2,788 casualties, including 1,462 Arabs, and 1,106 Jews – more Arabs than Jews were killed in these disorders, just pointing that out. Your making this look one-sided.

The Zionist organizations at the time were committing many organized attacks against Palestinians throughout the years leading to the partition, as well as right after the partition all throughout December killing many Palestinians – this only continued the next several of months. Extremist groups like Irgun for example opposed the partition plan making statements like: “the partition of the Homeland” was “illegal” and would “never be recognized… Eretz Israel will be restored to the people of Israel. All of it. And forever.” The Jewish Agency where trying to make sure this win at the UN wouldn’t be lost. Even before the resolution they had mobilized their manpower. The Haganah began (before the resolution) to be converted from an underground force into a regular army, and its units were deployed along the Syrian frontier where the Arab military threat appeared to be the greatest. The Jewish Agency even tried to allow all possible efforts to increase Jewish immigration, legally and illegally, because more Jews in Palestine meant more military manpower. They recruited mostly younger refugees who would be useful for a war. They started strategic areas to prepare themselves for taking over and running their hoped-for state. Jews in and out were making preparations. As Ben-Gurion confirmed, Zionist preparations for this already had begun in 1945, although they already had village statistics of every single village in Palestine since 1940, and everything about it – including how to destroy/invade it. And they even got weapon arms deals right before the war started. You seriously think the Jews didn’t know violence would break out? Once the resolution passed, the United Nations actually became a bit worried on how to implement it. Many times they decided to just drop the idea and USA support for the partition even became very weak. The Zionists were afraid they would lose their win, and so they started to go on the offensive, as early as December 1 when they launched operation Gimmel (although at this point the UN were determined to impediment the plan it was only after the riots etc they had second thoughts) which was to occupy strategic points. During December of 1947 they carried out several attacks, although, by the first month of 1948 – January 1948 – things began to really get bad and most historians look this as the period that they seriously started to attempt to take all the parts of the designated Jewish State, but also all the land they could from the designated Arab State.

At this point there were no Arab or Palestinians fighters, just a bunch of irregulars. The Arab League formed the ALA whom were weaker in manpower, weaponry, and training compared to the Haganah. They were just irregulars who were recruited. Before May 15 - during the end of the British Mandate - about 213 Palestinian towns and villages were cleansed before the outbreak of the war that began on May 15, 1948. That is about 413,794 inhabitants, or 52% of the Palestinian refugees before May 15. May 15 is finally the date the surrounding nations decided to help, but it was evidently much too late.

How would you know that I'd take sides like that? I wasn't even alive during 1967! The fact is that what your saying never happened! So, I was debating what DID happen, and your getting angry about it? Did you want Israel to be destroyed or something?

 

tsk tsk...everytime I see a thread about was is and isnt' "Israeli land" I wanna puke.

hopefully one day the world will wake up from this Zionist agenda nightmare and realize that the Psycho Jew-ish people are perpetuating the greatest evil upon the face of the earth. but yet wish to drown out the truth with cries of "No Fair"...boo hooo Israelis'...you brought this never ending massacre upon yourselves. only a few people in the world know the truth of the so-called "Jews" of today (Synagoue of Satan)

Now if you wanna fix the mess, STOP LYING and REPENT OF YOUR SINS against the world!!!!

 

The zionists are not Jewish - they are a nazi-defined 'race' of murderers occupying somebody else's country, with some (ill-instructed) Jews also present in it. The zionists are simply nazi filth who hate the humean race. Jews they are not.

 

Right, but they hide under the guise of "Jew" to win sympathy around the world.

you are correct. they are mostly Nazi's posing as Jews.

which is another reason why Zbigniew Brzenzski(Nazi) is so ivolved with our foreign policy affairs. and he's not even a Politician. go figure.

 

That is actually very misleading. Everybody knew what would happen after the partition. Arab officials warn that they would refuse to recognize the resolution, and take whatever measures necessary. Although, you do realize that ‘one attack’ did not just start the war. Palestine was a land of violent strife when the resolution was taken up by the UN already. The partition resolution resulted into demonstrations and a general strike by the Palestine Arabs, while celebrations from the Jews, that is true. Although, in Jerusalem, Haifa, Tel Aviv, Jaffa, and similar areas where Arabs and Jews lived in close proximity, fighting between the two communities broke out. This then spread and become more serious with time. Charges and countercharges developed, with each side blaming the other for precipitating the disorders and each side accusing the British of helping its opponent. The chaos that ensued was ideal for extremists in both sides, who were frequently able to take law into their own hands during the disorders. The British generally tried to maintain order in the territories but they were not always successful. In fact, both Arabs and Jews attempted to seize control of the areas being vacated in stages by British troops as a result of a British decision to evacuate Palestine completely by May 15, 1948, armed clashes between opposing sides were inevitable. Outrages were committed by both Arabs and Jews. Between December 1, 1947, and February 1, 1948, according to a UN report there were 2,788 casualties, including 1,462 Arabs, and 1,106 Jews – more Arabs than Jews were killed in these disorders, just pointing that out. Your making this look one-sided.

The Zionist organizations at the time were committing many organized attacks against Palestinians throughout the years leading to the partition, as well as right after the partition all throughout December killing many Palestinians – this only continued the next several of months. Extremist groups like Irgun for example opposed the partition plan making statements like: “the partition of the Homeland” was “illegal” and would “never be recognized… Eretz Israel will be restored to the people of Israel. All of it. And forever.” The Jewish Agency where trying to make sure this win at the UN wouldn’t be lost. Even before the resolution they had mobilized their manpower. The Haganah began (before the resolution) to be converted from an underground force into a regular army, and its units were deployed along the Syrian frontier where the Arab military threat appeared to be the greatest. The Jewish Agency even tried to allow all possible efforts to increase Jewish immigration, legally and illegally, because more Jews in Palestine meant more military manpower. They recruited mostly younger refugees who would be useful for a war. They started strategic areas to prepare themselves for taking over and running their hoped-for state. Jews in and out were making preparations. As Ben-Gurion confirmed, Zionist preparations for this already had begun in 1945, although they already had village statistics of every single village in Palestine since 1940, and everything about it – including how to destroy/invade it. And they even got weapon arms deals right before the war started. You seriously think the Jews didn’t know violence would break out? Once the resolution passed, the United Nations actually became a bit worried on how to implement it. Many times they decided to just drop the idea and USA support for the partition even became very weak. The Zionists were afraid they would lose their win, and so they started to go on the offensive, as early as December 1 when they launched operation Gimmel (although at this point the UN were determined to impediment the plan it was only after the riots etc they had second thoughts) which was to occupy strategic points. During December of 1947 they carried out several attacks, although, by the first month of 1948 – January 1948 – things began to really get bad and most historians look this as the period that they seriously started to attempt to take all the parts of the designated Jewish State, but also all the land they could from the designated Arab State.

At this point there were no Arab or Palestinians fighters, just a bunch of irregulars. The Arab League formed the ALA whom were weaker in manpower, weaponry, and training compared to the Haganah. They were just irregulars who were recruited. Before May 15 - during the end of the British Mandate - about 213 Palestinian towns and villages were cleansed before the outbreak of the war that began on May 15, 1948. That is about 413,794 inhabitants, or 52% of the Palestinian refugees before May 15. May 15 is finally the date the surrounding nations decided to help, but it was evidently much too late.

How would you know that I'd take sides like that? I wasn't even alive during 1967! The fact is that what your saying never happened! So, I was debating what DID happen, and your getting angry about it? Did you want Israel to be destroyed or something?

 

Does that mean that you agree with my post, because, as shown above in red, you provided nothing in rebuttal. Were the majority of Palestinian Arab settlements in what was to become Israel already depopulated BEFORE the Arabs declared war on 15th May 1948? Yes, or no? Simple. I await your PROOF that I was wrong.

Because you see .... Sweetie .... you can bet your bum that I know my oats about that period.