How many more years in Afghanistan ... and for what ?

They do not want to get rid of the terrorists. What then would justify the Trillion dollar annual Total Military Spend ? The Establishment needs an enemy.

 

i am aware.

 

Of course they were involved. They gave al Qaeda a homeland.

 

How ridiculous.

 

I see you have bought the complete propaganda package but ignored the factual aspects of it. I'm sure that is appreciated in Washington; they couldn't ask for more.

 

No, I'm talking as a former soldier, not a bitter anti-establishment fake rocking chair general.

 

Agreed ... the the raging masses are ridiculously ignorant.

 

2 fallacies in one sentence !
"I was a soldier" is not an argument for anything and nor is your adhom attack. A soldier's job is to follow orders without question.

 

They have at least 3 trillion bucks of resources in the ground. Our banking cabal and MNCs gotta have it. But we are an oligarchy and our gov't works for these elites. This is foundational to our foreign policy.

The heroin epidemic in the US is supplied by Afghanistan. The Taliban had shut down the poppy farming. We fixed that and now they grow poppies with either US troops or private contractors guarding the fields.

 

I had a soldier who was stationed in Afghanistan tell me that this was going on ... guarding the poppy fields.

Regardless - after 16 years the Opium crops are thriving.

 

I'm a former soldier too- Vietnam era. I fail to see where the sacrifice of 58,000 lives of our soldiers and a monumental amount of damage to others accomplished anything at all- and fail to see Afghanistan as any different. It's not enough to categorize people as "bad guys" to decide you must kill or conquer them- especially when you go to their country to do it.
There are a hell of a lot of people who see Americans as "bad guys" too. Before we go around correcting the conduct of the rest of the world in situations like these, we desperately need to clean up our own act, and become a nation that deserves respect for it's policies and conduct. I don't know how long we have failed to do that, but certainly it was common practice long before you and I were born- just look at the way we have treated the Indians we stole the country from, and the list of broken treaties and promises.

If I'm going to put my life on the line for my country- I want it to be at risk for a valid cause, not a political game. I don't want others shooting at me because I represent a government whose word is lip service and whose goals are dishonorable, despite the claims of honorable motives. I'd like to be proud of the substance of who we are- not the BS and false image politicians promote. Soldiers aren't creating that, politicians and leaders are. Look into the "Pentagon papers" that Daniel Ellsburg released- and see if you can keep keep believing the illusion after reading the facts. You can't be honorable on occasions and something else behind the scenes, and still be honorable.

 

Cut your hair, remove the 8 track player from your car, and get over it.

 

Sorry. never had long hair. But I'd vote to send your children (just yours) to Afghanistan to save the world from- whomever it is the politicians want to kill today.

This is not about anti-war, it is about anti-stupidity, lack of real purpose or possibility of actually producing a beneficial result. Only idiots go to war for less.

 

Stupidity would be leaving Afghanistan to again become a homeland for al Qaeda, ISIS, or who ever else is the terrorist organization of the day.

"But I'd vote to send your children (just yours) to Afghanistan" That's the kind of comment I'd expect from an Era vet that didn't actually go to Vietnam.

 

But you miss the point. IF you go to war with another country and conduct operations as we did in Vietnam and so far have done in the mideast- we haven't eliminated those terrorists, at all, but we most certainly have given the non-terrorist populations of those countries reasons to hate us- reasons to endorse the terrorists.

Iraq for example. There, we "won", sort of. We captured the evil dictator and hung him. Now unless you think we should take over the nation and make it our territory- sometime, it has to be over. Iraq quickly went to hell after our "victory", while in fact Vietnam has rebuilt and is doing well after our defeat. We seem to have very vague objectives, very ambiguous motives and methods- and so far, the best results are in the nation that ran us out.

If a war is deemed necessary- and it shouldn't be without very clear cause and motive and all other means exhausted- then there should be no half-assed effort. Do the job or don't try- all half-assed wars do is kill people on both sides and make enemies. Dying for nothing is a stupid sacrifice.

 

???

No they did not.

 

"Save havens" (vulnerable and sympathetic areas, in reality) for terrorists cropping up elsewhere in no way negate our stated purpose for being in Afghanistan.

 

Bin Laden returned to Afghanistan in the mid 90s, befriended Mullah Omar the chief mucky muck of the Taliban, began working with Pakistanis who backed the Taliban so he could expand an area under his control in Afghanistan to train future terrorists.

And the relationship continued:

Bin Laden files show al-Qaida and Taliban leaders in close contact
Blow to Afghan peace hopes as documents reveal Bin Laden, Zawahiri and Omar discussed joint operations against Nato



Osama bin Laden and Ayman al-Zawahiri, who were in close contact with Taliban leader Mullah Omar at the time of Bin Laden's death. This article is 5 years old
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Jason Burke

Sunday 29 April 2012 13.24 EDT

Documents found in the house where Osama bin Laden was killed a year ago show a close working relationship between top al-Qaida leaders and Mullah Omar, the overall commander of the Taliban, including frequent discussions of joint operations against Nato forces in Afghanistan, the Afghan government and targets in Pakistan.

The communications show a three-way conversation between Bin Laden, his then deputy Ayman Zawahiri and Omar, who is believed to have been in Pakistan since fleeing Afghanistan after the collapse of his regime in 2001.

They indicate a "very considerable degree of ideological convergence", a Washington-based source familiar with the documents told the Guardian.

The news will undermine hopes of a negotiated peace in Afghanistan, where the key debate among analysts and policymakers is whether the Taliban – seen by many as following an Afghan nationalist agenda – might once again offer a safe haven to al-Qaida or like-minded militants, or whether they can be persuaded to renounce terrorism.

One possibility, experts say, is that although Omar built a strong relationship with Bin Laden and Zawahiri, other senior Taliban commanders see close alliance or co-operation with al-Qaida as deeply problematic.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/apr/29/bin-laden-al-qaida-taliban-contact

 

We should pull out and let the Afghans take care of themselves. We can provide aerial support but they are going to have to take care of their own country. Countries need to learn personal responsibility for their futures and not become too dependent on American taxpayers.

 

The USA will stay in Afghanistan so long as the military industrial complex makes money off of that war.

 

I pointed that out. OBL cooperated with the Taliban on a massacre of Afgans who opposed the Taliban, for example. But, they didn'tcooperate on operations ouside of Afg, and they fell out before 911.

After we had conquered Afg, it is no surprise that Taliban had relations with others who were willing to work for our removal.

Testimony from Bergdahl and others points to Taliban being highly intollerant of other groups, but of having agreements to not attack each other when coming in contact in Pakistan.

Suggesting all these groups work together against us or that they all have the same objectives is just wrong. And, being wrong means making serious policy mistakes.

We are not the center of earth for all peoples.

 

It's a black budget drug dealing op so I am guessing they twisted Trumps arm a little and he agreed to stay.

 

So much wisdom expressed in so few words.

 

Wake the **** up. The Taliban allowed bin Laden to train in Afghanistan. I didn't say they planned 9/11.

Good lord.

 

One of the most backward countries on the planet is leading the most powerful one by the nose. It has been doing so for the past 15 years, and will probably continue to do it for the next - and beyond. Hold that thought?