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Originally Posted by roux-en-y
How do you know that a fetus is not alive???
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Originally Posted by offspring13";p="
Its 'alive', just like a tree. It has no formed brain or brain waves so it has no consciousness.
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You have a real problem delineating time. It continually hurts your argument. A fetus does have a brain and brain waves. Does it have a “formed brain” or “brain waves” as you say? No. Not at day 1 or 2 or 5 or 10, etc. But it does at some point during gestation. So again, your statement is incorrect.
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Originally Posted by roux-en-y
I’m just trying to get you to commit to one of your definitions of life.
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Originally Posted by offspring13";p="
My definitions of life as defined by you. Quit trying to put words in my mouth.
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You initially stated that to be a human being required 3 criteria…1) Consciousness 2) Ability to survive on their own and 3) Not resemble a blob. That was later changed to just “consciousness”. Then the first onset of brain waves was included in your definition. I’m not putting words in your mouth. I’m just taking what you have provided us in your posts and trying to make sense of it. It’s difficult when you change your mind all the time. Here is your opportunity to tell us all what your official “offspring13” definition of life is…oh, and give us the exact day of gestation that a human becomes a “real” human or whatever you call it.
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Originally Posted by roux-en-y
Science will tell you that sex between a male and female human can produce another human. This is called reproduction. It is very scientific and natural. Stopping it is unnatural.
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Originally Posted by offspring13";p="
Unnatural does not always equal wrong.
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Right, if you are splicing flowers or fruit trees. The consequences of abortion are obviously more significant.
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Originally Posted by roux-en-y
I believe life begins at conception. There is nothing political or religious about that statement. If anything, it is supported more by science.
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Originally Posted by offspring13";p="
A fetus is living tissue, yes. An individual counscious human entity, no.
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Wait. At what stage of fetal development are you talking about? Are you saying that a fetus is never considered a “human entity”? Because a fetus does at some point become a “human entity” as you say. Another opportunity for you to give us a specific time during gestation. You see, you can’t use the generic term “fetus”. You have to be more specific. i.e - 3 month old fetus, 6 month old fetus.
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Originally Posted by roux-en-y
Don’t you think it’s interesting how if a murderer kills a pregnant woman they could face two counts of homicide, not just one. But on the other hand if the mother elects to terminate the unborn baby through an abortion, it’s perfectly fine? If the fetus is not alive like you say it’s not, then there should be no penalty for causing a woman to miscarry. Right?
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Originally Posted by offspring13";p="
Agreed, this is hypocrisy. All this of course, depends on how far along in the pregnancy either event occurs.
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Yet another opportunity: So what is the specific time?
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Originally Posted by roux-en-y
First of all, you have yet to tell me when life begins so by your own definition
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Originally Posted by offspring13";p="
Sometime during the second trimester. My stance is that abortions should be limited to first trimester only, except in the case of the health of the mother. Happy?
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No. So can I interpret that as say…Day 91 or Day 98? Around 14 wks, the approximate end of the first trimester. There can be no approximations. It has to be a precise moment. It’s tough, I know. You backed yourself into this corner. You have to know the exact moment or abortion could then be murder, by one of your various definitions.
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Originally Posted by roux-en-y
An abortion is INTENTIONAL not ACCIDENTAL. Do you see my point?
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Originally Posted by offspring13";p="
I see what you are trying to say, and if it is true, it further shows stupidity of the Bible. Punishing someone for a true accident?
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I’m not sure what you mean by a “true accident”? If you accidentally do something; like rear-end someone on the highway, it’s your fault even though you didn’t mean to do it. And even though you didn’t mean to do it, you will get a ticket and have to pay higher insurance premiums.