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Old 04-21-2006, 11:06 AM
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Originally Posted by noetsi";p=&quot View Post
taxes are regressive. Without exception. If you dont think so, read analysis of them. I posted examples above, naturally they were ignored. I in fact made my case that the actual tax burden is higher on lower income groups, the statements that this was not the case (that upper income groups paid a disreportinante amount of taxes) was made by conservative posters.
No, income taxes are not progressive. Either are estate taxes. And you definitely did not make any sort of a case that the tax burden is higher for low income groups. As a %, as dollars, total taxes are paid more by upper income groups. Saying otherwise does not even make mathematical sense.

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As for what national conservatives focus on in terms of taxes, read Heritage or Cato, or Commentary or listen to conservative speakers. I do all the time and they virtually never talk about regressive taxes like sales taxes. Indeed they have championed a national consumption (sales) tax which would be regressive to replace the progressive income tax. Look it up.
I did, and you are wrong. This site is devoted to total taxes. SS is regressive, Heritage and others discuss it all the time. Liberals have championed a flat tax, also regressive. And of course there is a good reason that federal taxes are discussed more, because it is easier to discuss one tax than it is 50 taxes (not to menion the thousands of local taxes), but more importantly, because federal income taxes are a much larger portion of the pie. The average family pays twice as much on federal income tax as it does state and local taxes. So in a discussion about tax reduction of course you focus on the largest piece. If I'm looking to save money at home I focus on my travel expenses, eating out and entertainment. I don't try and cut my spending on chewing gum.

http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/1441.html

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The Bush tax cuts focused most gains in upper income groups. Again I cited the evidence for this, and the CBO has come to the same conclusion. The tax cuts were in areas like estate, dividend and capital gains taxes, and the like which are paid primarily by upper income groups. The taxes for lower and lower middle income groups were very small.
And I provided links showing otherwise, many middle income groups pay capital gains and 40% made under $50K. Income tax cuts were across the board and a larger share went to lower income groups.

http://www.townhall.com/opinion/colu.../06/11294.html

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Who here thinks its a concidence that conservatives want to replace the progressive income tax with a national sales tax or that Bush cut capital gains, dividence and estate taxes but did zilch about raising the standard deduction
Many liberals want to replace it with a flax tax. And he increased the child care credit.

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As for whether I proved my case, the data is in the links I presented. Ignoring it does not mean its not there.
You provided links, they just don't say what you wish they did.
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All you need to know about the energy crisis:
ANWR Exploration Republicans: 91% Supported. Democrats: 86% Opposed.
Coal-to-liquid R's: 90% YES. D's: 78% NO.
Oil Shale Exploration R's: 90% YES. D's: 86% NO.
Outer Continental Shelf Exploration R's: 81% YES. D's: 83% NO.
Increased Refinery Capacity R's: 97% YES. D's: 96% NO

SUMMARY: 91% of House Republicans have historically voted to increase the production of America’s own oil and gas. 86% of House Democrats have historically voted against.
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