Thread: Religious war?
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Old 07-17-2006, 06:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barney-fife";p=&quot View Post
I heard an Israeli government official say tonight that nearly all Muslims are not terrorists, but nearly all terrorists are Muslim.

I think he is correct, but I don't know why he is correct. Why are nearly all terrorists Muslim? Or, do you reject that premise?]
I'm not sure statistically. But if most terrorists are Muslim, I do not believe it is because of religion. In fact, the direction of the relationship is telling. If Islam led to terrorism, most Muslims would be terrorists.

Quote:
Originally Posted by barney-fife";p=&quot View Post
Is this a religious war?
Partially. The war manifests itself through religion. But like all religious wars, it's roots are in something related to sovereignty and economics. Religion has played a part over all of history in rationalizing such fighting. The rationale seems to follow the need for conquest, not vice versa. In this day and age, Muslims are just the most often involved in disputes over sovereignty and living in areas not yet fully overtaken by modern ideas of peaceful resolution. Where religion has the strongest effect is in creating a connection between disaffected people from different parts of the world whose disaffection is in reality based on different problems. Religion allows for the connection of varied problems to a "common enemy". But areas of less disaffection will produce fewer terrorists.
Quote:
Originally Posted by barney-fife";p=&quot View Post
And if so, how should we respond?
End Muslim disaffection in Western countries for starters. Australia has had the novel idea of creating Islamic study centers where the public can learn about Islam and Muslims can learn from moderate clerics. Unfortunately the extremists reject it. But it marginalizes the extremists more and makes a better path for Muslims within Western countries. We must put an end to anti-Islamic rhetoric and policies. While this will not end the disputes over sovereignty, it will help to cut those disputes from the religious ties and crush the ability of the terrorist epidemic to move seamlessly across the world through different people. We need the cooperation of moderate clerics and need to bolster their strength. The moderates have wide appeal in most of the Middle East, but people fear the extremists and those extremists can b very persuasive when they control the media. Pakistan has been doing a pretty good job of fighting its extremist elements. Unfortunately when a disaster does occur, rather than appreciating what they have done we look at what they have not, forgetting the caution reformers like Musharif need to take to avoid removal by extremist elements.

Quote:
Originally Posted by barney-fife";p=&quot View Post
What role does the Christian faith play in this, if indeed, this is a religious war?
Christians need to focus on the substance of their religion rather than the surface features. Rather than wishing to war with the Muslim world, Christians should desire to aid their brothers and sisters in need, the majority of the Muslims who are manipulated and scared by the extremists. They should avoid the temptation to simply side with Israel and despise the enemy and instead appeal to the empathy and love that is at the heart of Christianity.
Quote:
Originally Posted by barney-fife";p=&quot View Post
From the secularists--what role does secularism have in this war? ?
We need to painfully sit back and accept it if democracy in the Middle East winds up being akin to a friendly version of theocracy... provided the elections are free and that the theocrats can be voted out. I hate to say it but we seculars need to stay quiet about some things, because the Muslims hate our philosophy more than the Christians we're used to. They view our philosophy as the danger that is corrupting their culture, much like some Christians here only more extreme. History has shown that if democracy is allowed to flourish, secular ideas will eventually become more accepted. So as long as they are not executing opposition liberal secular parties in the Middle East, we should sit back and watch. What is important is marketing democracy to the people. If they fear secularism so much, we should cut the secular rhetoric to a minimum. Let them have their own "culture wars".

Quote:
Originally Posted by barney-fife";p=&quot View Post
And please, no sermons on how this simply illustrates the corruptive nature of religion. You're preaching to the choir, and it serves no purpose.
Religion and corruption are both cultural universals and I don't believe they are exclusive to one another.

Quote:
Originally Posted by barney-fife";p=&quot View Post
Is this a cultural war of east vs. west?
Again, partially. Sam Huntington was partially right in his analysis of wars over culture. Part of the friction is based on dissimilarity of cultures. This war is like a regular war over economics and sovereignty multiplied by our own culture wars. Culture wars tend to be pretty civil until you get economics and sovereignty issues involved. We do need to understand that the people of the Middle East do have a different culture from our own. But when we talk to one another, we gain understanding of different cultures. It's been shown that Muslims with communication to Americans tend to like Americans more, even as they hate our policies and dislike our culture. People do not have to belong to the same culture to get along. And the more Muslims that like us, the fewer Muslims that will think blowing up random civilians is a good idea. It is a (*)(*)(*)(*) good idea to not only increase our understanding of Islamic culture (and not strictly for security purposes) but to find ways to increase Muslim understanding of our culture.
Remember that Gandhi was very well versed in British culture. That's what we really need. Muslim clerics that understand us and are willing to both peacefully stand against our unpopular policies and against the violent techniques of their own extremists.

Quote:
Originally Posted by barney-fife";p=&quot View Post
How then is it that nations living side by side have such different cultures?
Just history. What more can I say?

Quote:
Originally Posted by barney-fife";p=&quot View Post
I truly haven't a clue. The events are far beyond my intellectual capacity.
We're all pretty much guessing here.
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