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Old 05-09-2008, 05:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Mick Jagger View Post
It's an infringement of the right to government with no jurisdiction over religion.
In addition, it's false advertising.
I'm an American and I use American money (although not cash very often). I even believe in fiat currency.
But I do not believe in God and if I did, I'm not sure I'd trust him.
Does this mean I am not an American or that I should use some other currency?
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Old 05-09-2008, 05:57 AM
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In addition, it's false advertising.
I'm an American and I use American money (although not cash very often). I even believe in fiat currency.
But I do not believe in God and if I did, I'm not sure I'd trust him.
Does this mean I am not an American or that I should use some other currency?
you can believe what you want it is America , All I simply stated it wasn't hurting anyone
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Old 05-09-2008, 11:14 AM
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Just because it's not hurting anyone doesn't make it good. Would you apply that same arguement to, say, gay marriage? It doesn't hurt anyone, but I'm guessing you like the government regulating that.

I think it's a hollow jesture to boost Christians' egos and is completely unnecessary. It's not a big deal, but I think we should get rid of it.
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Old 05-10-2008, 04:50 AM
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Originally Posted by JavaBlack View Post
But I do not believe in God and if I did, I'm not sure I'd trust him?
Too bad for you. The American people of today, unlike the Americans who made the Constitution, don't believe that the duty to declare trust, or distrust, in God is a matter of individual choice.

Last edited by Mick Jagger; 05-10-2008 at 04:51 AM.
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Old 05-10-2008, 04:54 AM
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Originally Posted by submarinepainter View Post
All I simply stated it wasn't hurting anyone
It does grave injury to the rights of conscience and it violates God's jurisdiction.
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Old 05-10-2008, 05:24 AM
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It doesn't really matter God or any god has never done anything ever..
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Old 05-10-2008, 05:54 AM
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Originally Posted by JavaBlack View Post
But I do not believe in God and if I did, I'm not sure I'd trust him.
After reading about the way he messed with Abraham's head by demanding he go through with that bizarre mock human sacrifice of Isaac -- well, I don't know that I would trust him, either. I mean, really now -- what kind of deity gets their jollies by forcing people to do such things?
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Old 05-12-2008, 03:11 PM
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America’s Legacy of Religious Liberty

Pass It On

Who should decide when and how you pray?

Who should decide how much money you donate to religion?

Who should decide how often you attend worship services?


Unlike many countries around the world, the United States mandates full religious freedom in its Constitution. No government official or politician can tell you which faith to follow. That very personal decision is made by each individual. Without this right to worship as we see fit, Americans would not be truly a free people.


The constitutional principle that ensures religious liberty is the separation of church and state. The First Amendment says, “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof….” That means simply that government cannot promote religion or interfere with its practice.


Although we sometimes take this vital right for granted today, visionary thinkers fought long and hard to win this freedom. Early American colonies made some denominations their official state religions, and those who dissented were jailed, exiled or even executed. We’ve come a long way since then.


After the American Revolution, our Founders created a government where true freedom of conscience was protected. It was Thomas Jefferson, our nation’s third president and author of the Declaration of Independence, who said that the American people through the First Amendment have built a “wall of separation between church and state.” James Madison, the fourth president and Father of the Constitution and Bill of Rights, joined Jefferson in fighting for religious liberty.


Nevertheless, Jefferson’s wall – and the very concept of church-state separation – have become the subject of many misunderstandings over the years. Here are the facts:

Separation of church and state is good for religion.

The United States is one of the most religious nations on earth. The overwhelming majority of Americans say they believe in God, and many attend worship services regularly. In contrast, in some European nations where religion still gets government support, interest in faith is falling, and many people no longer go to services.


Surveys of residents of Europe find declining belief in religion. In England, Germany, Sweden, Denmark and the Netherlands, fewer than 1 in 10 people attend religious services. Fifty-five percent of people in Sweden say God is not important to them. Yet many of these countries have government-established churches or had them until recently.


Compare those figures to the U.S. equivalents: Here, nearly 50 percent attend religious services regularly. Eighty-three percent say they have prayed within the past week; 95 percent believe in God.


It seems that the failure to separate church and state hurts religion. Why is that? Here’s the answer: Freedom and competition are good for religion. When houses of worship are dependent on government for support, religion loses its vitality. In America, religious groups rely on voluntary contributions. This policy makes them more robust.


Church-state separation also guarantees the right of religious groups to speak out on issues of justice, ethics and morality. In countries where religion receives tax support, clergy usually are wary of criticizing the government. After all, they don’t want to bite the hand that feeds them! Because religious groups in America are truly independent, they feel no such constraints. They are free to try to persuade other Americans toward their perspective.


Madison was well aware of this. In his home state of Virginia, Madison noted that severing the ties between religion and government increased interest in religion and made the citizenry more virtuous. In 1819, he wrote, “The number, the industry, and the morality of the priesthood and the devotion of the people have been manifestly increased by the total separation of the church from the state.”


Alexis de Tocqueville made a similar observation in his well-known book Democracy in America. Tocque*ville, who traveled extensively in the United States in the early part of the 19th Century, noted that religion was much stronger in America than in Europe.


After talking with both ministers and church members of different faiths, Tocqueville reported, “[T]hey all attributed the peaceful dominion of religion in their country mainly to the separation of church and state. I do not hesitate to affirm that during my stay in America I did not meet a single individual, of the clergy or the laity, who was not of the same opinion on this point.”


Tocqueville’s view is not surprising. By guaranteeing the free exercise of faith and barring the establishment of religion, the First Amendment protects houses of worship from government interference and places a premium on their independence.


In addition, because church-state separation prevents the government from taking sides in religious disputes, it creates a type of “religious free market” whereby various faiths are free to spread their views and win new converts.


Most American religious leaders appreciate the protections guaranteed by our Constitution. They have no desire to see any religion, including their own, favored by the government. Only a small – but vocal and well-organized – minority questions our heritage of religious liberty and campaigns to see their faith enshrined in law.

Separation of church and state is good for families.

Students may pray or read scripture at any time during the school day that the academic schedule permits, but the decision must be theirs. Schools may not sponsor devotional activities, but they are allowed to offer instruction about religion from an academic perspective. They may teach but not preach or usurp the rightful role of parents. The high court’s decisions about our schools have struck the right balance.



Thanks to the separation of church and state, you are in complete control of the religious upbringing of your children. Government institutions, including the public school system, are not permitted to coerce your children to adopt new and different religions.


Religious traditions differ on matters of doctrine and practice. Even among the different branches of Christianity, there are wide variations of belief. These are not meaningless distinctions. People take them very seriously. Due to the separation of church and state, the government remains neutral on these disputes. This gives you the right to decide which religious views you will adopt and which you will choose for your children.


Protecting youngsters from government coercion is one of the most important things the First Amendment does. In 1962 and ’63, the Supreme Court struck down mandatory worship in public schools. The court did not ban voluntary prayer and Bible reading or “kick God out of the schools,” as some mistakenly claim. Rather, it ruled that parents – not politicians, bureaucrats or school officials – have the right to make decisions about their children’s religious training. Why would we want to have it any other way?


Religion is alive and well in America’s public schools. The difference today is that it is voluntary religion. Student-run religious clubs meet on high school campuses outside class hours all over the country, but no youngster is compelled or pressured to attend. In fact, Charisma, a Christian magazine, reports that 10,000 Bible clubs meet in America’s schools. Public schools are not “religion-free” zones.


Students may pray or read scripture at any time during the school day that the academic schedule permits, but the decision must be theirs. Schools may not sponsor devotional activities, but they are allowed to offer instruction about religion from an academic perspective. They may teach but not preach or usurp the rightful role of parents. The high court’s decisions about our schools have struck the right balance.

http://www.au.org/site/News2?abbr=pr...mugfq832.app7b
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Old 05-14-2008, 05:03 AM
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In Allah We Trust

That doesn't hurt anyone either.
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Old 05-14-2008, 06:12 AM
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If the word 'God' on the coins is written in upper case letters, then that refers to God, the being, and would possibly be a violation. If the word is in lower case letters 'god' then it does not directly refer to God, the being, and would not a violation.
I imagine the word is written in upper case letters, though.
The whole phrase is written in upper case! The Guvmint have the best lawyers our money can buy, they have every loophole covered!
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