SS, your "logic" is very transparent.

You're basically trying to tell me that the government can do "whatever it wants" in the name of national security, and all that is "acceptable".

Well, I mean, that "viewpoint", would be contrary to both the letter and spirit of the United States Constitution.

The principle embodied in the Constitution, is that the government has no Rights. They only have Powers. Not Rights.

The government has no "right" to wiretap your phone. The question is, do they have the Power to do it. The question is the Power, not the Right.

So, let's examine your "logic" here.....

Your logic here, is entirely bass-ackwards.

Here's how the "real" logic goes:

The President of the United States, has a sworn duty to uphold the law. That is part of his Constitutional oath of office, and he can be impeached for violating it. That would be "perjury" (lying under oath), and that is an impeachable offense - it's a "High Crime and Misdemeanor".

The law says, that any kind of surveillance, requires a warrant.

"Law enforcement officials", throughout history, have made every excuse under the sun for why they "shouldn't be required to obtain a warrant" - usually it's either "time", or it's some kinda fear-mongering like, "you can't just let vicious criminals continue to run around loose".

But We the People, have consistently told them, that they gotta have a warrant. That concept has been up to the Supreme Court, literally hundreds of times.

So if the President of the United States, is just gonna ignore the law, and do whatever he wants to do in spite of what the law says, then my feeling is, he oughta be impeached. Immediately.

And I don't care what kinda excuse he uses. If he wants to go arbitrarily changing the contract, for any reason, he can go kiss my butt and I'm not gonna do a god(*)(*)(*)(*) thing he says after that, and if he comes after me I'm gonna go public with the stuff, and fight him in the one and only arena that he knows he can't win in, which is the arena of legitimate public political activity. Why do you think the Neo-Nuts value "secrecy" so much? It's cause if any of their shennanigans ever saw the light of day, the public would have a sh**-fit.

So, you know, I'm just not interested in your "excuses", and your "reasons", and your "philosophy", and especially not your values.

All I'm interested in, is the contract.

And it says in the contract, that you gotta have a warrant.

So as far as I'm concerned, that's the end of the story.

Hey SS, you know, this idea goes all the way back to the Magna Carta, in the year 1200-something, wherein it says, "no man is above the law, not even the King".

And for some reason, there have been thousands of "kings" after that, who simply didn't wanna listen to the voice of the People in that regard.

And all of 'em, are in the toilet bowl of political history. I can't think of an exception. Can you?

So, there you go.

Don't sit there and tell me GW gets to do "whatever he wants" in the name of national security, 'cause I'm gonna come back and tell you you're full of sh**. (I keep saying that, don't I? Well, I'm gonna stop saying it, 'cause I mean, nothing changes if nothing changes, right? ).

The Prez doesn't get to say "I can do whatever I want in the name of national security". That's not his call. His job, is only to protect the nation.

SS, the President of the United States is still required to obey the law. That's what it says in the contract.

Are you gonna tell me something different?



Once again, bass-ackwards political thinking. Rights are inviolable, SS. The government doesn't have the Power to strip you of your Rights. The only thing they can do, is "interpret" them in such a way that they involve compromises, and the only time they can do that, is when they conflict with other Rights.

You seem to have, like, zero understanding of the law.

Well, whatever. Bushie's history. He's out of office in 300 days, and there's not a snowball's chance in hell that anyone like him is gonna be elected anytime soon, so you know, chew on that for a while. You guys have failed. You've failed miserably, and it's 'cause your model sucks. It's non-operational, it "doesn't work".

NO man is above the law, SS. Not even the king. Not even when he thinks he's speaking for the People.