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Old 02-08-2008, 09:12 AM
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"My opinion is that Kitzmiller did the ID community a great service"

id say it was a disservice. because of absurd comparisons to science, impressionable minds are going to be confused about which is which. science deals in observation and testing, it welcomes scrutiny to further test and validate theories. creationism, in this case, provides no answer, it only poses a question. with creationism, when you attempt to poke a whole in evolutionary theory, youre not presenting an opposing theory, youre only challenging its validity. thats where the confusion happens. people who advocate teaching creationism and evolution side by side obviously dont understand how science works.

now, before you jump up and say "but it does provide an answer, jms!" let me tell you, that scientifically, it does not. just as you can say god created things as they are, i can tell you an enormous cat that was there at the beginning threw up and the universe was in its spew. both claims are completely without evidence - basically, anyone can claim whatever they want if their claims arent subject to scientific scrutiny. fortunately for everyone, thats not how science works.

1) Should Suzy be told by a science teacher that God doesn’t exist?

no.

2) Should our secular boards of education insist that Tommy is told that God may or may not exist?

no.

3) Should the education of our children rest more in the hands of their parents, than the government?

i wouldnt say that its a question of should or shouldnt the parents take control. its more about should they have the choice. and the answer is yes, thats fine. if you want to homeschool your child or send them to a private school i dont see the problem. but when you undermine science with non science (religious belief), in a public arena, youre not only miseducating but stifling religious freedom.


Evolution: Do you believe that this is still a theory? Or is it fact? Why?

theory. because theory is essentially an explanation for fact.

here are some definitions to consider:

theory - a coherent group of general propositions used as principles of explanation for a class of phenomena.

phenomenon - a fact, occurrence, or circumstance observed or observable.

Irreducible Complexity: Do you believe this is a fact? Or is it pseudo science? Why?

see above. not science because science deals in cause that can be observed to explain effects that can be observed. a good definition:

science - The observation, identification, description, experimental investigation, and theoretical explanation of phenomena.

irreducible complexity doesnt explain anything.

Separation of Church and State: Do you believe that the separation of church and state is a mandate for secular humanism?

no, its about freedom, liberty. people dont have to give up their religious beliefs because the state doesnt enforce them.

not sure if i understand your intellectual honesty question, but i think ive written enough for now.
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f0ca1 refuses to erase my name from his signature....I believe that b/c I am a member, if I ask for him to remove it, he should. Of course, most normal and sympathetic individuals would have enough common courtesy to respect what other members have asked, but f0ca1 has again and again denied my attempts.

Last edited by JMS; 02-08-2008 at 09:18 AM.
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