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Originally Posted by Sickntiredofliblies
We unlike any other animals have more developed brains that allow us to realize such values as those that can best sustain ourselves. Other animals without our evolved brain have caused their own extinction because of such ignorance. Laws are there because of intelligence.
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Okay, so why is it such a stretch to ignore some primal drives to ignoring others? Your point was that religious laws were unnatural, but why aren't secular laws unnatural? The modern human as a species would naturally live in anarchy.
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Originally Posted by Sickntiredofliblies
That is just false. To question whether a creator is provable, or whether miracles can be scientifically explained, or to question any other outlandish occurence in the bible, is heresy. I was a catholic. I know how that church operates. Until very recently they upheld the opinion that the planet earth was flat. Galileo was imprisoned because of it. Questioning Catholicism = sin and punishment.
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Well you have to understand that the church is an imperfect institution. Some of their actions in the past and some today aren't right. However, blaming today's church for persecuting Galileo is like blaming today's Germany for the Holocaust.
And questioning Catholicism certainly isn't a sin. By no stretch of the imagination does the church hold that its beliefs can be proved scientifically, it merely offers its explanation and beliefs. Whether or not you wish to accept those beliefs are up to you, and in the end, some would argue we are judged by our actions not by the specifics of our beliefs.
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Originally Posted by Sickntiredofliblies
Such things contradicted their religious text that they base their faith on. People have been oppressed by such opinions at the hands of the religious leaders. It took persons that questioned reality and studied known facts to produce these findings. No bible verses were used to prove it. The religious people only accepted it once it was proven through scientific observation. Some people of faith still do not accept it. Mike Huckaby, a presidential candidate claims that he does not believe to be true. His faith is that of those that refuse to accept that the bible does not truthfully explain reality. I was taught science courses by an outspoken baptist who also claimed that evolution was not real. Even today with evolution being a proven occurence, many religious followers still deny it to be true because the same book they base their unproven existence of the creator also denies real proven science.
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Its true that some individual catholics believe some weird things (like evolution not being the case). However, I could find some secular people who believe even crazier things.
Official church doctrine accepts that Evolution can coexist with our beliefs. And I challenge you to find any religious text that conflicts with evolution.
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Originally Posted by Sickntiredofliblies
Genetics is not a controversial subject pertaining to the bible and present day science. The bible has no basic contradictions within it pertaining to genetics. This is because some of the occurrences of genetic traits are obvious to the human eye. Even basic observations made by prehistoric people legitimized genetics. It was obvious science.
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The details of genetic science certainly weren't obvious, by any stretch. Furthermore, what science will be controversial when interpreting scripture correctly? Unless you think that the authors of the bible knew exactly how God created the world, or made us a species, anything is open for discovery.
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Originally Posted by Sickntiredofliblies
Rome did not have the moral standards that most religions today have. It was one of the earliest religions used to explain the incomprehensible so naturally more thinking was involved. There was no bible or set text to legislate from.
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Well in the earlier days of Rome, yes thats true, later on Catholicism was the primary religion.
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Originally Posted by Sickntiredofliblies
Pointing out bloodshed by secularists only points out something about human nature. We humans have justified terrible things wether we use hatred, contempt, greediness, or blind faith. When we have used faith as the basis, we believe it was justified regardless of atrocities and failures.
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That was my point. The bloodshed you speak of isn't exclusive of the faithful. It happens across all walks of humanity, and if faith wasn't there to use as an excuse dozens of secular reasons would be used instead.
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Originally Posted by Sickntiredofliblies
It is silly to require science to jump to such a conclusion. You are basically saying that since such a diety hasn't been disproven, it must exist. It is illogical to prove a negative. Just because we don't have all the answers yet, does not mean some unexplainable occurence has happened in the past.
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I never said that God could be proven to exist. (Actually, I didn't say what you are retorting about at all, I quoted a man much wiser than myself) If you want proof, there isn't any. However, faith can coexist with science. I can believe that evolution was the process by which we became the species that we are, it would be foolish not to. I can aslo believe that this process happened the way it did because a greater being willed it to happen.
We are surrounded by a huge universe, and every day we find out its bigger and more fantastic than we had thought the day before. When it comes to how we all got here, science can only stab in the dark. We've been given this great universe, and for proof of a greater being you want him to come down and defy his laws?