I have to admit, I had never even heard of this argument until about ten minutes ago, but it seemed an interesting enough topic to put out for debate. Apparently a lawyer has come up with an idea that she feels equalizes the status of the father with the mother in the aspect of abortion rights.

The concept is that if the mother has the right to choose whether or not to terminate a pregnancy before a certain time, then the father should have the right to disavow responsibility for the child provided it is done within that same time frame and made known to the proper authorities.

I haven't read the article (written by Melanie McCulley, published in The Journal of Law and Policy) yet and I haven't quite made up my mind about how I feel on this subject, but I think it's very important that it is debated, as it could mean another important step toward equal treatment under the law.

Here's the wikipedia entry, which is informative if short.

This is a quote (copied from the wikipedia entry) from the article entitled "The Male Abortion: The Putative Father's Right to Terminate His Interests in and Obligations to the Unborn Child," which seems to sum up the position rather well:

The only argument I can think of against this thus far (for on who is pro-choice... there are obvious pro-life and "pro-family" arguments which would automatically arise) is that abortion rights are not meant so much to be a right to terminate responsibility to a child as to give a woman the right not to have to carry an unwanted pregnancy to term. I wouldn't present that argument upfront if I didn't see some logic in it, yet I think it's obvious at the same time that abortion rights give, in general, a much broader freedom than simply the freedom not to carry a pregnancy. Abortion rights do seem to give the mother the right to disavow any future responsibility for the fruit of a reproductive activity (of course I speak of cases in which the activity was consensual... this is not meant to imply that a rape victim has some responsibility to the fruit of a rape... that's a bit off topic for this issue).



So as a clear cut set of questions... would legislation to this end be a step toward equal protection under the law or is it simply an attempt to circumvent personal responsibility? Does it flow from the very concept of legal abortion that a parent has a right to disavow the responsibility for a pregnancy the do not wish to be carried to term or does this right only extend to the mother because it has to do with her biological process?

I have to admit, I'm torn.

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Yes!!! I have been saying this for yonks, men should be able to opt out of fatherhood if the woman can opt out of motherhood.
Notifying authorities is a good idea, too. It'd prevent any legal battle from taking place.

I fully agree with the quote you posted, btw.

Nope. Abortion absolves the woman of the responsibility of raising that child - why shouldn't the man be given an option in which he can back out? It sounds like equal protection to me, because right now, men have no protection, and no choice.

I don't believe so. Just because the man does not have a uterus does not mean he should be forced into fatherhood. I wouldn't dream of forcing a woman to become a mother against her will, so why do we do this to fathers who have no desire to be parents?


Which side are you learning toward, Guava? You say you are torn, so I imagine you can see both sides?

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Originally Posted by Inferno You just don't relate to my sense of humor. How about this. Gosh darn funny man living in a whale. doncha know that gawd could do that I betcha he could. wink wink.

I'm leaning toward the side which says that it would amount to equal protection under the law, but I can see an argument against that mounting in the distance and I'm hoping someone will mount it so I can decide if it's got any merit. I can't quite find the words to define the subtleties of it, so I'll admit that posting this was at least partially done in the hope that someone would be smart enough to present a well-reasoned and passionately defended counter-argument that would help me consider the possibility that my knee-jerk reaction was wrong. It's not that I want it to be wrong, just that I don't like to assume everything is black and white.

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An article on the subject which mostly argues for it:

http://media.www.westerncourier.com/...-1717296.shtml

I had found another in searching, but it was less about this subject and more about whether or not the father has a right to be informed and/or has any say in whether the mother has an abortion.

I'm trying to find an article which argues against it.

I'll post it if I do.

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This is yet another example of fuzzy-headed liberal marijuana-induced 1960s/1970s style thinking which attempts to solve one wrong by perpetrating yet another wrong. Moreover, this "solution," so-called, does not result in equal rights before the law. Abortion not only allows a woman to abandon any responsibility to the child, it allows her to kill the child. Equal rights before the law means that fathers should have the right to kill their children. Apparently, the Romans had one thing right!

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Originally Posted by Inferno You just don't relate to my sense of humor. How about this. Gosh darn funny man living in a whale. doncha know that gawd could do that I betcha he could. wink wink.

That's the funniest thing I've read in a while.

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I would even go one step further. Males should have a say in the abortion that is atleast equal to the women's stand point.

Ie. a father must be able to choose either for abortion or against it.

how to solve a dispute is a other question however. But if i had gotten someone knocked up, i would really want that person to have a abortion, rather then give up responsibility (if i already decided i don't want to become a father). After all that's my gene pool that's being carried on.

That's actually what the article I didn't post was talking about.

I'm not quite sure about that though. I see what you're saying about one's gene pool being carried on, but the main reason for abortion rights being given to women in the first place is that it involves their having to carry a pregnancy... having to have something gestate within and in fact integrated with their body.

The only reason that this even becomes an issue when it comes to men is the (arguably) unintended consequence that an abortion gives a woman the right to disavow a certain responsibility.

You bring up an interesting point, one which has the merit to be debated.



I guess a lot of this depends on one's view on abortion in general. To me, the right to an abortion exists solely because of the fact that the mother must carry the pregnancy to term without it. The fetus being fully integrated with the mother and being not fully formed as of a certain stage of pregnancy, it seems that abortion in some cases is an option which is morally defensible and even in certain cases maybe morally right (not so much as opposed to morally wrong, but to morally gray).

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i tend to disagree that abortion is solely because the mother must carry. There are simple examples in which having a permanent link (a kid) between 2 people is not wanted. Much the same reasoning is used when rape victims want to have a abortion (they don't want to be reminded of...)