Thread: How to Defeat a Liberal in a Debate

Xerographica

Default How to Defeat a Liberal in a Debate

There are two ways that you can try to defeat a liberal in a debate. The ineffective method (deontological / moral) and the effective method (consequentialist / economic).

Can you explain to me why is it that the far right delusionals on this board always lose every debate?

Originally Posted by Reiver

Protection of property rights!

At the expense of others, that's the way it goes. Ends justifying the means.

Originally Posted by Someone

Wage-labor is top down, not emergent.

The institution is top down, it's existence was emergent. No one stepped in and said "hey guys, this is how we're going to handle employment" -- rather the relationship between employee and employer evolved to its current state not entirely on it's own, but the same could be said for anything.

Originally Posted by Anikdote

At the expense of others, that's the way it goes. Ends justifying the means.

That's like saying laws against stealing as 'ends justifying the means'. No, in both circumstances we are referring purely to the protection of property rights

Originally Posted by Someone

What perspective? I am not talking about individual analysis or an individual viewpoint. I am talking about hard economic fact. Asking "does your perspective matter" in relation to that is akin to a situation where two people are each looking at a rock; the fact that from the second person's angle the rock happens to look like a rabbit is irrelevant to the question "is the rock made of granite?"

I'm talking about hard economic facts also!

• Having a perspective = you can look at a rock and see a rabbit.
• Having a perspective that matters = you can look at a rock and see a rabbit...but then have the freedom to choose to use a hammer and chisel to sculpt the rabbit from the rock.

Why would one person want to sculpt a rabbit from a rock...while another person would want to use that same rock for a granite counter top? Which person should be able to use the rock? Obviously the person that values the rock the most. That's how resources are efficiently allocated.

What's our most valuable resource? It's our unique perspectives. It's our ability to transform ordinary things into extraordinary things. If we prevent people from choosing how they use their limited resources then we are wasting our most valuable resource.

What's the benefit of allowing 150 million of our most productive perspectives (taxpayers) to determine the distribution of public funds? What's the harm in allowing 538 perspectives (congresspeople) to determine the distribution of 150 million people's limited resources?

It's easy to "see" what congress produces...everybody can do that. But it requires an economic mind to "see" the "unseen". The "unseen" is the value of 150 million people's perspectives. How much do you value your own perspective? Multiply that by 150 million...take whatever that equals and then multiply that to the public sector. Can you "see" the product?

Originally Posted by Someone

The US (pre-1980), Japan, Germany, France, etc.

The US pre 1980 was a lot more conservative than it is today.

Anyway, it is interesting that people want the US to do the same Japan is doing, even though there is no evidence that it is working for them (2 lost decades). It is dumb to believe facism is good for the poor.

Originally Posted by Mr_Truth

Can you explain to me why is it that the far right delusionals on this board always lose every debate?

That's easy. They fail to understand that perspectives matter. Do you understand that perspectives matter?

Originally Posted by parcus

The US pre 1980 was a lot more conservative than it is today.

Socially, yes. Economically, no.

Originally Posted by parcus

It is dumb to believe facism is good for the poor.

Yet you're probably a rightie..correct?

Originally Posted by Someone

Socially, yes. Economically, no.

We have to specify the time then, "before 1980" includes the most conservatives times of US history, early nineteens and other periods.

Originally Posted by Someone

Socially, yes. Economically, no.

You seem to believe that your perspective matters. Can you please help me understand why you believe that your perspective should matter in the private sector but not in the public sector?