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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2007, 07:42 PM
BoogiePeople BoogiePeople is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrWarez";p=&quot View Post
I'm 99% sure this story is a disinformation operation. Which is probably why it's being covered only by Fox. How hard is it for the military to make up a story like that huh?

Also, i find it hard to believe terrorist would take the time to print books on how to torture. I mean, everyone knows the drill tricks or how to brake someone's finger etc.. And how convenient for the military to find this book? Reminds went the FBI found that passport intact on the rubble on 911, went nearly 1000 corps could not be found.

So it's sound to like one more attempt to demonize the Muslim. Again!
Are you serious? I'll bet you didn't even go to those links, and just like a loyal sheep Commucrat, you immediately discredit anything positive that happens on the current administration's watch. It's rather pathetic, really. I'll bet you're one of these "Bush planned the 9/11 attacks" sycophants too.

Regardless, here's some more links of the same story, so you can rest your bleeding little heart that it's not just "made up" by FoxNews. Unfortunately, it won't help your ignorance.

http://www.rttnews.com/FOREX/gblnews...27/2007&item=1
http://english.chosun.com/w21data/ht...705280001.html
http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/...267686,00.html
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2007, 07:59 PM
MrWarez MrWarez is offline
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Originally Posted by JP5";p=&quot View Post
Oh boy. Another member of the "Blame America First" crowd.
I just think propaganda is a reality.
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2007, 08:13 PM
MrWarez MrWarez is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BoogiePeople";p=&quot View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrWarez";p=&quot View Post
I'm 99% sure this story is a disinformation operation. Which is probably why it's being covered only by Fox. How hard is it for the military to make up a story like that huh?

Also, i find it hard to believe terrorist would take the time to print books on how to torture. I mean, everyone knows the drill tricks or how to brake someone's finger etc.. And how convenient for the military to find this book? Reminds went the FBI found that passport intact on the rubble on 911, went nearly 1000 corps could not be found.

So it's sound to like one more attempt to demonize the Muslim. Again!
Are you serious? I'll bet you didn't even go to those links, and just like a loyal sheep Commucrat, you immediately discredit anything positive that happens on the current administration's watch. It's rather pathetic, really. I'll bet you're one of these "Bush planned the 9/11 attacks" sycophants too.

Regardless, here's some more links of the same story, so you can rest your bleeding little heart that it's not just "made up" by FoxNews. Unfortunately, it won't help your ignorance.

http://www.rttnews.com/FOREX/gblnews...27/2007&item=1
http://english.chosun.com/w21data/ht...705280001.html
http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/...267686,00.html
And how is that positive exactly?

Listen, i just cant picture terrorist printing books. It just sounds ridiculous. And as far as I'm concern the military is not a reliable source. But i respect most of the military men out there. But not all of them.

Also, what you call terrorist i call freedom fighters. And I'm not gonna juge them as to how they fight, just like i wouldn't like to be juged if i was fighting
an occupying force in my country.
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2007, 11:49 PM
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Default Wrong, wrong, and wrong

Quote:
Originally Posted by BroncoBilly";p=&quot View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by hobo";p=&quot View Post

Here it is again: beheadings, suicide bombers, roadside sneaky bombs, sharia law, no democracy, blowing up large buildings in New York and killing 3000 people. Not nice people...the kind of people a country like the US might try to stop.
How ironic you would post the above, and to comment on your statement...without an ounce of effort from the democrats to help fight terrorists. They have put roadblocks every step of the way, and with the help of the Bush hating media, you all have done a fine job supporting our troops. It just amazes me how 99% of our troops have such a different view of the situation in Iraq. Maybe if the Bush haters were to spend some time there, a different view would be taken. It reminds me so much of Viet Nam, what a shame our dissenters are.

Oh I forgot to mention, have a nice Memorial Day, I'm sure our troops would like to convey the same to all liberals who denounce them, especially Rosie O, after insinuating they are terrorists.
Now I understand why you NeoCons are so frustrated about 70% of the people disapproving of Bush. You think the rest of us want to tolerate terrorists, hate our troops, and have a personal vendetta against Bush. Wrong, wrong and wrong. The problem is Bush has obviously chosen the wrong path to fight terrorists. The result is we are mired down in the internal politics of Iraq, chasing Taliban in Afghanistan, and generally acting like we are empire builders fighting a war conquer two nations. That is a way to make a lot of otherwise peaceful people pick up their gun to defend their homeland, their family, or their religious sect.

This is a different kind of war. We don't face the enemy in pitch battles with tanks screaming across the battlefield. That may have been the case in Gulf War I, but this is totally different. We need a strategy that will reduce the number of terrorists, not fester more Muslims to take up the battle. How to accomplish this is a classic military/diplomatic problem - it is the same problem we faced in Vietnam.

I am sure the troops would love nothing better this Memorial Day than to come home knowing that a powerful military campaign can never stop an enemy that fights with impunity in and among the innocent civilians. It is a problem faced since Alexander the Great 's army was cut down in Afghanistan. We need a Commander in Chief that can outwit al Qaeda, not out-shoot them.
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old 05-28-2007, 01:02 AM
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Default You've got Bush

Quote:
Originally Posted by hobo";p=&quot View Post
We need a Commander in Chief that can outwit al Qaeda, not out-shoot them.
And what have you got? You've got Bush. Every Al Qa'ida operative must wish that US presidents could serve more than 2 terms.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 05-28-2007, 05:03 AM
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Default Wrong?

Quote:
Originally Posted by hobo";p=&quot View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by BroncoBilly";p=&quot View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by hobo";p=&quot View Post

Here it is again: beheadings, suicide bombers, roadside sneaky bombs, sharia law, no democracy, blowing up large buildings in New York and killing 3000 people. Not nice people...the kind of people a country like the US might try to stop.
How ironic you would post the above, and to comment on your statement...without an ounce of effort from the democrats to help fight terrorists. They have put roadblocks every step of the way, and with the help of the Bush hating media, you all have done a fine job supporting our troops. It just amazes me how 99% of our troops have such a different view of the situation in Iraq. Maybe if the Bush haters were to spend some time there, a different view would be taken. It reminds me so much of Viet Nam, what a shame our dissenters are.

Oh I forgot to mention, have a nice Memorial Day, I'm sure our troops would like to convey the same to all liberals who denounce them, especially Rosie O, after insinuating they are terrorists.
Now I understand why you NeoCons are so frustrated about 70% of the people disapproving of Bush. You think the rest of us want to tolerate terrorists, hate our troops, and have a personal vendetta against Bush. Wrong, wrong and wrong. The problem is Bush has obviously chosen the wrong path to fight terrorists. The result is we are mired down in the internal politics of Iraq, chasing Taliban in Afghanistan, and generally acting like we are empire builders fighting a war conquer two nations. That is a way to make a lot of otherwise peaceful people pick up their gun to defend their homeland, their family, or their religious sect.

This is a different kind of war. We don't face the enemy in pitch battles with tanks screaming across the battlefield. That may have been the case in Gulf War I, but this is totally different. We need a strategy that will reduce the number of terrorists, not fester more Muslims to take up the battle. How to accomplish this is a classic military/diplomatic problem - it is the same problem we faced in Vietnam.

I am sure the troops would love nothing better this Memorial Day than to come home knowing that a powerful military campaign can never stop an enemy that fights with impunity in and among the innocent civilians. It is a problem faced since Alexander the Great 's army was cut down in Afghanistan. We need a Commander in Chief that can outwit al Qaeda, not out-shoot them.
You seem to have me confused with a European. I love America, and I wholly support an open debate of ideas to help thwart and extinguish the terrorists trying to slaughter us, but again, please list the ideas the Bush bashers have put forth. Here is one example of the democrats response to some of the methods our intel operatives have been engaging in; Our Patriot Act has been blasted by the democrats since day one, what have they done to change it in the last 6 months of their in charge approach? Let me answer that for you, NOTHING! The lefts only purpose for our survival as a nation has been to throw a wrench in the spokes of the Bush administration at every opportunity. They have done nothing, and have contributed nothing, and you can boldly call that intelligent leadership?

I agree, we need to outsmart the enemy, no doubt about it, and they are beating us at our own game by letting us eat each other alive, remember, divide and conquer, the oldest of war tactics, and they are winning. The left has Bush hating mouths like the major media sources and the Rosie O'donalds making ridiculous claims, and there are those in huge numbers that believe that vile, and when there is a rotten apple in the barrel, it will rot the rest of the apples. The only thing I advocate is that the left become a part of the solution instead of part of the problem. Is Iraq a mistake? As it looks now, it is, but to only be lam-blasted at every turn is not helping our nation fight the terrorists. Their only strategy has been, "we need to leave", and then what? Where's the rest of the puzzle? As an American, I would like to think our leaders have some sort of plan. Do plans always work? Absolutely not, but to plan and fail is tremendously greater than failing to plan, there is at least recourse and change of direction.
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 05-28-2007, 05:50 AM
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Default It's time to get realistic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BroncoBilly";p=&quot View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by hobo";p=&quot View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by BroncoBilly";p=&quot View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by hobo";p=&quot View Post

Here it is again: beheadings, suicide bombers, roadside sneaky bombs, sharia law, no democracy, blowing up large buildings in New York and killing 3000 people. Not nice people...the kind of people a country like the US might try to stop.
How ironic you would post the above, and to comment on your statement...without an ounce of effort from the democrats to help fight terrorists. They have put roadblocks every step of the way, and with the help of the Bush hating media, you all have done a fine job supporting our troops. It just amazes me how 99% of our troops have such a different view of the situation in Iraq. Maybe if the Bush haters were to spend some time there, a different view would be taken. It reminds me so much of Viet Nam, what a shame our dissenters are.

Oh I forgot to mention, have a nice Memorial Day, I'm sure our troops would like to convey the same to all liberals who denounce them, especially Rosie O, after insinuating they are terrorists.
Now I understand why you NeoCons are so frustrated about 70% of the people disapproving of Bush. You think the rest of us want to tolerate terrorists, hate our troops, and have a personal vendetta against Bush. Wrong, wrong and wrong. The problem is Bush has obviously chosen the wrong path to fight terrorists. The result is we are mired down in the internal politics of Iraq, chasing Taliban in Afghanistan, and generally acting like we are empire builders fighting a war conquer two nations. That is a way to make a lot of otherwise peaceful people pick up their gun to defend their homeland, their family, or their religious sect.

This is a different kind of war. We don't face the enemy in pitch battles with tanks screaming across the battlefield. That may have been the case in Gulf War I, but this is totally different. We need a strategy that will reduce the number of terrorists, not fester more Muslims to take up the battle. How to accomplish this is a classic military/diplomatic problem - it is the same problem we faced in Vietnam.

I am sure the troops would love nothing better this Memorial Day than to come home knowing that a powerful military campaign can never stop an enemy that fights with impunity in and among the innocent civilians. It is a problem faced since Alexander the Great 's army was cut down in Afghanistan. We need a Commander in Chief that can outwit al Qaeda, not out-shoot them.
You seem to have me confused with a European. I love America, and I wholly support an open debate of ideas to help thwart and extinguish the terrorists trying to slaughter us, but again, please list the ideas the Bush bashers have put forth. Here is one example of the democrats response to some of the methods our intel operatives have been engaging in; Our Patriot Act has been blasted by the democrats since day one, what have they done to change it in the last 6 months of their in charge approach? Let me answer that for you, NOTHING! The lefts only purpose for our survival as a nation has been to throw a wrench in the spokes of the Bush administration at every opportunity. They have done nothing, and have contributed nothing, and you can boldly call that intelligent leadership?

I agree, we need to outsmart the enemy, no doubt about it, and they are beating us at our own game by letting us eat each other alive, remember, divide and conquer, the oldest of war tactics, and they are winning. The left has Bush hating mouths like the major media sources and the Rosie O'donalds making ridiculous claims, and there are those in huge numbers that believe that vile, and when there is a rotten apple in the barrel, it will rot the rest of the apples. The only thing I advocate is that the left become a part of the solution instead of part of the problem. Is Iraq a mistake? As it looks now, it is, but to only be lam-blasted at every turn is not helping our nation fight the terrorists. Their only strategy has been, "we need to leave", and then what? Where's the rest of the puzzle? As an American, I would like to think our leaders have some sort of plan. Do plans always work? Absolutely not, but to plan and fail is tremendously greater than failing to plan, there is at least recourse and change of direction.
Yes exactly, it is time for the right to admit their mistakes and get on programme with the left. It is time that the right dropped the tactics that never work and get with the plan. It's time for the right to stop putting themselves up as targets and get realistic.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 05-28-2007, 05:57 AM
BoogiePeople BoogiePeople is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ashleykennedy";p=&quot View Post
it is time for the right to admit their mistakes and get on programme with the left.
The problem is that the left has no program. Their only "program" has been "We Hate Bush." They have absolutely no clue how to win this war. No clue.

...unless you call "surrender" and "appeasement" a "program."
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 05-28-2007, 06:10 AM
MrWarez MrWarez is offline
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Default There is such a thing as freedom fighters you know!

I'm sick of this lie that is going on. Most people fighting US troops in Iraq are freedom fighters. They are not terrorist. They may use gorilla ware fare tactic but that doesn't make them terrorist. The day the US is way out gun and occupied by a foreign country they will have to use gorilla warfare and terror tactics to fight their enemy, and they would be right to do so because it's the right tactics in those situations. I'm sick of this hypocrisy.

And yes it is all about nation building.. to get Iraq's resources. Proof is that Saddam had nationalized Iraq's resources which means Iraq's oil belong to everyone and it's revenue profited everyone under Saddam. But the Bush admin has privatized Iraq's oil. So now Iraq's most valuable resource is now in the hands of foreigners. How the (*)(*)(*)(*) is that to be good for Iraq huh?

War is a racket and has always been about resources or strategic interest. The Ware on terror is the weakest excuse I've heard to steal an other country's resources.
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Old 05-28-2007, 06:17 AM
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Default Totally miss the point

Quote:
Originally Posted by JP5";p=&quot View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Force-of-the-Truth";p=&quot View Post
Why is there not an outcry? It's simple. Most Americans expect this of Al-Qaeda. Unlike those who have degraded American principles by embracing torture, abandoning due process and so forth, we expect far more of America morally than we do of Al-Qaeda. Apparently we think more of America than oh-so-patriotic neocons do.
Point is----some are awfully quick to believe the worst about thier own country....the U.S. While I believe some bad things happened----I also believe it was individuals and certainly not government sactioned. And many who have done things wrong have been brought up on charges and sentenced. Many are in prison today for what they did.

On the other hand---al Qaeda is an organization that promotes and condones the killing of innocent civilians---and that condones the torture of women and children.....including chopping off heads while someone is alive.
Jp5 and others totally miss this point.

People know that Al Qeada is bad... So they are not shocked to learn that they are bad. So Americans expect a higher standard from America... that is why abu ghraid was such an outrage and an Al Qeada torture manual is not.

This does not show that there are people who want to believe the worse of their country. Nor does restating that Al Qeada is evil change anything.[/quote]
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