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Thread: Apparently Zimmerman is a monster or not, part II

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    [QUOTE=Margot;1061519240]
    Quote Originally Posted by RosePop View Post

    Then George should name the investigators.. That exchange will be in the SPD interview tapes.
    That was my point, but all she kept talking about was a Hannity interview.
    Psychoalphadiscobetabioaquadol oop

    Make my funk the Pfunk, don't won't my funk stepped on.People of power have NO good will and people of good will have NO power.If you think Education is Expensive try Ignorance.Its weak too speak and blame somebody else when you destroy yourself.

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    [QUOTE=superbadbrutha;106151927 1]
    Quote Originally Posted by Margot View Post

    That was my point, but all she kept talking about was a Hannity interview.
    So I made it up, in your mind. Explains alot.
    I miss DonGlock.

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    [QUOTE=RosePop;1061519295]
    Quote Originally Posted by superbadbrutha View Post

    So I made it up, in your mind. Explains alot.
    Didn't say you made it up, just said your source wasn't reliable.
    Psychoalphadiscobetabioaquadol oop

    Make my funk the Pfunk, don't won't my funk stepped on.People of power have NO good will and people of good will have NO power.If you think Education is Expensive try Ignorance.Its weak too speak and blame somebody else when you destroy yourself.

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    I thought this was a pretty good opinion piece by Julian Sanchez

    I think it’s fairly clear, at this point, that the initial police investigation into the killing of Trayvon Martin was shamefully slipshod, and that George Zimmerman’s shaky story needs to be heard and evaluated by a jury, not accepted on faith by sympathetic law enforcement. But I’ve also been mulling the facts that have been made public and trying to figure out if there’s any plausible scenario that makes it genuinely “tragic”—not in the modern sense of “really sad” but in line with the classic Greek formula, where the protagonists come to grief, not as a result of outright wickedness, but flaws in basically decent characters. Is there a way for this to be a story without villains? Having just written that Zimmerman’s actions seemed unreasonable under any believable set of circumstances, I figured I should at least try to come up with a counterexample. Here’s one possibility that seemed plausible—though with luck, an actual jury will soon get to determine what actually happened:

    We start with Zimmerman spotting Martin on the way back from the convenience store and concluding that he seems “suspicious” in light of recent burglaries. Maybe it’s just because he’s an unfamiliar black teenager and Zimmerman is applying a racist stereotype, or maybe there’s something else that Zimmerman misunderstands—the boy is walking slowly to prolong the trip home while he talks to his girlfriend, which on a rainy night, Zimmerman perceives as someone “casing” houses. Failing to understand how creepy his own slow-motion monitoring of the teen from his SUV seems, Zimmerman takes it as a further confirmation of his suspicions when Martin breaks into a run.

    Stupidly disregarding the 911 dispatcher’s advice, Zimmerman gets out of his car to ensure he can point the boy out to police when they arrive. After all, he thinks, if this is the guy who’s been breaking into local houses, it would be crazy to let him slip away to strike again, and he only intends to get a closer look and maybe ask a few questions. This would be dumb, but not inherently criminal. He either approaches Martin, or Martin himself finally decides to confront this determined stranger to demand an explanation for why he’s being followed. Zimmerman, in turn, demands to know “what he’s doing in the neighborhood,” meaning “explain what I regard as suspicious behavior.” Martin seems visibly edgy—as you would be with a creepy stranger tailing you!—and maybe Zimmerman simultaneously exposes the holstered firearm, hoping it will deter the teen from trying anything.

    But Martin isn’t connecting the question with the recent spate of break-ins, which he has no reason to know about: What he hears is a threat from an armed and menacing stranger who has been stalking him from his vehicle, and now sounds angry to see a black teenager in “his” neighborhood. And when Zimmerman exposes the gun, Martin reasonably concludes that he’s about to become the victim of a hate crime.He could run—but he won’t outrun a bullet, and risks being shot in the back. It seems like his only chance is to disable and disarm this nut before he can draw the weapon. It’s a risky gambit, but in another few seconds, Zimmerman will have time to draw the gun and fire, so Martin doesn’t see any other good options. Making a split-second decision, the football player goes for the tackle, thinking he can get the gun away and hold this creep for police.

    Zimmerman, meanwhile, has no idea what Martin is thinking. All he knows is he’s on the ground taking hits from someone who now appears to be going for his gun. He shouts for help but doesn’t see anyone coming, and doesn’t realize the teen had regarded him as an imminent threat. He assumes Martin’s making a grab for the gun in order to use it against him. Panicked, flat on his back, and seeing no alternative, Zimmerman fires.

    This is, obviously, complete speculation, but as far as I can tell, it’s consistent with the public facts—and with the general principle that fear and stupidity are more common than malice. If it’s accurate, both parties would have honestly believed they were acting in self defense. And, incidentally, the “Stand Your Ground” law wouldn’t appear to be relevant, because neither of them would have regarded retreat as a viable option at the time they reasonably believed themselves to be threatened. Again, I think it clearly ought to fall to a jury to figure out whether this is what happened—or at least a believable possibility, once all the evidence is on the table. But I figured it was worth throwing out this scenario as a reminder that we should insist on justice for Trayvon Martin without insisting that we’re certain in advance what that means. We need a real investigation and a trial—not a particular verdict.

    Update: Just in case it wasn’t clear enough, I’m not saying I think this is what happened, or even especially likely compared with other alternatives. I’m just wary of repeating the error of the Stanford police: Seizing on the first version of events that fits the initially available facts, and then locking yourself into that as the only possibility. It is, as a rule, a good idea to generate alternative hypotheses even when you think your first one is probably correct.

    http://www.juliansanchez.com/2012/03...gic-scenarios/
    Really makes you stop and think.
    Psychoalphadiscobetabioaquadol oop

    Make my funk the Pfunk, don't won't my funk stepped on.People of power have NO good will and people of good will have NO power.If you think Education is Expensive try Ignorance.Its weak too speak and blame somebody else when you destroy yourself.

  5. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by superbadbrutha View Post
    I thought this was a pretty good opinion piece by Julian Sanchez



    Really makes you stop and think.
    No, not really, I mean at this point you can never cry again if anyone links to the conservativetreehouse.com.
    I miss DonGlock.

  6. #446
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by superbadbrutha View Post
    I thought this was a pretty good opinion piece by Julian Sanchez

    Really makes you stop and think.
    Yes it does.

    Isn't it ironic, that the Zimmermans are soliciting money because they are afraid of stranger stalkers following them?

  7. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by RosePop View Post
    No, not really, I mean at this point you can never cry again if anyone links to the conservativetreehouse.com.
    Everyone has a right to their opinion, if there is something in her opinion piece you don't like by all means point it out.
    Psychoalphadiscobetabioaquadol oop

    Make my funk the Pfunk, don't won't my funk stepped on.People of power have NO good will and people of good will have NO power.If you think Education is Expensive try Ignorance.Its weak too speak and blame somebody else when you destroy yourself.

  8. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Margot View Post
    Yes it does.

    Isn't it ironic, that the Zimmermans are soliciting money because they are afraid of stranger stalkers following them?
    What is especially ironic is that this type of emotional tripe goes both ways, but the left only remarks upon it as a bad thing when it doesn't fit their agenda.

    For instance, isn't it ironic that Trayvon's mother pretty much immediately began trademarking her dead son's name and slogans with his name in them for profit? Oh but of course, the left has an answer for that! It's not "for profit," it's to "protect the intellectual property surrounding his name, it was actually a very wise and good decision, it had nothing to do with her being a money-grubber out to profit because her son died." How freaking droll.

    So absurdly hypocritical. When the Zimmerman's try to pull in some money because they are on the run and afraid for their lives, they're "money grubbers" and "soliciters," but when Martin's mother--who has no threat of physical harm to her--makes moves in order to profit off of the death of her own son, there's a totally justifiable explanation for it, at least when the left discusses it. How incredibly pathetic. If your arguments and "contributions" (if they can even be called such) were not so incredibly full of double standards and intellectual dishonesty, maybe your posts would actually be taken at least somewhat seriously. Until those posts actually address the issues on both sides though and are willing to be objective and condemn similar behavior on both sides of this argument, it's simply more dishonest leftist Zimmerman lynch-mob tripe. Nothing unusual, really. These forums are full of such nonsense.
    "Rorschach's Journal. October 12th, 1985: Dog carcass in alley this morning, tire tread on burst stomach. This city is afraid of me. I have seen its true face. The streets are extended gutters and the gutters are full of blood and when the drains finally scab over, all the vermin will drown. The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the whores and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' ... and I'll whisper 'no.'"

  9. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Margot View Post
    Yes it does.

    Isn't it ironic, that the Zimmermans are soliciting money because they are afraid of stranger stalkers following them?
    Its amazing Zimmerman acts like this is something somebody has done to him. Everything he is suffering through is because of his own actions.
    Psychoalphadiscobetabioaquadol oop

    Make my funk the Pfunk, don't won't my funk stepped on.People of power have NO good will and people of good will have NO power.If you think Education is Expensive try Ignorance.Its weak too speak and blame somebody else when you destroy yourself.

  10. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by superbadbrutha View Post
    Everyone has a right to their opinion, if there is something in her opinion piece you don't like by all means point it out.
    Yeah, everyone has the right to their opinion, but posting an opinion piece as an article in a debate/online argument achieves nothing more than adding another opinion to the already hundreds of opinions being thrown around there. Does it "make you think?" Maybe. Is it worth actually posting? Probably not. Of course it's your right to post it, but it's a leftist opinion piece, like RosePop said, it's really no different than a conservative member going to some conservative blog and finding a countering opinion piece there and posting it here. Hell, we could all just stop formulating our own opinions and reject rational debate and let other bloggers do it for us. We could start just posting these opinion pieces back and forth instead of actually formulating our own opinions and instead of actually relying on the facts of the case/situation! What a grand idea
    "Rorschach's Journal. October 12th, 1985: Dog carcass in alley this morning, tire tread on burst stomach. This city is afraid of me. I have seen its true face. The streets are extended gutters and the gutters are full of blood and when the drains finally scab over, all the vermin will drown. The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the whores and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' ... and I'll whisper 'no.'"

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