I agree actually. The problem is that the liberal definition of "torture" is unreasonably broad.

Taking pictures of someone naked is hardly torture.



You'll be disappointed.

You see, unlike liberals, WE have no illusions about how horrible our enemies are. So we fully expect them to use torture. Thats why there will be no special outcry when it happens.



They have that license now. How can we give them something they already have?

Thats the main problem with you people...moral equivalency. You keep pretending that they are our moral equals. They are not.

They are morally inferior. So we fully expect them to engage in despicable acts.


Would you say the same thing about rape?

His point is valid...the only difference between you and them is degree. You dont really have a problem with torture, you just think they use it too readily. But technically, you support the use of torture...just like Bush does.


Their position is no less vague than your's. What is "extreme" supposed to mean exactly?

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If I didn't have a problem with torture, I wouldn't oppose its use at all.

Just because I recognize that in some instances committing an evil can prevent a larger evil doesn't mean I don't think the procedure is wrong.

Just like being a supporter of free speech doesn't prevent me from recognizing various legitimate restrictions upon it.

I thought I was clear: only in instances where you're trying to prevent an imminent terrorist attack. By imminent I mean a couple of days, tops.

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Man up.

First off, is anyone really that dense to believe the CIA? I'm not saying they have definitely only tortured 3 people but to take there word for it is foolish. If the "CIA" actually finds itself in a "24" situation it can go ahead and waterboard someone but they should do it in a dark room and we should never hear about it. Our official policy should be that we don't torture, ever.

ok
thats how its always been..

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Like it was new? The point is---it was 3 very high level terrorists, including the mastermind of 9/11. And from all the officials involved and in the know, it definitely saved many American lives. Don't you think their lives were worth a 2 1/2 minutes of waterboarding for KSM---when it didn't kill him or even have any permanent damage? In fact, the man still lives and breathes today....which is more than I can say for all those thousands of innocent Americans he killed.

The use WAS "heavily restricted." THREE terrorists. To hear the liberal media, it was ever terrorists and for no good reason; just for funsies. That was a lie by the libs and media.

And the administration wanted EVERY terrorists to think it may happen to them if they engaged in terrorism. So, what's wrong with that? It's called leverage.

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Am I mistaken, or did you just admit you would be ok with it under "extreme" circumstances?


Great, so I guess you dont have a problem with rape in "extreme" circumstances either?



They arent lying by default.


Oh yeah, thats true. The liberal media lied about torture. I wonder what else they are lying about?

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I would say dead wrong. There are truly only two positions that have been presented in the political realm - [1] only using it in extreme circumstances (3 times) and [2] not using it ever.

There is absolutely nothing evil about scaring a known terrorist for the specific and express purpose of saving lives. We know that this technique was successful and if McCain had his way major terrorists would not have been captured and many now living would be dead.

lol, hard to let go, huh?

are you saying there is a more reasonable way to be broad on this issue?

would you say dont care if one of our men n women get tortured?

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Yes.


Yes we care.

If a rabid dog approaches me, I fully expect it to try to bite me. Becuase its a rabid dog.

That does not mean that I dont care if it bites me.

If we refuse to use torture, it will not prevent our enemiesfrom torturing our men and women themselves.

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I think it would help, wouldn't it?