http://www.helsinginsanomat.fi/engli.../1076154202275
No tässä vasta silmä lepää...

Provided me with quite an amusing read this morning. The "International" edition of the paper is quite limited. If someone is more interested, PM me and I can translate the Finnish language edition.

as well it should. Russia as the Russia Empire and as the Soviet Empire has committed genocide, ethnocide, ethnic cleansing, murder, plunder, environmental crimes, has tried and in cases succeeded in destroying other peoples's language, culture, invaded and occupied other people's lands, and in general has acted like the devil incarnate. If any entity deserves to have anti xxxxxxxx sentiment, Russia does.

The odd thing is that Finns disliked the Russians even more than those who had endured Russian overlordship both under the Empire and the Soviet Union. And distinctly so. The other up and comers were left in the dust with some 42%; Finland had 63% and the Kosovars 72%.

So what is the primary basis of this Dislike of the Russians? It is my understanding that the Rus who originally settled Russia came from Scandinavia. Some form of Vikings?
I regret that my understanding of the North area is limited and the countries are more or less blended into the general term Scandinavia?

NOTE:I'm a strong Finnish nationalist. Remember that when reading my writing. I don't hate Russians, but I do detest their government(s).

I know more about the origins of the Russians and the linguistic background in Finnish (the rare terms which I dare not try and translate ) but I'll give the general picture.
Some history and linguistics

One theory (a quite predominant one) states that the basis of Russian culture was founded by Vikings from the area of Roden and Roth, which is south of modern Stockholm, who raided the areas around Kiev establishing a proto-Russia while at it. Of course, many pro-Slavs vehemently deny this theory.
But these weren't Finns (at least the original inhabitants of Finland).

While the English word for Russia is based of the area Rus where these Vikings came from. The Finnish word isn't. However, the Finnish word for Sweden, Ruotsi, comes from the same root as the English Russia. (In our perspective we had Swedes to the left and right )

The Finnish word for Russia is Venäjä. The word is based on the old (this part is Finnish terms translated to the best of my ability into English) Germanic word weneth-. The Vends (No clue whatsoever what the tribe is called in English) are a slavic people who inhabited the southern areas of the Baltic Sea. Considering Finnic peoples inhabited areas deep into modern Russia, the word must have come via German traders to Finland.
We also have a word for the Russians from the same root (taken from the Swedish language, ryssä, but it is considered derogatory.

More history, and the reason why we Finns have unique resentment of our eastern neighbors

Since the creation of proto-Finland by Sweden around the 1150's in the 'first crusade', the Swedes (and Finns) have been pushing to extend the control of this proto-Finland more and more towards the East, much to the dismay of our eastern neighbors. Achieving in 1293 the line which has more or less marked the boundary of Catholic West (then later Protestant) and the Orthodox East. Though Finns inhabited both the 'Russian' side and the 'Swedish' side, the difference in culture became more and more marked over time.

The border of Finland has been a long contested front, changing constantly over the years. Some major dates, though remember skirmishes were constant and there are plenty of lesser wars before this point.
- 1293, Swedes reach Karelia.
- 1323, Swedes lose some land. The peace of Pähkinäsaari (Peanut Island) divides Finland between the 'Russians' and Swedes.
- Much fighting but no border changes. But much fighting.
- 1721, we lose (note my choice of words) Karelia for the first time to the Russians.
- 1809, the rest of Finland falls to Russia due to the inability of the Swedish monarch and his choice of military commanders.
- NOTE: Finns were mostly happy under the Russian Empire, as we had a special status of autonomy, but it was revoked and the policy of Russification was initiated, royally pissing off the Finns, leading to ideas of independence.
- 1918, Bolsheviks use military units to try and bring Finland back to mother Russia, they fail.
- 1918 > 1921, Finnish volunteer expeditions try to include certain elements of White Sea Karelia into Finland. A mixture of locals and Bolsheviks fight them off.
- 1939-1940, the Winter War....
- 1941-1944, the Continuation War...
- NOTE: Practically all Finns have a relative (or several) who fought the Russians in one of these two wars.
- 1947, the Paris peace treaty is nothing to bask about with its heavy terms.
- 1944 > 1990, 50 odd years living in the shadow of a hostile nuclear power with marked intentions to include Finland in its imperial possessions. ('Winter Frost' crisis...)

It should be pretty clear why we have a special place for the Russians in our hearts.
To conclude, I'll include a little story. A while back, we had a field trip to the city museum for history class. In my class there is one foreigner, who doesn't speak Finnish , for who I'm a de facto translator. I translated a placard under a picture that explained a Russian cavalry invasion towards Helsinki in the 1400s. Then he said:
"You know, it seems like all of Finland's problems are caused by Russia."
And in a crude way, historically, he's pretty close to the mark.

I THINK that the Vends refer to what were a Western Slavic tribe. I also THINK that they are related, or perhaps are, the "Sorb" (not Serb) people in the Lausitz area of Germany. But I could easily be wrong.
If they are the same as the "Wends" (in German), then they actually had a significant group immigrate to Texas in 1854 searching for religious freedom. They settled in Lee county.

I really appreciate your historical information. I truly find it very interesting. We Americans are so insulated from the goings on in most of the rest of the world that, unless we target a specific area for study, we find ourselves totally ignorant about the history of others. I suspect that the Scandinavian area is a particularly obscure part of the world for us. Yet, much of European and Eastern cultures and history have been significantly affected by the "North People". I found your brief history interesting enough to find what appears to be a Russian viewpoint on Karelia.

http://www.karelia.ru/Karelia/Official/chap3_e.html

One thing that strikes me in your historical information, is how Different and Contentious the people of such a relatively small area seem to be. I am certain that my impression is totally influenced from being an American and having the experience of a large country that is essentially homogenous in culture. We have our differences, North/South East/West, but except for the War Between the States, we have usually gotten along.
But the peoples of the "Old World" have developed markedly different cultures in relatively small areas. And Warred forever in relatively small areas. It is really interesting!

Thanks again. I would love to learn more.

An Aside........What the Hell does "SporkLord" stand for??????

Are Laplanders Finns? And do their women still castrate reindeer with their teeth?

Could easily be so. I only know the general stuff, not the details.
And in German my book says that they were called Wenden. The same book also states that this name was a general name for slavs in ancient German.
They even apparently had their own language, spoken until WWII. (!)
No problem, it only takes a few minutes for me to write it up. Maybe a few more to check a fact or two, but not too long.
One reason Scandinvian (+ Finnish) history has not infiltrated the anglo-saxon world is that very little about it is written in English. Most books I find/read on it in English are either error-riddled or lacking.
For example, the Soviet offensive in 1944 on the Karelian front (timed with the landing in Normandy to attract less attention) involved huge amounts of Soviet resources; the battle of Tali-Ihantala (the largest battle ever in Fenno-Scandinavia) dwarfs the battle of El-Alamein which is often heralded as a huge battle in English history books.
A way to test a good history book (this techinique has been tested and proven) is to administer the "Finland test". Go to the back index, look up Finland, and read those pages. If the information in those pages about Finland is accurate, then the book stands a good chance on being accurate and well-researched.
America is completely different.
I can't think of a way to explain this, but America is more of an exception than a rule. The "Old World" is different because it is "old". Most, if not all feuds that have led to conflicts are older than America itself.
In America there has always been the 'basic' British colonist component of the population to absorb whatever newcomers until they were absorbed, the cycle repeating. In Europe there is no 'basic' component capable of absorbing the rest, though some smaller tribes have been absorbed into larger ones by this means.
Also, if I'm not mistaken didn't many German Americans rebel in the first years of independence?
http://www.politicalforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=2692

Two distinctly different ethnic groups. The Lapps make up a miniscule 0.11% of the Finnish population, yet they are tourist magnets. Lapps also live in Sweden and Norway, I think Sweden might have more Lapps than we do.
And for the second part, what do you think?

I was unaware of this battle. Thanks.

Yeaup :+)

We HAVE had disruptions of the general societal calm on occasion. Most were small historical blips that blew over relatively soon. My ancestors, the Irish come to mind. But after the inevitable culture clash, these groups were gradually absorbed and are now Hyphen-Americans.

But with Europe, and that includes Scandinavia, tiny areas have maintained their individuality, culture, and Biases against their neighbors for centuries. It just seems bizarre for tiny areas like the individual parts of the old Yugoslavia to maintain and nurse the differences and hatreds all this time. You would think that living in such close proximity in the modern world, with the surfeit of communications available, these differences would fade. Sure would eliminate a lot of suffering and hardship!!!!
I was just commenting on it because it has always amazed me.