Dems To End Great Education for D.C. Underprivileged Kids - Page 3

Birdzeye · #21 (**permalink**) 03-09-2009, 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keymanjim

And there you have it. The liberal mantra, 'throw more money at it'.

Instead of giving Jellah a straightforward answer, you distorted what he said. Jellah didn't call for throwing more money at the problem.

Rebellion · #22 (**permalink**) 03-09-2009, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Birdzeye

I don't understand why the righties who are so aghast at any hint of "socialism" are so enamored of school vouchers. After all, you are taking taxes from the people, and then returning the money to them - with strings attached. What can be more "socialist" than vouchers?

I'm sure we'll soon hear the RW spin.

Socialism is taking money from someone and saying "you must go here." Socialism is government control. Vouchers are choice without government control. I can't imagine it being any more clear than that.

Birdzeye · #23 (**permalink**) 03-09-2009, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rebellion

Socialism is taking money from someone and saying "you must go here." Socialism is government control. Vouchers are choice without government control. I can't imagine it being any more clear than that.

What about the part where the government takes the money away from the taxpayer, and then hands it back, with strings attached (telling the taxpayer how it will be spent, in this case, on school tuition)?

I knew I could expect to hear some RW spin. Thanks for not letting me down in that department.

Rebellion · #24 (**permalink**) 03-09-2009, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Birdzeye

What about the part where the government takes the money away from the taxpayer, and then hands it back, with strings attached (telling the taxpayer how it will be spent, in this case, on school tuition)?

I knew I could expect to hear some RW spin. Thanks for not letting me down in that department.

The government is taking it from the taxpayer right now. The difference is we only get it back if we go where they tell us to. Under vouchers we go where we want.

The only spin is in your presentation. Using your "logic" that would mean Republicans claim all taxes are socialist. Which they do not.

Birdzeye · #25 (**permalink**) 03-09-2009, 11:23 AM

And isn't that what school vouchers do, give it back with strings attached (spend it on education or don't get the money back)?

Look, if the government is handing out school vouchers and you accept them, fine. Just don't try to insult others' intelligence by trying to portray this as something other than the "socialism" that you decry whenever the government does something you don't like. Maybe that's the true definition of "socialism:" any government program that conservatives dislike.

TastyWheat · #26 (**permalink**) 03-09-2009, 11:36 AM

I don't know if any voucher systems work this way, but the way they should be implemented is people who want their children to go to a private school should get back a percentage (less than 100%) of the money already being spent on their children in the public school system. If implemented this way, public schools receive more funding PER STUDENT the more vouchers that are redeemed. It's a win-win situation, but some politicians don't like the idea of poor people being informed and well-educated. An ignorant electorate is their bread and butter.

JP5 · #27 (**permalink**) 03-09-2009, 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jellah

There are serious problems with voucher programs. Public schools are paid for via taxes...so why would public monies be going to private schools? Why wouldnt they take the money they use on vouchers and pay to private schools and use that money to improve the public schools instead...the place the public money is intended to go to in the first place?

Mainly because they've thrown tons and tons of money over the decades to the public school system to no avail. And you're wrong about this program taking something away from the public school system; it does not. That was the original agreement with this scholarship program----that whatever they spent for these kids to go to this private school, none of it would be taken away from the public school system.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jellah

Vouchers is yet another way to make the public pay into the pockets of private interests that are sopposed to be supported via private money and not public money. This of course then takes money away from the public schools to support private ventures and private education.

So, what do you call taking tax dollars from the public and NOT providing a decent public school system as promised?

JP5 · #28 (**permalink**) 03-09-2009, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jellah

Thats not a problem you fix by handing tax money to private interests.

Then how? They've thrown more and more money to the problem and even George W. Bush tried to hold teachers and administrators accountable for performance; but the teachers unions and Democrats fight all that tooth and nail. Bottom line is: they want to continuing taking our tax dollars while NOT doing their jobs.

How long would you stick with a corporation that was NOT providing the services you were paying for????

Rebellion · #29 (**permalink**) 03-09-2009, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Birdzeye

And isn't that what school vouchers do, give it back with strings attached (spend it on education or don't get the money back)?

Look, if the government is handing out school vouchers and you accept them, fine. Just don't try to insult others' intelligence by trying to portray this as something other than the "socialism" that you decry whenever the government does something you don't like. Maybe that's the true definition of "socialism:" any government program that conservatives dislike.

No, strings attached are they take the money and you go to what school they say. No strings attached means you get the money and go to the school of your choice. Property taxes are collected specifically for schools. And that is what vouchers use them for.

You obviously have absolutely no idea what socialism is. Here is a dictionary. I hope this clears up your blatantly obvious mistakes. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/socialism

Quote:

a theory or system of social organization that advocates the vesting of the ownership and control of the means of production and distribution, of capital, land, etc., in the community as a whole.

Vouchers do not fit into the above. There is no central control. Do you get it yet?

When you can prove that Republicans call all taxes socialism you will have a point. Until that day, it is moot.

Birdzeye · #30 (**permalink**) 03-09-2009, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rebellion

No, strings attached are they take the money and you go to what school they say. No strings attached means you get the money and go to the school of your choice. Property taxes are collected specifically for schools. And that is what vouchers use them for.

You obviously have absolutely no idea what socialism is. Here is a dictionary. I hope this clears up your blatantly obvious mistakes. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/socialism

Vouchers do not fit into the above. There is no central control. Do you get it yet?

When you can prove that Republicans call all taxes socialism you will have a point. Until that day, it is moot.

No strings attached means they don't tell you how you may spend what used to be your money. No strings attached would mean that you could spend the money however you please, whether for kids' school tuition or a freekin' vacation at Club Med.

Vouchers have strings attached: they tell you how you may spend the money.

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