I have similar examples as you do. I had one teacher in 6th grade that used to paddle students who got out of line in front of the other students. I would never support that even though I believe in spanking if parents so choose. But I don't think it was a coincidence that he consistently produced the best test scores of any teacher whereas the stoner in the class next to him who only wanted to be your friend and consistenly produced the worst scores.

It's anecdotal, but it also makes complete sense that the ones who are disciplined and makes kids focus will produce the best scores while those who let them run wild will not. Unfortunately some teacher's hands are tied by parents who do nothing but make excuses for their kids and principles/school districts who won't support them. Time to get tough.

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JMS gets another English lesson:

Quote:

there is no "mostly unique;" thats like saying "sometimes always," its an oxymoron - its either one or the other.

The result:

Quote:

By the mid-19th century unique had developed a wider meaning, “not typical, unusual,” and it is in this wider sense that it is compared. The comparison of so-called absolutes in senses that are not absolute is standard in all varieties of speech and writing.

not that we are not teaching effectively. The real reason is a much bigger and terrifying.

The reason other countries graduate more students is because that is their way of improving their lives. We as a society have such a better quality of life, that we take for granted the things we have. Kids are not learning because THEY DO NOT WANT TO. Ask a few kids if they think going to school will give them better opportunities and a better quality of life, many of them will tell you school is useless.

We glorify not attending school in some parts of our culture. The reason poorer students do not get as good of an education as wealthier students is motivation/incentive to go to school. Millions of American kids believe that school will not make a difference in their lives. It is irrelevant to them. If they were not forced to go by law, they would drop out at much younger ages, which is actually happening more and more.

Many kids believe that they do not need school to make a better life for themselves, or they do not believe their life will ever get better. That is saddest reason of all. Great multitudes of kids have no hope for a better life because of everything they see around them. Many do not believe they will live long enough to worry about the future.

The biggest and most destructive reason is that we as a nation are not being parents to our kids. I did not say good parents, because many of us are not evening being parents in the first place. Kids grow up without Fathers, Mothers, Role models, or grow up in environments that are destructive, deadly and depressing. They grow up with no hope of being anything more than they are.

I will not even get into drugs, marketing targeting children, teen pregnancy, or the fact many children just do not care about school. We as a society allow them to make choices they are not mature enough to make because we are so PC. Parents can go to jail for disciplining their children or invading their privacy. Not only are many of us not parenting our children, but society is slowly taking away our rights to parent our children. We turn out kids into the world unprepared to survive in a world they know nothing about.

We rob them of their childhoods to make them adults long before they are ready to be. We allow them to use technology as a babysitter. We are not there for them for many hours of each day.

So, the next time someone says " it is abuse to spank your child", or "you can not make your child do that" or ........... think about it for a minute, before turning around and with your next breath saying "our education system in America is terrible". The real abuse is that we are not preparing our children for their future. We, not the schools.

If left up to you when you were 12 years old, what would you choose: A) go to school or B) go fishing, swimming, bike riding, snowboarding, skateboarding ........

These children are being left with those decisions, instead of us as parents making those decisions for them until they are at an age where they can make responsible decisions for themselves. And we are legislating ourselves right out of their lives entirely.

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"It aint over, till it's over"

what I was inferring is that parenting has a direct correlation to the success of our school system (or lack thereof). And parents can be blaimed for much of its failures. If kids don't believe they have a chance at success by going to school then whose fault is that? They are wrong, it has direct correlation to success.

There are cultural issues as well which say you must make a ton of money now and many aren't willing to work their way up the chain. There is a sense of entitlement. But too often most time is spent by teachers defending their actions when they discipline a child instead of the parent working with the teacher in improving their behavior. The school district should have more leeway (or use the leeway they have) to enforce conduct code in schools and if it pisses off the parents then tough luck.

__________________
JMS gets another English lesson:

Quote:

there is no "mostly unique;" thats like saying "sometimes always," its an oxymoron - its either one or the other.

The result:

Quote:

By the mid-19th century unique had developed a wider meaning, “not typical, unusual,” and it is in this wider sense that it is compared. The comparison of so-called absolutes in senses that are not absolute is standard in all varieties of speech and writing.

But I know what the problem is NOT. The problem is not that we do not spend enough money on education. China and India do not spend a whole lot of money on education, yet they have become better at educating their citizens because people want to learn. Today, Americans just don't feel like learning. And this is really not a new concept either. Traditionally, the US has not exactly been a powerhouse when it came to education. In fact, for a long time most citizens either farmed for a living or went into manufacturing, which didn't require a formal education at all. So if anything, things have kind of stayed the same when some would argue that we need to change to keep up with new priorities in the world.