Political Forum
     

Go Back   Political Forum > Political Issues > Warfare / Military > Diplomacy & Conflict Resolution


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 03-10-2008, 09:45 PM
f0ca1's Avatar
f0ca1 f0ca1 is offline
Guru
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: The Greatest City in the world
Posts: 3,199
usa us new york
f0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud of
Credits: 12,687
Default Iraqis still ask if U.S. invasion was worth it

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080311/lf_nm/iraq_war_dc

Quote:
The human cost is staggering -- anywhere between 90,000 and 1 million Iraqi civilians killed, according to various estimates; nearly 4,000 U.S. soldiers dead; while 4 million Iraqis are displaced.

Americans, too.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Red Cross - Donate Today    Save the Rainforest
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 03-10-2008, 09:49 PM
commonsense's Avatar
commonsense commonsense is offline
Commentator
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,096
usa us texas
commonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to behold
Credits: 6,249
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by f0ca1 View Post
We should have applied the Truman Doctrine, it is a be all to end all with our superpower stance in global affairs. No war, less economic involvement, and less resultant hatred to America.
__________________
"We've been blowin up, we're the issue, we're ammunition" Switchfoot
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 03-10-2008, 09:58 PM
f0ca1's Avatar
f0ca1 f0ca1 is offline
Guru
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: The Greatest City in the world
Posts: 3,199
usa us new york
f0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud of
Credits: 12,687
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by commonsense View Post
We should have applied the Truman Doctrine, it is a be all to end all with our superpower stance in global affairs. No war, less economic involvement, and less resultant hatred to America.
At the very least, if the administration felt so strongly that action was needed, we should have used the international body we founded to address exactly such situations.

To share the burden, to share the responsibility, to lend world-wide legitimacy, etc...
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 03-10-2008, 10:00 PM
commonsense's Avatar
commonsense commonsense is offline
Commentator
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,096
usa us texas
commonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to behold
Credits: 6,249
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by f0ca1 View Post
At the very least, if the administration felt so strongly that action was needed, we should have used the international body we founded to address exactly such situations.

To share the burden, to share the responsibility, to lend world-wide legitimacy, etc...
Meaning the UN?
__________________
"We've been blowin up, we're the issue, we're ammunition" Switchfoot
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 03-10-2008, 10:02 PM
f0ca1's Avatar
f0ca1 f0ca1 is offline
Guru
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: The Greatest City in the world
Posts: 3,199
usa us new york
f0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud of
Credits: 12,687
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by commonsense View Post
Meaning the UN?
Yes.

Perhaps the process would have stopped us altogether.

But, now that we've gone and invaded outside of the UN, we bare all the costs, human and otherwise...
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 03-10-2008, 10:16 PM
commonsense's Avatar
commonsense commonsense is offline
Commentator
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,096
usa us texas
commonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to behold
Credits: 6,249
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by f0ca1 View Post
Yes.

Perhaps the process would have stopped us altogether.

But, now that we've gone and invaded outside of the UN, we bare all the costs, human and otherwise...
It would be wise to consult the UN on all world affairs. It would also appease those nations whose ideologies we so desperately try to contain within their borders - this should be America's concern.

There will be some or many who hate me for saying this, but I believe I must: The wars of America, against oppressors, against dictators, and against evil will create repercussions so strong no nation or cooperation of nations will save her from the sheer turmoil and distress she has caused the world. I don't blame anyone in America for this, I am an American, I also take responsibility for our actions. Granted we have brought peace, which is always our motive, but out of peace comes pacification. It is a known fact pacification is impossible based on the standard laws of entropy. We fight an indomitable war with a common enemy we will never see. That enemy never changes, it has always been, and always will be that which is antithesis to ourselves.
__________________
"We've been blowin up, we're the issue, we're ammunition" Switchfoot

Last edited by commonsense; 03-10-2008 at 10:18 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 03-10-2008, 10:20 PM
f0ca1's Avatar
f0ca1 f0ca1 is offline
Guru
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: The Greatest City in the world
Posts: 3,199
usa us new york
f0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud of
Credits: 12,687
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by commonsense View Post
... That enemy never changes, it has always been, and always will be that which is antithesis to ourselves.
Well Said.

I would add that the only way we could ever fail in the face of such an enemy is to abandon our systems for their's.
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 03-10-2008, 10:23 PM
commonsense's Avatar
commonsense commonsense is offline
Commentator
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,096
usa us texas
commonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to behold
Credits: 6,249
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by f0ca1 View Post
Well Said.

I would add that the only way we could ever fail in the face of such an enemy is to abandon our systems for their's.
Although we could live in cooperation. I applaud you for your insight, it makes one think revolution, does it not? Perhaps a future leftist one?
__________________
"We've been blowin up, we're the issue, we're ammunition" Switchfoot

Last edited by commonsense; 03-10-2008 at 10:23 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 03-10-2008, 10:42 PM
f0ca1's Avatar
f0ca1 f0ca1 is offline
Guru
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: The Greatest City in the world
Posts: 3,199
usa us new york
f0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud off0ca1 has much to be proud of
Credits: 12,687
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by commonsense View Post
Although we could live in cooperation. I applaud you for your insight, it makes one think revolution, does it not? Perhaps a future leftist one?


The greatest facet of our system is that it anoints nothing permanantly; it's always a revolution of sorts; within boundaries of the constitution.

Personally, I think a the result of a leftist revolution would be instability, uncertainty, and the potential for other, subsequent revolutions; we could end up with Napolean, so to speak.

The American citizenry gets a bad rap these days; we are nothing if not busy folks, and in that way, many have rather myopic views of their part in whatever we are collectively.

My sense, or perhaps my hope, is that the younger generations, with it's easy access to information, will be more aware and more vigilant about the proceedings of government, and the higher purposes of business, etc.

I hate to bring up Ron Paul, because that name is now stigmatized by the phenomenon that never materialized; but I have a strong feeling that he will be a Goldwater-esque figure that will be remembered, again by the younger generation.

Now, I fundamentally disagree with him on the role of government, and his interpretation of the constitution; but he has a philosophical framework that is sound, unlike much of the right these days.

I think that consistency moreso than the man's specific policy ideas, is why he hit the viral-node.

On the left, there are many inconsistencies; re: John Kerry, for it/against it.

But with Howard Dean at the helm of the party, another revolutionary candidate who never truly materialized as an individual, the democrats are poised to offer an equal but opposite consistency, particularly in the younger generations.


These two philosophical frameworks are exactly the argument the constitution requires on the role of government, domestically.

But, on international matters, the differences are stunningly minimal; there are some related to economics, but few related to the use of force, etc.

So, yes, revolution is always in the air; when it's not, hope is truly lost.

Last edited by f0ca1; 03-10-2008 at 10:43 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 03-10-2008, 11:02 PM
commonsense's Avatar
commonsense commonsense is offline
Commentator
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,096
usa us texas
commonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to beholdcommonsense is a splendid one to behold
Credits: 6,249
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by f0ca1 View Post
My sense, or perhaps my hope, is that the younger generations, with it's easy access to information, will be more aware and more vigilant about the proceedings of government, and the higher purposes of business, etc..
Certainly, we all hope for this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by f0ca1 View Post
These two philosophical frameworks are exactly the argument the constitution requires on the role of government, domestically.
Please expand, I'm not sure I understand your idea here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by f0ca1 View Post
But, on international matters, the differences are stunningly minimal; there are some related to economics, but few related to the use of force, etc.
International economics would be a major motivating force for something like this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by f0ca1 View Post
So, yes, revolution is always in the air; when it's not, hope is truly lost.
Another good observation.
__________________
"We've been blowin up, we're the issue, we're ammunition" Switchfoot
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
well, is it worth it? nonsqtr Current Events 1 09-14-2007 07:46 AM
Was it worth it onelungdsapper Political Opinions & Beliefs 7 05-22-2007 11:08 AM
Bush tells Barbara Walters invasion was worth it... redneck Security & Defenses 42 03-13-2007 12:07 AM
Iranian Invasion - the Sequel to Iraqi Invasion justabubba Current Events 12 07-28-2006 02:44 AM
Was it worth it? stekim Current Events 19 03-22-2006 08:12 AM

Sponsored Links

All times are GMT -8. The time now is 12:46 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0
Template-Modifikationen durch TMS
vBCredits v1.3 ©2007 by Darkwaltz4
Advertisement System V2.1 By   Branden