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Old 04-20-2006, 01:31 PM
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Default Brain washing for 7 year olds

http://www.boston.com/news/local/art...gay_storybook/

Quote:
Parents rip school over gay storybook
Lesson reignites clash in Lexington
By Tracy Jan, Globe Staff | April 20, 2006

In a controversy with a familiar ring, parents of a Lexington second-grader are protesting that their son's teacher read a fairy tale about gay marriage to the class without warning parents first.

The teacher at Joseph Estabrook Elementary School used the children's book, ''King & King," as part of a lesson about different types of weddings. A prince marries another prince instead of a princess in the book, which was on the American Library Association's list of the 10 most challenged books in 2004 because of its homosexual theme.

''My son is only 7 years old," said Lexington parent Robin Wirthlin, who complained to the school system last month and will meet with the superintendent next week. ''By presenting this kind of issue at such a young age, they're trying to indoctrinate our children. They're intentionally presenting this as a norm, and it's not a value that our family supports."

Lexington Superintendent of Schools Paul Ash said Estabrook has no legal obligation to notify parents about the book. ''We couldn't run a public school system if every parent who feels some topic is objectionable to them for moral or religious reasons decides their child should be removed," he said. ''Lexington is committed to teaching children about the world they live in, and in Massachusetts same-sex marriage is legal."

In ''King & King," two princes kiss at the end of the book, which was first published in the Netherlands then translated into English and published by the Berkeley, Calif.-based Tricycle Press in 2002. The book was written for children ages 6 and older, the publisher said. Tricycle Press also published ''Who's in a Family?"
"Teaching them about the world we live in." Nice smoke screen. More like indoctrination of liberal values. These same people would have a fit if the world we lived in included teaching about Christian beliefs. The world we live in also includes people who smoke crack, should we have a king and queen smoking a rock in a book for kids? This is between parents and their kids and not for the school to decide. If they want to teach it fine, but they should notify the parents so that they can pull them out instead of the Hitler youth policy they're trying to use now.
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Old 04-20-2006, 01:47 PM
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I agree that teaching children in that way is unpardonable. It would be equally unpardonable to teach children that homosexuals are sinners. This is a matter of religious ethics and neither public money nor public schools should sway the argument either way. It is, as you stated, an issue that should be completely up to the discretion of parents. This doesn't, as some might claim, represent a pattern of secularist indoctrination (I've heard of only one similar case here in Oregon, and these things make the news) but rather a teacher who doesn't respect the children they teach or the parents of those children. They should be fired for this, and I write as a supporter of gay marriage. I don't want public money used to indoctrinate- period.
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Old 04-20-2006, 01:53 PM
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Default I agree

we definitely don't need to teach kids homosexuality is a sin, some believe that and some don't, it's for the parents to decide. But you can be sure if a school in the south did teach that under the guise that "it's the world we live in" the screaming would be loud from the left. But this isn't just a teacher, but a superintendent for this particular disctrict. Not coincidentally there have been several problems with this in Mass, all from his district.
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Old 04-20-2006, 01:58 PM
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There obviously needs to be new leadership in that district. This is another good argument for school vouchers, in my opinion.
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Old 04-20-2006, 02:10 PM
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Default ...

It's tricky.
We can't teach kids one way or the other on how to think of homosexuals...
But we need to get them used to the fact that it is not a crime, they must tolerate it insofar as to live and let live, and they may some day have to share a worksite or school with gay people.
We have to teach them that it is reality and that they have to respect homosexuals as humans regardless of what they think of the actions.
That's tricky.
We could start by trying to get kids to respect all human beings as human beings...
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Old 04-20-2006, 02:16 PM
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That's up to parents to decide. The KKK has the right to say and think what they like, it doesn't mean we need to show comic books with crosses burning to show that people with these beliefs exist and we should respect their opinions. Christians believe that homosexuality is a sin, it doesn't mean we should have cartoons showing a gay person's soul surrounded by flames and imps. Some like sex with barn animals, we don't need a book with that in it either. There are many people with a variety of opinions, it doesn't mean they all need to be taught and it definitely doesn't mean that one side should be taught. If some want their 7 year olds involved in sexual discussions in school then fine, the parent has the right to be told and have their kids taken out. It is their child, not the state's.
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Coal-to-liquid R's: 90% YES. D's: 78% NO.
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Outer Continental Shelf Exploration R's: 81% YES. D's: 83% NO.
Increased Refinery Capacity R's: 97% YES. D's: 96% NO

SUMMARY: 91% of House Republicans have historically voted to increase the production of America’s own oil and gas. 86% of House Democrats have historically voted against.
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Old 04-20-2006, 02:48 PM
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Quote:
In a controversy with a familiar ring, parents of a Lexington second-grader are protesting that their son's teacher read a fairy tale about gay marriage to the class without warning parents first.
Wow...no one even tried to make a joke about the "fairy" tale part, heh heh

Even I am tempted by that opening.
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Old 09-21-2006, 06:51 PM
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Default Your bigotry is the root of all evil

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rebellion";p=&quot View Post
"Teaching them about the world we live in." Nice smoke screen. More like indoctrination of liberal values. These same people would have a fit if the world we lived in included teaching about Christian beliefs. The world we live in also includes people who smoke crack, should we have a king and queen smoking a rock in a book for kids? This is between parents and their kids and not for the school to decide. If they want to teach it fine, but they should notify the parents so that they can pull them out instead of the Hitler youth policy they're trying to use now.
So you're saying we SHOULDN'T warn kids about drugs?

Starting with that ridiculous premise, lets move on. If people want their children to be completely insulated from the real world- where, by the way, there are in fact, real-life homosexuals -then they should have them home school. In a church.

Look at where this school is. Lexington, Massachusetts. That was the first state to judicially recognize that the 14th amendment applies to EVERYONE, and people who myths from the Bible call "baddy baddy bad bad BAD!" are NOT exempt from the 14th amendment. Your religious fairy tales have no place in schools, certainly not in regards to what progressive schools include in their curriculum. Your fear of homosexuals does not extend to the entire world; if these people don't want their children to know about homosexuality, then I have a feeling that central Massachusetts was NOT a good option for them.

And, fortunately for the rest of us, there are people who understand that homosexuals are HUMANS, they are American citizens, they get divorced at a far lower rate than heterosexuals, they sure as heck have fewer abortions, their crime rate is about a third that of heterosexuals, a heterosexual has never been the victim of a gay-on-straight hate crime in American judicial history (but how many times has that been reversed, eh cheek-turning neighbor-loving fanatic?), and yet your kind insists that they are a scum, a slime, an infection on society.

People with attitudes like yours cause Holocausts. If you had your way, how many dead homosexuals would be in the landfills? How many atheists would be shot in the streets? If you had your way, what sort of cruel, intolerant world would it be? Don't you understand that a 7-year old learning about homosexuals is a good thing? It means the end of bigotry. It marks the first step towards the elimination of American-hating-American on arbitrary grounds of make-believe (religious faith). We need to protect children from baseless fear and irrational hatred, NOT from tolerance and acceptance.

Be ashamed of yourself, and be ashamed of your faith. Examine the reasons for your bigotry: your God tells you so. Your God, who created homosexuality. Your God, who designed a universe in which two men will have sex with each other. Your mind contains several logiclly contradictory, mutuallly exclusive propositions: homosexuality is evil. God created the universe. The universe contains homosexuality. God is good?
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Old 09-21-2006, 07:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rebellion";p=&quot View Post
That's up to parents to decide. The KKK has the right to say and think what they like, it doesn't mean we need to show comic books with crosses burning to show that people with these beliefs exist and we should respect their opinions.
But the superintendent has a point. KKK parents would object to the school reading a book that implies blacks are equal to whites. Sunni Muslims might object to a book that suggests there's nothing wrong with Shiite Islam. Male chauvinists might object to a book suggesting women are capable of leading governments and corporations. Feminazis might object to books that suggest men aren't dangerous evolutionary leftovers.

So what *can* they read? Where do you draw the line?

Religion is different, because of church-state issues. But schools still study religions. Heck, I bet a lot of schools read Narnia books this past year, despite the fact that their Christian allegories.

Also, one book is not indoctrination.

Quote:
If some want their 7 year olds involved in sexual discussions in school then fine, the parent has the right to be told and have their kids taken out. It is their child, not the state's.
Why do you consider this a sexual discussion? Would you consider a prince-princess book a sexual discussion? Is Snow White or Cinderella or any of the other "handsome prince" fairy tales unsuitable for kids?
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Old 08-03-2007, 03:47 PM
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couldn't agree more with ChrisRay6000, and the parents are all scared of them brainwashing their children, when if they take them to church at that young of an age, what do you call that? I call it Brainwashing.
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