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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 04-01-2008, 11:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Qwerty View Post
IMO, Intelligent Design seems a bit vague in it's "theory". The evidence they provide is evidence to disprove other theories. While evolutionist are trying to piece all the pieces together and determine all the evolutionary paths, I've yet to see any big works put forward by IDers to establish what species were designed, and what ones were variations of natural selection.

I hear some say all dogs are from the same species. They'll accept that natural selection can change them from breed to breed. but I've never seen any IDer show a theory to what the original Dog looked like. What was the Dogs first design from the "designer". Maybe it's been done for dogs and I just haven't seen it, but you got to start working on ALL species.

Honestly, if you want your hypothesis taken seriously, you got to do some leg work. Half (*) jobs are unacceptable.

ID should not be taught in school, it's a mockery of Science.
How is it mockery do you believe that men know all science?
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 04-01-2008, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Sickntiredofliblies View Post
Since evolution involves so much time, our labs have not existed long enough for such an experiment. We have plenty of evidence that supports evolution while we have a big fat 0 of proving such a creator exists.

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/comd...ogeography_ex1
Really well scientists can create the basics of life in a lab so why couldn't someone who knows more science create it on a larger scale?
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Old 04-01-2008, 11:35 AM
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im for intelligent design in schools, not creationism... and theres plenty of things that evolution leaves out. can you explain how life evolved from non life? or the evolution of the dna?
Scientists have been able to add vast amounts of energy to a nutrient rich solution and the fundaments of life (I.E. nucleotides) formed in that bath. This however does not mean that God or a Creator could not have done it in planetine preportions.
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Old 04-01-2008, 11:41 AM
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This is a fascinating subject one that I take personal interest in all the time because I am a scientist but also I am very religious. I believe that God might have used evolution to bring the world into being. Think about the accounts of moses and how they correlate to science if one was viewing it through Moses' eyes. (Remember they related everything they saw to stuff that they knew)

"In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth" it is common knowledge that heaven at this time was believed to be the sky so substitute. " in the beginning God created the sky and the earth" what do scientists describe earth as when it finally cooled? A large mass of land with volcanic clouds the earth and the sky respectively.

"And god said let there be light and there was light" Well when the clouds started to thin and the sun started to shine through light would appear wouldn't it?

"...and god divided the light from the darkness" Obviously when the line of night crossed the view of Moses (We can assume he had an omniscient point of view)

"And god said let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters and let it divide the waters from the waters" well first we can assume that water existed from the period in the history of the earth that is described as rain for thousands of years. Then volcanic activity raised vapor from the midst of the waters and separated them into their own areas water vapor for clouds "Heaven" and water for earth.

"And God said, let the waters under heaven" (the ocean) "Be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear" So volcanic activity finally pushed its way up to the surface and created the land mass known as pangea. Now remember that a celestial day is the equivilent of 1000 years of our time and during all this time things had the ability to "evolve" in the oceans all under Gods supervision but invisible to Moses.

"And God said let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed... and it was so." well at this time the earth had all it needed to start supporting life so grass grew and seeds started to appear with trees and so on. All still while the clouds were covering the sun and stars and so on but to a far less extent.

"And God made two great lights the greater light to rule the day" (The sun finally breaking through the clouds) "and the lesser light to rule the night" (the moon became visible too)

"And god said let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life" The ocean is the cradel of life and has been for a while now according to scientists. This proves it in the Bible. So all while Moses was seeing the clearing of the atmosphere and the growth of plants the more complex organisms had time to grow capable of living on land.

"And god said let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind..." the evolution of the species that allowed them to best adapt to their environment.

"And God said Let us make man in our image after our likeness...male and female created he them" to this day there is no scientific proof that man has evolved from any species in earths history he is unique. This is the one act of creation that is not founded by science as we can't find the common ancestor.

I do not say we evolved from monkeys as that is absurd but there is a basis for evolution in religion and science. (Just a thought by me no offense intended)
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Old 04-01-2008, 11:58 AM
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You didn't answer my question "Why not?"
yeah, i did. its not science. thats why.
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f0ca1 refuses to erase my name from his signature....I believe that b/c I am a member, if I ask for him to remove it, he should. Of course, most normal and sympathetic individuals would have enough common courtesy to respect what other members have asked, but f0ca1 has again and again denied my attempts.
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Old 04-01-2008, 12:14 PM
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yeah, i did. its not science. thats why.
That is not an answer why is it not a science?
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Old 04-01-2008, 12:24 PM
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yes, its an answer. you should know what science is, you said youre a scientist. google it.
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f0ca1 refuses to erase my name from his signature....I believe that b/c I am a member, if I ask for him to remove it, he should. Of course, most normal and sympathetic individuals would have enough common courtesy to respect what other members have asked, but f0ca1 has again and again denied my attempts.
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Old 04-01-2008, 12:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Link S. View Post
How is it mockery do you believe that men know all science?
Because no real work has been done to show it's own theory (or at least that I know of).

Like the example I gave of the dog, what do IDers believe was the first Intelligently Designed dog that all different breeds came from? Really, I don't know. What do they believe?

Have they done this kind of work with other species that I do not know of? What about man? Do they have a guess to how old man is? What did he first look like when he was first designed? Where was he placed on earth?

How about dinosaurs? Were they designed before man? Did the designer come back after dinosaurs died out and then design other animals (including man)? Did he do it all in one go? How long ago?

These are the kind of answers evolution has answered with evidence, mathematical proofs, and logical argument. New information is coming out all the time which is only strengthening the theory.

The theory (which really, it isn't. At best a hypothesis) of Intelligent Design has no major body of work done for itself. The best I see for it's claims are pointing out holes in other theories, which BTW is great since it gives us insight into what areas we (evolutionist) need to do more research in.

There is not enough on ID's plate to be taken serious. For it to be taught as a practical theory would be, like I said before, a mockery to Science
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Old 04-02-2008, 04:22 AM
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yes, its an answer. you should know what science is, you said youre a scientist. google it.
Exactly why I don't understand why you refuse to answer the question it all fits in with science.
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Old 04-02-2008, 04:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Qwerty View Post
Because no real work has been done to show it's own theory (or at least that I know of).

Like the example I gave of the dog, what do IDers believe was the first Intelligently Designed dog that all different breeds came from? Really, I don't know. What do they believe?

Have they done this kind of work with other species that I do not know of? What about man? Do they have a guess to how old man is? What did he first look like when he was first designed? Where was he placed on earth?

How about dinosaurs? Were they designed before man? Did the designer come back after dinosaurs died out and then design other animals (including man)? Did he do it all in one go? How long ago?

These are the kind of answers evolution has answered with evidence, mathematical proofs, and logical argument. New information is coming out all the time which is only strengthening the theory.

The theory (which really, it isn't. At best a hypothesis) of Intelligent Design has no major body of work done for itself. The best I see for it's claims are pointing out holes in other theories, which BTW is great since it gives us insight into what areas we (evolutionist) need to do more research in.

There is not enough on ID's plate to be taken serious. For it to be taught as a practical theory would be, like I said before, a mockery to Science
I believe in intelligent design and I also believe that evolution was used to bring the world about to its present state. The only species that doesn't have a solid transition species is the human being ever heard of the "missing link"? It is interesting to note that in the bible evolution is painfully evident in the story of creation (posted before) but the one act of superior creation by divinity was the human and this is the only species that doesn't have a solid transition species.

I believe that a creator could have put the requirements for life to start (nutrients, energy, elements, etc.) on the earth and then allowed it to grow and continue until it was fit for human life.
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