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Old 04-06-2007, 07:37 AM
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Default Obama speaks up on Universal Healthcare

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17980179/
Unsurprisingly, like most Democrats and a few moderate Republicans, Obama is pushing for universal healthcare. Of course... that means nothing. Policies differ from candidate to candidate from Romney-style manditory insurance to the Clinton-Schwartzenegger idea to Euro-style socilaized medicine (which Obama is leaning toward, according to the article)...
He makes a valid point in that a concensus should be built up amongst the public before a specific policy is drawn up... but is that evidence of clever strategy and populist integrity... or of vaguery and excuses for having no ideas? We just don't know yet.
Personally I don't think too much about a healthcare system. It seems that every system, the status quo, laissez faire, socialized, and hybrid... They all have problems. I can't even determine how they rate... For all the complaint about socialized healthcare, I'm not overly impressed with the status quo and the capitalist insurance method... I think the argument really has to do with ideology... not even just regular capitalist vs. socialist/populist ideology, but a simple "Do you think healthcare is a public or private good?" To me, the answer is both, much like education. We need to experiment... but must do so in such a cautious manner as to avoid catastrophe.
Obviously we need to switch the American thought on healthcare from emphasizing symptoms to emphasizing prevention... but that's easier said than done. One things for sure: we are currently in a train that's about to wreck.
If Obama can do as he seems to claim: socialize the healthcare system AND do it without requiring higher taxes, even making it more efficient and affordable... I'm all for it- even though I have reservations about socialized healthcare. If it can be done affordably, it beats a half-socialized system that is getting more and more out of control and eating more and more of the budget...
But does he have the secret? Does he believe that once the issue is framed, we will collectively find a solution... or is he just spouting promises that cannot be kept?
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Old 04-06-2007, 10:09 AM
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Default You'll shoot your eye out!

If Obama can create a national healthcare system that doesn't increase what I pay AND doesn't drastically reduce the quality of my service I'd favor that strongly. Of course I might be a bit busy chasing the monkeys flying out of my backside, but I would support the idea nonetheless.
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Old 04-06-2007, 10:15 AM
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Default ...

The universal healthcare position is actually the least telling part of this article... He hasn't decided on a plan... He claims to simply be building a consensus... then afterward we are to presume people will start bringing up ideas that will compete against each other... It's that methodology that is most telling... I'm just not sure of what.
Is he saying "I'm a guy who pushes for change and is open to ideas" or "I haven't got a clue."
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Old 04-06-2007, 05:56 PM
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Default Hey Folks

I tend to think the latter. He hasn't got a clue. It's amazing how short of opinions he has for a guy who's a senator running for president. He's pretty (*)(*)(*)(*) clueless most of the time.
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Old 04-08-2007, 02:51 PM
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Default .

Let me elucidate Obamaism:

"I'm for universal health care. Yeah, and, and world peace! An' I'm for an end to poverty! An end to disease! Yeah all that! But don't ask me how - ya see, I'm black, and it would be racist to grill me! Yeah!"

(Obamaism = onanism)
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Old 04-08-2007, 08:04 PM
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Default less than jake

ever the one to introduce race into the discussion where it has no bearing ... somebody give him his sheet back

if you can't dream it, you won't do it. that's why naysayers never accomplish anything.
reflect back to JFK committing the nation to landing an American on the moon by the end of the 60's ... we were sucking hind tit to the soviets and at the time could only rarely achieve a successful solid-propellent booster launch. but the president emboldened the public to believe we could do it and to commit the resources to it ... with charisma and leadership we got it done.

a universal healthcare plan would be a breeze to accomplish by comparison. it just takes someone with courage, conviction and vision to unite our nation to accomplish it.
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Old 04-08-2007, 08:04 PM
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Default if only it were true, jake

Quote:
I'm for universal health care. Yeah, and, and world peace! An' I'm for an end to poverty! An end to disease! ...
still waiting for you to share with us the name of your favorite African-American atheletes ... figured i would toss that out while you cry about the sheet comment above implying you are a racist
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Originally Posted by Anikdote View Post
... Which is a notion I stupid. ...
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Well, that settles it ... who cares about facts?
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Old 04-08-2007, 09:38 PM
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Default .

I don't think it really matters if Obama wants universal healthcare or not. The democrats would have to gain 9 senate seats (10 to make it Lieberman proof) to get the plan past the Republican filibuster. I certainly won't base my important Iowa caucus vote on this issue.
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Old 04-08-2007, 10:43 PM
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Default .

Quote:
Originally Posted by justabubba";p=&quot View Post
Quote:
I'm for universal health care. Yeah, and, and world peace! An' I'm for an end to poverty! An end to disease! ...
still waiting for you to share with us the name of your favorite African-American atheletes ... figured i would toss that out while you cry about the sheet comment above implying you are a racist
I don't follow sports. I like to occasionally watch football games, but I don't follow the careers of athletes. Ask me my favorite black actor. Opera singer. Jazz singer. Commentator. Politician.
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Old 04-08-2007, 10:46 PM
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Default .

Quote:
Originally Posted by justabubba";p=&quot View Post
ever the one to introduce race into the discussion where it has no bearing ... somebody give him his sheet back

if you can't dream it, you won't do it. that's why naysayers never accomplish anything.
reflect back to JFK committing the nation to landing an American on the moon by the end of the 60's ... we were sucking hind tit to the soviets and at the time could only rarely achieve a successful solid-propellent booster launch. but the president emboldened the public to believe we could do it and to commit the resources to it ... with charisma and leadership we got it done.

a universal healthcare plan would be a breeze to accomplish by comparison. it just takes someone with courage, conviction and vision to unite our nation to accomplish it.
PERSONAL INSULT REMOVED The moon landing was largely an assemblage of existing technologies and the use of 19th century orbital mechanics. No "vision" was required, just a decision to do it. Whereas the moon landing succeeded by the application of perfectly rational science and engineering, most schemes for universal healthcare are the brainstorms of some idiot politician.
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