Obama will beat McCain, Hillary will tie. - Page 2

JMS · #11 (**permalink**) 02-09-2008, 05:30 PM

youre only fooling yourself, duh.

SenaxFlatulus · #12 (**permalink**) 02-09-2008, 05:32 PM

I keep thinking that:

If given the choice between a Democrat, a Democrat, or a Democrat... the American public will vote Democrat.

gmb92 · #13 (**permalink**) 02-09-2008, 05:47 PM

The problem, Duh2, is you mistake your opinion with that of the American people. The strong majority of Americans understand the war has not been worth the cost. McCain has the extreme position of believing that getting involved in a quagmire was a good idea even in the absence of WMD, active WMD programs and al Qaeda ties in addition to the many costs. Obama would be able to trump McCain on this and to some extent Clinton (although the war authorization vote, despite not being a "vote for war", will nonetheless be seen that way and undermine such an argument). A strong majority of Americans also want out of Iraq with a short timeline (within a year or less). 100-year McCain doesn't fit into that.

http://www.pollingreport.com/iraq.htm

The "surge" thing is something to the effect of "let's keep trying new stuff until the Iraqis calm down then try to claim political credit for it".

Lastly, Americans rightly believe that pulling out of Iraq would help the economy. Spending trillions on elusive oil adventures that harm our national security is not a good thing.

http://www.usatoday.com/money/econom...-ap-poll_N.htm

So yes, the war is not McCain's strength nationally, although it certainly helped him with Republicans. He's able to pull Independents with his moderation on other issues. Personally, I think his fervent neoconservatism shouldn't be overlooked, as it effects and undermines these other positive positions. Take his war stance away, and I'd consider voting for him.

DuH2 · #14 (**permalink**) 02-09-2008, 06:30 PM

Quote:

The "surge" thing

Thats how seriously you and they take WAR.
..thank you goodbye.

crestwood33 · #15 (**permalink**) 02-10-2008, 05:19 AM

Now all the GOP needs to do is find "their" Obama. Sadly that guy will not run this time, thanks to the castration of the GOP by the folks who USED TO BE in charge., Fox TV and the political hacks, leeches, like Hannity, Limbaugh, Coulter, whose sole mission was first and foremost to line their own pockets by dividing the country.

ziggy · #16 (**permalink**) 02-10-2008, 06:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DuH2

LMAO

McCain is going to grab the Democrats by the nuts on Iraq and twist....

(Oh and to rub salt in ..anti-war Republicans and Independents in the contests so far have been voting for McCain.)

Oh please duh,
The numbers show that for every person voting in the Republican primaries three (3) people are voting in the Democratic race.
Where did you come up with this idea that the anti-war independent vote is going to McCain?
It's like the Fox news assertion that Obama is a closet tree hugger...

tdfast · #17 (**permalink**) 02-10-2008, 10:46 PM

The passion Obama puts out there is going to be hard, if not impossible to beat. Clinton is finding that out now and McCain could learn the lesson very quickly. Obama's 'change' and 'future' messages will look very strong when aimed at McCain. Republicans and independants go for Obama pretty hard.

The Democrat is going to have the economy issue on their side and the Iraq surge is going to be scaled back over the summer, ending good news for McCain on that front. A couple of key issues are stacked against McCain.

DuH2 · #18 (**permalink**) 02-10-2008, 11:04 PM

Obama is easy to derail.

Let him wind up do his empty speech and then simply turn to him and ask "you speak alot about this change thing..what exactly IS it?"

He brings change!
Meh whatever..
Hillary Clinton is going to be the nominee.

Media hysterics over their creation not withstanding.

"We are going to take things away from you on behalf of the common good."

Democrast better get used to that. Sooner rather then later..or they won't just lose to McCain they wil be blown out like its a revival party of 1984.

DuH2 · #19 (**permalink**) 02-10-2008, 11:32 PM

Ziggy-

Quote:

The numbers show that for every person voting in the Republican primaries three (3) people are voting in the Democratic race.

Yeah..and?...I see this mentioned but I never see any pundits or analyst going OMG this is so important!..
Keeping things in persepctive..19k or so Republicans voted in the Kansas thing..out of 760k registered republicans.
BTW Karl Rove is a contributer on FOX now..very active... giving alot of analysis ..you should watch

Oh as for the anti-war types..heres I found an article dealing with it for you.......since for some reason nobody on this forum ever watches or reads the friggin news!.......Anyhoo...

Quote:

McCain, hawk on Iraq, getting antiwar vote

DEERFIELD BEACH, Fla. - John McCain, the Republican Party's most relentless and unapologetic guardian of an enduring American presence in Iraq, has become the favored candidate of antiwar voters in the Republican primaries, according to exit polls.

In New Hampshire, McCain overwhelmingly won the votes of the one-third of Republican-primary voters who told exit pollsters they "strongly" or "somewhat" oppose the war, and trailed Mitt Romney by over 20 points among those who strongly support it. In Michigan, where McCain lost to Romney, the Arizona senator also carried antiwar voters while losing among those backing the conflict.

The unlikely base of support for McCain, who once summarized his unyielding resistance to the antiwar cause with the slogan "No Surrender," has been central to his campaign's resurgence. Both analysts and staffers acknowledge it is evidence of how much McCain has succeeded in winning over voters on the basis of his personal qualities while often failing to convince them of his policy positions - even on an issue McCain has made his campaign's signature cause. "People know this is someone who knows the possibilities and limits of military action and would not take those steps lightly," said Steve Duprey, McCain's New Hampshire vice chairman, explaining the senator's appeal to antiwar voters.

For much of last year, McCain's support for the war in Iraq appeared to threaten his prospects among independents, Democrats, and moderate Republicans. McCain has repeatedly said then he would "much rather lose a political campaign than lose a war." On the day of the Michigan primary, he raised the stakes. "I would rather lose a career than lose a war," he said in Traverse City.

Yet McCain has managed to establish a third position in a previously two-sided debate that has allowed him to draw supporters from among the war's boosters and skeptics. By criticizing both the Bush administration's wartime management and Democratic opponents he said wanted to "set a date for surrender," McCain was able to present himself as a candidate who both supported the war and best understood the costs of what he calls "our failure in Iraq."

"McCain wants to do the war right - in a way that's principled, and that functions as a positive example of the differences between us and the terrorists," said Jeremy Varon, a historian at Drew University who has studied past antiwar movements. "This is the way in which people on the left see him as somewhat admirable: because principles seem to matter to him."

....

Quote:

An absolutist streak still runs through McCain's attitude toward war. When a young woman at a town hall in Bedford, New Hampshire, asked McCain how he could support the war given a poll showing that soldiers' families were opposed, McCain stormily dismissed her assertion - and the possibility that any reputable survey could demonstrate such a finding.

"But it's a poll that was taken," she protested.

"I don't care if it's a banana," McCain responded.

Today, McCain often ends his speeches with a story about an encounter last summer with a New Hampshire mother who pleaded with McCain to make sure her son's death outside Baghdad wasn't "in vain." McCain now wears a black bracelet featuring his name and lifts his wrist to show it to crowds, emphasizing that the experience put the debate in the "right perspective" for him.

"It's a metaphor for not forgetting the price we pay for entering the war," said Duprey, the McCain campaign aide.

(I just liked that bit..classic McCain.

)
http://www.boston.com/news/nation/ar..._antiwar_vote/

The last paragraph I think sums it up well-

Quote:

"Most voters, especially as concerns the Iraq war, are probably reacting to the perceived persona and temperament of the candidates," said Andrew J. Bacevich, a professor of international relations at Boston University and a strong critic of the war. "McCain is of a toughmindedness - not of the sort that said, 'we're going to be in Iraq come hell or highwater,' but of the toughmindedness of facing the facts whatever the facts may be."

You know full well the Democrats are only offering a simple solution in -spite- of the facts.

tdfast · #20 (**permalink**) 02-11-2008, 04:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DuH2

Obama is easy to derail.

Let him wind up do his empty speech and then simply turn to him and ask "you speak alot about this change thing..what exactly IS it?"

He brings change!
Meh whatever..
Hillary Clinton is going to be the nominee.

Media hysterics over their creation not withstanding.

"We are going to take things away from you on behalf of the common good."

Democrast better get used to that. Sooner rather then later..or they won't just lose to McCain they wil be blown out like its a revival party of 1984.

People just don't want all the division and old politics that Hillary brings when you have such a fresh face to look toward. If Obama was so easy to derail, or could be derailed at all, why has Clinton lost a massive lead to him over the past few months? She's having money problems and now she's getting her clock cleaned on a regular basis. Her prayer was locking up Super Tuesday and it didn't happen.

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
How the Democrats will lose the general election and how to beat McCain	SeminalBlog	Political Blogs	0	02-06-2008 11:10 AM
Obama Beat the Odds	coonsey	Political Opinions & Beliefs	8	01-28-2008 03:58 PM
Ron Paul Is The Only Guy Who Can Beat Hillary	crestwood33	Current Events	0	12-01-2007 12:30 PM
can you beat my obama score?	racknrollie9	Off-Topic Chat	1	04-13-2007 07:48 PM
I want Jeanine Pirro to beat Hillary	Printer2	Elections & Campaigns	32	10-25-2005 05:38 AM