Political Forum
     

Go Back   Political Forum > General Political Chat > Elections & Campaigns


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 06-13-2008, 01:14 AM
G_Haile12 G_Haile12 is offline
Correspondent
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 391
G_Haile12 has a spectacular aura aboutG_Haile12 has a spectacular aura aboutG_Haile12 has a spectacular aura about
Credits: 1,337
Default Obama on McCain's economic 'policy'

Quote:
John McCain takes great pride in saying he is a fiscal conservative, he’s already signaled that he will try to define me with the same old ‘tax and spend’ label that his side has been throwing around for decades at Democrats.
But lets look at the facts, John McCain once said that he couldn’t vote for the Bush tax cuts in good conscious because they were too skewered towards the wealthiest Americans. Later he said it was irresponsible to cut taxes during a time of war, because we simply couldn’t afford them. Well nothing has changed about the war, but something certainly has changed about John McCain. Because these same Bush tax cuts are his central economic policy, not only that – he is now calling for a new round of tax giveaways that are twice as expensive as the original Bush plan, and nearly twice as regressive.

His policy will spend more than two trillion dollars on tax breaks for corporations, including 1.2 billion dollars for Exxon alone, a company that just recorded the highest profits in history. Think about that, in a time when millions of Americans cant afford their medical bills or their tuition fees, when we are paying more than four dollars a gallon for gas. The man who rails against government spending, wants to spend 1.2 billion dollars on a tax break for Exxon Mobil, that isn’t just irresponsible, it’s outrageous.
I have to say, I thoroughly agree with Obama on this point, and it's why I most definitely will be voting for him. McCain is going to spend 2 trillion+ on tax breaks which only benefit the very top of society, while ordinary Americans fighting record gas prices and un-affordable health care costs McCain thinks that the people who need help are those who need help least.

I would encourage all those who want a just, free and more equitable America to vote Obama, and to end the shameful elitist legacy of Bush and his cronies.

While public schools rot and people can't afford to see a doctor, the rich elite of America are living it up with our tax money. WE MUST END THIS!

OBAMA08!
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Red Cross - Donate Today    Save the Rainforest
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 06-13-2008, 02:11 AM
TheChief's Avatar
TheChief TheChief is online now
Analyst
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Australia, Perth
Posts: 2,915
usa
TheChief has a brilliant futureTheChief has a brilliant futureTheChief has a brilliant futureTheChief has a brilliant futureTheChief has a brilliant futureTheChief has a brilliant futureTheChief has a brilliant futureTheChief has a brilliant futureTheChief has a brilliant futureTheChief has a brilliant futureTheChief has a brilliant future
Credits: 1,840
Default

Very stupid.

Quote:
he’s already signaled that he will try to define me with the same old ‘tax and spend’ label that his side has been throwing around for decades at Democrats.
Yet McCain is being blamed for cutting on taxes? Doesn't that enforce the idea that Obama is a 'Tax and Spend' lunatic?

And how will 1.2 Billion dollars of tax breaks for EXXON not help the 'Ordinary Americans' at the pump?

Food and Gas prices are high the companies that supply will need a break from the government if you want prices to go down.

Wait till White Fox reads this he's gonna get angry!
__________________
Left sucks! so visit our new group! Obama is a Joke!
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 06-13-2008, 02:32 AM
Ronin-Talgar Ronin-Talgar is offline
Commentator
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,274
australia
Ronin-Talgar is a name known to allRonin-Talgar is a name known to allRonin-Talgar is a name known to allRonin-Talgar is a name known to allRonin-Talgar is a name known to allRonin-Talgar is a name known to all
Credits: 9,196
Default

How Chief? Well they can just keep the money, thats how. You know how you guys always say that more taxes on them will be passed onto the consumer, why do you think that the tax breaks would be too? That isn't in their immediate interest.

I think they'd pocket some, and pass the rest on, knowing that they can comfortably increase it gradually in the furture without it being as much of a shock. All while they get more money, more power, and they do so by paying less to the state, forcing the tax burden onto others.

Last edited by Ronin-Talgar; 06-13-2008 at 02:33 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 06-13-2008, 02:46 AM
TheChief's Avatar
TheChief TheChief is online now
Analyst
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Australia, Perth
Posts: 2,915
usa
TheChief has a brilliant futureTheChief has a brilliant futureTheChief has a brilliant futureTheChief has a brilliant futureTheChief has a brilliant futureTheChief has a brilliant futureTheChief has a brilliant futureTheChief has a brilliant futureTheChief has a brilliant futureTheChief has a brilliant futureTheChief has a brilliant future
Credits: 1,840
Default

Quote:
How Chief? Well they can just keep the money, thats how. You know how you guys always say that more taxes on them will be passed onto the consumer, why do you think that the tax breaks would be too? That isn't in their immediate interest.
Even if you like to think its true. Buisness doesn't horde its money. Especially not in a time were demand is high and your competing. EXXON will either spend the extra money on more drilling operations.. which means cheaper fuel.. Lower prices in order to attack its competitors or pass it on to its employees.. Or a combination of all of these either way thats more money in the hands of the consumer.

Quote:
I think they'd pocket some, and pass the rest on, knowing that they can comfortably increase it gradually in the furture without it being as much of a shock. All while they get more money, more power, and they do so by paying less to the state, forcing the tax burden onto others.
I think they would invest it in there dying industry.. cause.. that would make more sense.. then millions will feel the relief as the price rises slow down.
__________________
Left sucks! so visit our new group! Obama is a Joke!
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 06-13-2008, 03:12 AM
Ronin-Talgar Ronin-Talgar is offline
Commentator
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,274
australia
Ronin-Talgar is a name known to allRonin-Talgar is a name known to allRonin-Talgar is a name known to allRonin-Talgar is a name known to allRonin-Talgar is a name known to allRonin-Talgar is a name known to all
Credits: 9,196
Default

Quote:
Even if you like to think its true. Buisness doesn't horde its money. Especially not in a time were demand is high and your competing. EXXON will either spend the extra money on more drilling operations.. which means cheaper fuel.. Lower prices in order to attack its competitors or pass it on to its employees.. Or a combination of all of these either way thats more money in the hands of the consumer.
The problem with trickle-down is that it ignores how much moiney is cought and then sent back up to begin trickling down again- not to mention it might go out of the country. Maybe they'll buy an island or too, I understand the incredibly rich do that kind of thing.

So maybe they'll buy some planes, some polititians--maybe they will just hold onto it for a rainy day in an offshore bank account for a rainy day- after all if they go find more oil they'll drive prices down- what a silly thing to do. After all, it'll be there when they come looking for it later.

It continues to amuse that the right will argue whatever market rationale they find handy, and ignore its equally compelling opposite.

Quote:
I think they would invest it in there dying industry.. cause.. that would make more sense.. then millions will feel the relief as the price rises slow down.
What do the millionaires care about the millions- they are bred, trained and legally bound to put profits first. And Capital is not bound to any industry after all- it can go somewhere else if it abandons the oil business- it'll suffer but it'll be ok.

Incidentally, it probably wouldn't surprise you to know that consoling me with 'don't worry, they'll use it to become richer and more powerful, and if we let them do that they will give us some relief' isn't much help.

Last edited by Ronin-Talgar; 06-13-2008 at 03:28 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 06-13-2008, 06:08 AM
Craigers Craigers is offline
Correspondent
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Atlanta, GA
Age: 24
Posts: 305
usa us georgia
Craigers is a jewel in the roughCraigers is a jewel in the roughCraigers is a jewel in the rough
Credits: 1,945
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by G_Haile12 View Post
I have to say, I thoroughly agree with Obama on this point, and it's why I most definitely will be voting for him. McCain is going to spend 2 trillion+ on tax breaks which only benefit the very top of society, while ordinary Americans fighting record gas prices and un-affordable health care costs McCain thinks that the people who need help are those who need help least.

I would encourage all those who want a just, free and more equitable America to vote Obama, and to end the shameful elitist legacy of Bush and his cronies.

While public schools rot and people can't afford to see a doctor, the rich elite of America are living it up with our tax money. WE MUST END THIS!

OBAMA08!
Have you ever thought that the reason why tax cuts seem to only benefit the wealthy is because the wealthy pay almost all the taxes in this country??

Our tax money? No, you mean THEIR tax money? The money THEY earned. Who are you to lay claim to someone else's money?

How would mandated socialist healthcare be free? Not money free, but free as in liberty?
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 06-13-2008, 06:23 AM
Kazan's Avatar
Kazan Kazan is offline
Sr. Correspondent
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 464
tonga
Kazan has disabled reputation
Credits: 2,325
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Craigers View Post
Have you ever thought that the reason why tax cuts seem to only benefit the wealthy is because the wealthy pay almost all the taxes in this country??

Our tax money? No, you mean THEIR tax money? The money THEY earned. Who are you to lay claim to someone else's money?

How would mandated socialist healthcare be free? Not money free, but free as in liberty?
Its all about class warfare, plain and simple. Everyone wants to complain about big oil or the "rich", what they fail to realize is the rich are the ones who own the buisnes's that provide the jobs. But lets stick it to the man, then when people start getting pink slips they go nuts because big buisness is screwing the little guy yet again.

What are people being taught today, the rich, big oil, walmart all bad
The government - they are our savior and are going to punish the rich, big oil, and walmart for the success government is good.

Nothing the government provides is free, someone has to pay the taxes to bank roll what the government does - problem is no one seems to care when its the other guy that has to foot the bill.
__________________
For real coverage of the Iraq war see
http://michaelyon-online.com/

Conan! What is best in life?
To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of the women

Did they look like psychos? Is that what they looked like? They were vampires. Psychos do not explode when sunlight hits them, I don't give a **** how crazy they are!
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 06-13-2008, 07:08 AM
junjobx2199's Avatar
junjobx2199 junjobx2199 is offline
Sr. Correspondent
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: FLA
Posts: 569
usa us florida
junjobx2199 is a jewel in the roughjunjobx2199 is a jewel in the roughjunjobx2199 is a jewel in the rough
Credits: 3,519
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kazan View Post
Its all about class warfare, plain and simple. Everyone wants to complain about big oil or the "rich", what they fail to realize is the rich are the ones who own the buisnes's that provide the jobs. But lets stick it to the man, then when people start getting pink slips they go nuts because big buisness is screwing the little guy yet again.

What are people being taught today, the rich, big oil, walmart all bad
The government - they are our savior and are going to punish the rich, big oil, and walmart for the success government is good.

Nothing the government provides is free, someone has to pay the taxes to bank roll what the government does - problem is no one seems to care when its the other guy that has to foot the bill.
Sorry if that what a societal system brings the population to! We had a well defined middle class a few years ago and the line between poverty and middle class is shrinking in the wrong direction. Big Oil is dominating us because of no oversight and lax regulations (See Enron, Real-estate speculation -same thing is happening now with OIL). The rich get rich on the back of the poor, it’s always been that way and probably always will. It’s the mind of the person that would defend the big juggernauts of Oil that I have to question! When the scales get tilted in one side’s favor over the others then a balance needs to found to right that wrong! The Oil Companies have everything at their disposal to Explore for Oil (Domestically) and choose not to. Why should they, they have a monopoly over us that we are powerless to overturn...Or do they? I hate when I hear connotations of Big Government and Small Government. The sooner people realize that there is no such thing as small government the better. With this fictitious small government, you will have unchecked industries looking out for themselves and the bottom line of the now, rather then the future (Oh, well handle that when it’s a problem)

You are absolutely right, that nothing the government provided is free, it either paid for in taxes or barrowed from china; albeit still coming out of our pockets. That leads you to where is the money going? It’s definitely not going back into the economy; it’s going over seas and looks to only increase due to our current policies and engagements. How do you generate more economic growth to off-set the deficit that has hit the average persons pocket in an environment that shows no room for growth?

What do you care about the Middle class and the lower class wanting the upper classes to pay their due ...I know , I know , they already pay most of our taxes , But who gives a rats A$$ how much they pay. Id love to make millions a year hitting a base ball or Acting in a movie. I got side tracked, but the point is Obama wants to re-invest in America and level the playing feild and McCain wants to keep everything the way it is now.. Unbalanced, unchecked and open for corruption! Nuff said!
__________________
EVERY WORD YOU SAY IS A DOOR WAY TO YOU!
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 06-13-2008, 08:00 AM
justabubba's Avatar
justabubba justabubba is offline
Guru
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 6,502
us north carolina
justabubba has a reputation beyond reputejustabubba has a reputation beyond reputejustabubba has a reputation beyond reputejustabubba has a reputation beyond reputejustabubba has a reputation beyond reputejustabubba has a reputation beyond reputejustabubba has a reputation beyond reputejustabubba has a reputation beyond reputejustabubba has a reputation beyond reputejustabubba has a reputation beyond reputejustabubba has a reputation beyond repute
Credits: 33,624
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kazan View Post
Its all about class warfare, plain and simple. Everyone wants to complain about big oil or the "rich", what they fail to realize is the rich are the ones who own the buisnes's that provide the jobs. But lets stick it to the man, then when people start getting pink slips they go nuts because big buisness is screwing the little guy yet again.
actually, you are right about this. corporations' profits expand during republican administrations while wage earners' incomes increase during democrat administrations. but significantly, corporate profits also increase during democrat regimes. it would then appear that it is the republicans who engage in the class warfare, and operate under the false premise that the gains the wage earner makes comes at the expense of the business owner.
the mantra is that the rich need and deserve their reduced tax money more because they can then provide jobs for the wage earners. that dismisses that the wage earner, with more money available because of a reduced tax burden, could become a business owner himself and thus grow the economy.
Quote:
What are people being taught today, the rich, big oil, walmart all bad
The government - they are our savior and are going to punish the rich, big oil, and walmart for the success government is good.
you actually believe that people are taught that they are getting shafted? they can see it, first hand, when they get their pay checks. they feel it when they go to the gas pump. people do not need to be taught to recognize that their economic standing is diminishing while that of the elite is expanding
Quote:
Nothing the government provides is free, someone has to pay the taxes to bank roll what the government does - problem is no one seems to care when its the other guy that has to foot the bill.
it would be a false notion to believe that the government is operated efficiently, but for purposes of this response let us allow ourselves to assume that is the case. so, does it make sense imposing the tax burden on the wage earner, thereby causing it to be more difficult for him to provide healh care for his family, put food on their table, provide shelter and transportation, and who knows, educate the next generation. in contrast, the wealthy will not suffer a diminishment of their means to function wholly in society if they sustain a disproportionate tax burden. such is not the case for the working poor. it's only common sense to recognize that those who most benefit from the richness of our society are those who should incur the largest burden to operate it
__________________
“Mayor Palin fails to have a firm grasp of something very simple: the truth.”
[Frontiersman editorial, 2/7/97]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anikdote View Post
... Which is a notion I stupid. ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spare View Post
Well, that settles it ... who cares about facts?
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Us Foreign Policy: Am I a bad person for being ok with economic violence? OilMoney Political Opinions & Beliefs 2 04-28-2008 06:29 AM
McCain's foreign policy expertise on display JMS Elections & Campaigns 11 03-04-2008 08:51 AM
John McCain's foreign policy plan: Just another Neocon RationalLeft Elections & Campaigns 14 01-19-2008 10:14 PM
Economic Policy, where do you stand. jhffmn Political Opinions & Beliefs 7 10-09-2007 06:38 PM
163 busn professors: Bush economic policy - fiscal collapse KenLay Elections & Campaigns 32 10-08-2004 07:36 AM

Sponsored Links

All times are GMT -8. The time now is 02:13 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0
Template-Modifikationen durch TMS
vBCredits v1.3 ©2007 by Darkwaltz4
Advertisement System V2.1 By   Branden