More of Dubya's National Guard records released

glowdog · #1 (**permalink**) 09-08-2004, 03:50 PM

Be sure to watch 60 Minutes tonight --- Ben Barnes is going to be interviewed about how he got Junior into TANG. Also, there are apparently some pretty (*)(*)(*)(*)ing memos by Junior's superiors that 60 Minutes has uncovered.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/...h.national.ap/

An excerpt:

Quote:

The newly released records show Bush, a lieutenant in the Texas Air National Guard, ranked No. 22 in a class of 53 pilots when he finished his flight training at Moody Air Force Base in Georgia in 1969.

Over the next three years, he logged 326.4 hours as a pilot and an additional 9.9 hours as a co-pilot, mostly in the F-102A jet used to intercept enemy aircraft. Of the 278 hours he flew in the interceptor, about 77 hours were in the TF-102A, the two-seat trainer version of the one-seat fighter jet.

The records show his last flight was in April 1972, which is consistent with pay records indicating Bush had a lapse of duty between April and October of that year. Bush has said he had permission to go to Alabama in 1972 to work on an unsuccessful Republican Senate campaign. Bush skipped a required medical exam that cost him his pilot's status in August of that year.

Bush's 2000 campaign suggested the future president skipped his medical exam in part because the F-102A was nearly obsolete. Records show Bush's Texas unit flew the F-102A until 1974 and used the jets as part of an air defense drill during 1972.

A six-month historical record of his 147th Fighter Interceptor Group, also turned over to the AP on Tuesday, shows some of the training Bush missed with his colleagues during that time.

It showed the unit joined a "24-hour active alert mission to safeguard against surprise attack" in the southern United States beginning on Oct. 6, 1972, a mission for which Bush was not present, according to his pay records.

Bush's lone service in October was outside Texas, presumably with an Alabama unit he had permission to train with in September, October and November 1972.

As part of the mission, the 147th kept two F-102A jets -- the same type Bush flew before he was grounded -- on ready alert to be launched within five minutes' warning.

The records also show Bush made a grade of 88 on total airmanship and a perfect 100 for flying without navigational instruments, operating a T-38 System and studying applied aerodynamics. Other scores ranged from 89 in flight planning to 98 in aviation physiology.

The newly released records do not include any from five categories of documents Bush's commanders had been required to keep in response to the gaps in Bush's training in 1972 and 1973. For example, National Guard commanders were required to perform an investigation whenever any pilot skipped a medical exam and forward the results up the Air Force chain of command. No such documents have surfaced. (Bush military file lacks required records)

And read this Boston Globe article on the newly released military records. Bush did not fufill his obligation to the Guard on more than one occasion.

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/ar...duty_at_guard/

Here's a snippet:

Quote:

But Bush fell well short of meeting his military obligation, a Globe reexamination of the records shows: Twice during his Guard service -- first when he joined in May 1968, and again before he transferred out of his unit in mid-1973 to attend Harvard Business School -- Bush signed documents pledging to meet training commitments or face a punitive call-up to active duty.

He didn't meet the commitments, or face the punishment, the records show. The 1973 document has been overlooked in news media accounts. The 1968 document has received scant notice.

On July 30, 1973, shortly before he moved from Houston to Cambridge, Bush signed a document that declared, ''It is my responsibility to locate and be assigned to another Reserve forces unit or mobilization augmentation position. If I fail to do so, I am subject to involuntary order to active duty for up to 24 months. . . " Under Guard regulations, Bush had 60 days to locate a new unit.

But Bush never signed up with a Boston-area unit. In 1999, Bush spokesman Dan Bartlett told the Washington Post that Bush finished his six-year commitment at a Boston area Air Force Reserve unit after he left Houston. Not so, Bartlett now concedes. ''I must have misspoke," Bartlett, who is now the White House communications director, said in a recent interview.

And early in his Guard service, on May 27, 1968, Bush signed a ''statement of understanding" pledging to achieve ''satisfactory participation" that included attendance at 24 days of annual weekend duty -- usually involving two weekend days each month -- and 15 days of annual active duty. ''I understand that I may be ordered to active duty for a period not to exceed 24 months for unsatisfactory participation," the statement reads.

Yet Bush, a fighter-interceptor pilot, performed no service for one six-month period in 1972 and for another period of almost three months in 1973, the records show.

glowdog · #2 (**permalink**) 09-08-2004, 03:58 PM

Note that there are still significant records missing.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/....ap/index.html

Quote:

Challenging the government's declaration that no more documents exist, the AP identified five categories of records that should have been generated after Bush skipped his pilot's physical and missed five months of training.

"Each of these actions by any member of the National Guard should have generated the creation of many documents that have yet to be produced," AP lawyer David Schulz wrote the Justice Department August 26.

The article lays out specifically what should be in Dubya's file, but has yet to be produced.

JP5 · #3 (**permalink**) 09-08-2004, 05:29 PM

Ooooh....I see the Clinton News Network and all the other liberal media outlets are hard at work drudging up old news.

Partisian political.....and silly.

glowdog · #4 (**permalink**) 09-08-2004, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JP5";p=&quot

Ooooh....I see the Clinton News Network and all the other liberal media outlets are hard at work drudging up old news.

Partisian political.....and silly.

A reply like you just gave just demonstrates that you have no sound, challenging response.

Please explain your "reasoning" in finding the SBVT legitimate while at the same time scoffing at the investigation of Bush Jr's service.

It's baffling how the cognitive dissonance hasn't made your head explode yet!

BroncoBilly · #5 (**permalink**) 09-09-2004, 07:15 PM

...next you will be accusing Bush of not putting jelly on his peanut butter sandwich.

Thursday, September 9, 2004

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ELECTION 2004
CBS News denies
Bush docs forged
Experts suspect (*)(*)(*)(*)ing '70s memos created with modern word processor

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted: September 9, 2004
5:00 p.m. Eastern

By Art Moore

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
© 2004 WorldNetDaily.com
Amid questions raised on Internet weblogs about the authenticity of National Guard documents potentially damaging to President Bush, CBS News told WorldNetDaily it stands by its claims.

George W. Bush during his Texas Air National Guard service

Spokeswoman Kelli Edwards said she was aware of the charge that the documents, purportedly produced in 1972 and 1973, appear to have been forged with a modern word processor.

"As is standard practice at CBS News, each of the documents broadcast on '60 Minutes' was thoroughly investigated by independent experts, and we are convinced of their authenticity," she said.

Edwards refused to comment further, referring back to her statement as the final word.

Later, however, she sent an e-mail to WND, adding, "CBS verified the authenticity of the documents by talking to individuals who had seen the documents at the time they were written. These individuals were close associates of [Bush commander] Colonel Jerry Killian and confirm that the documents reflect his opinions at the time the documents were written."

Killian, who died in 1984, was Bush's squadron commander in the Texas Air Nation Guard. Among the assertions "60 Minutes II" derived from the documents -- four memos Killian wrote to himself -- were that the commander was pressed to embellish a performance evaluation for Bush and that Bush did not follow an order to report for a physical.

A CBS News online story, based on the "60 Minutes II" report, stated "60 Minutes consulted a handwriting analyst and document expert who believes the material is authentic."

Anchor Dan Rather said in the report "60 Minutes has obtained a number of documents we are told were taken from Col. Killian's personal file."

A White House spokesman did not immediately return a call seeking comment.

CBS News has a copy of a memo here in pdf format, dated Aug. 18, 1973.

The White House distributed copies of the memos, apparently dampening speculation they are fraudulent. But the copies are from faxes sent by CBS News yesterday.

The Drudge Report gave the forgery allegation wide play with a link to a story by CNSNews.com.

National Review's "Kerry Spot" weblog cited Bruce Webster, an expert witness in U.S. District Court cases on computer document forensics, who said the memo posted online by CBS News "has all sorts of problems" and points out the "typefaces weren't available on typewriters in 1973."

A reader of the weblog Powerline said the document appears to use the superscript 'th,' but there "are no keys on any typewriter in common use in 1973 which could produce a tiny "th." The forger got careless after creating the August 1, 1972 document and slipped up big-time."

A number of Web contributors said they could create an exact representation of the document using Microsoft Word.

The author of the weblog Little Green Footballs wrote: "I opened Microsoft Word, set the font to Microsoft's Times New Roman, tabbed over to the default tab stop to enter the date '18 August 1973,' then typed the rest of the document purportedly from the personal records of the late Lieutenant Colonel Jerry B. Killian. And my Microsoft Word version, typed in 2004, is an exact match for the documents trumpeted by CBS News as 'authentic.'"

Others pointed out the memo did not have letterhead and the paper size should be 8x10.5 rather than 8.5x11.

According to the weblog INDC Journal, Dr. Philip Bouffard, touted as one of the top two experts in forensic document examination of typefaces in the country, said he cannot make a 100-percent-positive evaluation because the documents appear to have been copied several times.

But he stated, "It's just possible that this might be a Times Roman font, which means that it would have been created on a computer. It's very possible that someone decided to create this document on a computer ... . I've run across this situation before ... my gut is this could just well be a fabrication."

Bouffard noted the document has "proportional spacing," which was on only seven or eight models not widely available in 1972-73.

He also pointed out the number 4 does not have a "foot" and has a "closed top," which is indicative of Times New Roman, a font exclusive to modern computer word processing programs.

Bouffard told INDC Journal that after further analysis, he's fairly certain the Aug. 18, 1973, document is a fake.

He noted, examining his old papers, the inconsistency of the "4" coming up several previous times with forgeries that attempt to duplicate old proportional spaced documents with a computer word processor.

He said he didn't know who CBS contacted to verify the document's authenticity, but is aware of only one person aside from himself who might be more qualified to determine authentic typefaces.

'Previously unseen'

"60 Minutes II" reported last night it had "previously unseen documents" from Killian's personal office file.

In a memo dated May 1972, Killian writes that Lt. Bush called him to talk about "how he can get out of coming to drill from now through November."

The docment says Lt. Bush told his commander "he is working on a campaign in Alabama ... and may not have time to take his physical." Killian adds that he thinks Bush has gone over his head, and is "talking to someone upstairs."

One of the Killian memos is an official order to Bush to report for a physical, which never was carried out.

CBS says, in an Aug. 1, 1972, memo Killian wrote, "On this date I ordered that 1st Lt. Bush be suspended from flight status due to failure to perform to USAF/TexANG standards and failure to meet annual physical examination ... as ordered."

A memo from Aug. 18, 1973, according to CBS, has Killian saying Col. Buck Staudt, head of the Texas Air National Guard, is putting on pressure to "sugar coat" the evaluation of Lt. Bush.

The memo continues, with Killian saying, "I'm having trouble running interference and doing my job."

CBS News said Staudt, a Bush family supporter, would not agree to an interview request.

Bush spokesman Dan Bartlett responded to CBS's request for comment about Killian's statements in the memos.

"For anybody to try to interpret or presume they know what somebody who is now dead was thinking in any of these memos, I think is very difficult to do," he said.

Bartlett added that Bush's superiors granted permission to train in Alabama in a non-flying status and that "many of the documents you have here affirm just that."

CBS News noted that earlier in his flying career, Bush received glowing evaluations from Killian, who called him an "exceptionally fine young officer and pilot" who "performed in an outstanding manner."

According to military documents released this week, Bush scored 88 on an airmanship test, 98 on aviation physiology and 100 on navigational abilities.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

nick80 · #6 (**permalink**) 09-10-2004, 01:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JP5";p=&quot

Ooooh....I see the Clinton News Network and all the other liberal media outlets are hard at work drudging up old news.

Partisian political.....and silly.

No real rebuttal, huh?

BroncoBilly · #7 (**permalink**) 09-10-2004, 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nick80";p=&quot

Quote:

Originally Posted by JP5";p=&quot

Ooooh....I see the Clinton News Network and all the other liberal media outlets are hard at work drudging up old news.

Partisian political.....and silly.

No real rebuttal, huh?

You better read the news slick, your liars are at it again. How pathetic you all are.

glowdog · #8 (**permalink**) 09-10-2004, 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BroncoBilly";p=&quot

Quote:

Originally Posted by nick80";p=&quot

Quote:

Originally Posted by JP5";p=&quot

Ooooh....I see the Clinton News Network and all the other liberal media outlets are hard at work drudging up old news.

Partisian political.....and silly.

No real rebuttal, huh?

You better read the news slick, your liars are at it again. How pathetic you all are.

While the memos have not yet been conclusively authenticated, the majority of the "forgery" charges so far are weak, misinformed, disingenuous or just flat-out false.

The IBM Executive, a common office typewriter available at the time, had proportional spacing, and was available in a number of fonts/typefaces.

Those "experts" that have been spouting off about forgery are pretty sorry.

Oh, and note that the right after the 60 Minutes broadcast, the White House released copies of those memos to the press, and has not questioned their authenticity.

The12thMan · #9 (**permalink**) 09-10-2004, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glowdog";p=&quot

The IBM Executive, a common office typewriter available at the time, had proportional spacing, and was available in a number of fonts/typefaces.

Common in the military? You gotta be kidding! ROFL

Quote:

Originally Posted by glowdog";p=&quot

Those "experts" that have been spouting off about forgery are pretty sorry.

By the way, where are the "experts" that CBS said authenticated the memos? Shouldn't they be parading their expertise?

Liberty · #10 (**permalink**) 09-10-2004, 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glowdog";p=&quot

The IBM Executive, a common office typewriter available at the time, had proportional spacing, and was available in a number of fonts/typefaces.

The IBM Executive:
Was anything but "common" at the time
Offered a number of fonts, but not the one used in the memo
Could not have perfectly centered the header
Could not have produced curly apostrophies
Could not have produced superscript
Did not type lines at a 13-pt. spacing

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