Josh Howard said that because of the history of the Black People, he felt no patriotism towards the American Government or for its history.

XVZ said that this showed the:

"utter worthlessness of their mouth and other body parts."

How is this not racist hate speech?

The National Anthem has nothing to do with slavery or segregation. Howard himself has not experienced slavery or segregation and apologizing for his anti-American crap is just ridiculous. I do not look at the color of one's skin to process judgement of their character. That is the epitome of racism. You just don't think it is racism because it isn't the most sinister of racism which is a disregard of someone based on their race. That racism is indeed much worse, but the fact remains that all racism is unhelpful. I am not going to hold back on criticizing the actions, views, or character of someone just because they are of a certain race. Any insistence that I should can only be summed up as racism.

If you want to defend him, that is fine. However these attacks of racism are ridiculous. You can engage in a civil discussion without this nonsense.

You think the history of this country is a valid reason for one to be unpatriotic to the current country I take it. For how long is this a valid reason? 100 years, 200 years 500 years? Does this county have to disband and be reorganized, what does it take to expect patriotism from someone as successful as Howard?

Wow. If you had admitted that what you said was out of line, maybe I would have bought that it was just some flippant comment, and that you didn't really mean it like it came across.

<<< Personal Insult Removed >>>

No, there is no after the fact reasoning from me. It is simply racist to have to prescribe different judgements based on people because of their skin color. That is what you are advocating and what I am railing against. I am open and acceptant of anyone regardless of race or ethnic background and equally critical across the board of any character flaws. So you clearly need to re-examine yourself if you think my evenhandedness is racism, because it is most certainly is not! The same cannot be said of your judgement standards.

Jeez I guess you're not very happy with President Bush, then.

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We've got rules and maps and guns in our backs, but we still can't just behave ourselves. Even if to save our own lives, we are a brutal kind. The Shins

This is a general statement of the ongoing apologists based on skin color. For the record, I criticize people of all skin color in an equal manner. I do not check one's skin color when determining faults with their character or behavior. I thought it necessary to point this out because most of my posts have been completely edited to censor that information because pointing out that such discriminating behavior is the definition of racism appears to be "insulting" to others.

The posts in this thread have been edited to remove personal insults and attacks. The fact that this has left very little behind really does nothing but reveal how little there was of substance there to start with.

Let me make this very plain for everyone involved in this thread. Attack the message, not the messenger. Argue your point, and do not deliver insults. If you have nothing substantive to say that cannot be said without attacking other members, resist the temptation to post at all.

Try to rise above personal issues and get back to the topic at hand. If you cannot form an argument without getting personal there is clearly no argument there.

If the topic at hand cannot be discussed without descent into insults and attacks, this thread will be closed.

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We've got rules and maps and guns in our backs, but we still can't just behave ourselves. Even if to save our own lives, we are a brutal kind. The Shins