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  #391 (permalink)  
Old 04-06-2008, 05:03 PM
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Originally Posted by TheChief View Post
Just look at the numbers although the IPCC claims to have a consensus of 2,500 scientists to back up their ideas there was 15,000 scientists who signed a petition against the climate accord in kyoto...

theres also the very interesting fact that they predict the earths temp will start to drop again in 20 years! (thanks to the driving factor the sun) although i imagine by then the media will have exausted the 'Your Killing The Planet!' story and wouls start leading everybody down the 'You Were Lied To!' road...
Those 15,000 "scientists" included political scientists and high school science teachers. Some have asked that their names be removed from the list.
There are some ideas that AGW will result in a destruction of the thermaline cylce, which will decrease the temperature in northern America and Europe. What "fact" are you posting about?
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  #392 (permalink)  
Old 04-06-2008, 05:08 PM
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Originally Posted by C-D-P View Post
How can you honestly say that? IIRC, we are only tracking like 4% of what is out there.
Once in a thousand years sounds like low odds to me.
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  #393 (permalink)  
Old 04-06-2008, 08:15 PM
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MannieD, if you intend to rewrite climate history and deny the Cooling that took place in the Industrial Ages, would you care to let me know what changed the IPCC's mind from, what, 1995? You know, back when they accepted the cooling?

What changed? And whats next? Burning all of the paintings and stories that mentioned how cold it was during that time? (Hardly scientific evidence, but something that deserves some explaining)

You can pull an Al Gore and claim that the debate is over, but that involves a lot of denial and ignorance. There are plenty of well qualified scientists who disagree with your theory, there have been plenty of scientific conferences that reject what the IPCC says, and the majority of public debates among scientists are all won by the side I'm supporting.

So yeah, I don't understand physics, chemistry, or simple mathematics. I'm a complete lunatic, silly me, daring to actually look at the evidence. Hitler and Stalin are turning over in their graves somewhere.
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  #394 (permalink)  
Old 04-07-2008, 04:49 AM
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Originally Posted by SuperDinoYoshi View Post
MannieD, if you intend to rewrite climate history and deny the Cooling that took place in the Industrial Ages, would you care to let me know what changed the IPCC's mind from, what, 1995? You know, back when they accepted the cooling?

What changed? And whats next? Burning all of the paintings and stories that mentioned how cold it was during that time? (Hardly scientific evidence, but something that deserves some explaining)
Would you care to quote and reference the 1995 IPCC report that states that they accepted cooling. Because with all the misinformation you've spread, I am unwilling to accept your claim.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperDinoYoshi View Post

You can pull an Al Gore and claim that the debate is over, but that involves a lot of denial and ignorance. There are plenty of well qualified scientists who disagree with your theory, there have been plenty of scientific conferences that reject what the IPCC says, and the majority of public debates among scientists are all won by the side I'm supporting.
Science is not about debating. It's about the data and evidence. And the evidence supports AGW. Could you point me to the "plenty of scientific conferences" because again I am unwilling to take your word.
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Originally Posted by SuperDinoYoshi View Post
So yeah, I don't understand physics, chemistry, or simple mathematics. I'm a complete lunatic, silly me, daring to actually look at the evidence. Hitler and Stalin are turning over in their graves somewhere.
Reading comprehension problems?
Here's my quote again
Quote:
The political one is not and will not be until the deniers understand how science, be it physics, chemistry biology etc, works.
I never implied you needed to understand physics, chemistry and I didn't even mention mathematics. I stated that you need to understand the peer review and all the sciences use this process.
And are you willing to admit that you were wrong about aerosols?

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Hitler and Stalin are turning over in their graves somewhere.
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  #395 (permalink)  
Old 04-07-2008, 11:48 AM
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if this is such a crisis, then why is that CO2 levels have SOARED by 30% since 1938 but temperature has barely moved?
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  #396 (permalink)  
Old 04-07-2008, 12:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bugalugs View Post
I really don't understand what your point is.
My point is that Global Warming is a natural phenomenon. Others share in this opinion. This link is interesting.

http://www.ac.wwu.edu/~dbunny/resear...l/abstract.htm

Quote:
Background: Only 52 Scientists Participated in UN IPCC Summary

The over 400 skeptical scientists featured in this new report outnumber by nearly eight times the number of scientists who participated in the 2007 UN IPCC Summary for Policymakers. The notion of “hundreds” or “thousands” of UN scientists agreeing to a scientific statement does not hold up to scrutiny. Recent research by Australian climate data analyst Dr. John McLean revealed that the IPCC’s peer-review process for the Summary for Policymakers leaves much to be desired.
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=636_1198188716

http://epw.senate.gov/public/index.c...8-3c63dc2d02cb

I apologize if I re-state anything in this thread, as it is large and I may have missed things as I read.

Last edited by kscott13; 04-07-2008 at 12:44 PM.
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  #397 (permalink)  
Old 04-07-2008, 01:34 PM
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Originally Posted by MannieD View Post
Would you care to quote and reference the 1995 IPCC report that states that they accepted cooling. Because with all the misinformation you've spread, I am unwilling to accept your claim.
Thats funny, what with all of the scientific evidence that you have presented.... wait a second.

I was wrong, it was actually the 1990 report, here's an image of the graph:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:I...ann-moberg.png

And if you can't admit that Mann's Hockystick was blatantly wrong...
http://www.uoguelph.ca/~rmckitri/research/Climate_L.pdf

He either
1. Messed up horribly, horribly, wrong
--- In which case, what happened to the peer review process? Would you admit that the IPCC lets major flaws slip through their reports?

2. Fabricated the hockystick
--- In which case, if his rewriting of climate history was right, why did he need to lie?

Oh, and if anyone is up for a laugh, you can watch Mann blatantly lying, claiming that 1998 has been the hottest year in 1,000 years.
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_lis...12004CB098DE90

Quote:
Originally Posted by MannieD View Post
Science is not about debating. It's about the data and evidence. And the evidence supports AGW. Could you point me to the "plenty of scientific conferences" because again I am unwilling to take your word.
The Manhattan Declaration, The NYC Global Warming Conference... Are you saying you haven't heard about any of these?

Why do you keep calling me out on sources, shy away from my points, and not offer evidence yourself?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MannieD View Post
Reading comprehension problems?
Like not being able to recognize sarcasm? (I actually have a very extensive Chemistry background for my age)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MannieD View Post
And are you willing to admit that you were wrong about aerosols?
No, offer some proof. Aerosols are short-lived, so their effects would only reach areas close to where they were released.

Last edited by SuperDinoYoshi; 04-07-2008 at 01:35 PM.
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  #398 (permalink)  
Old 04-07-2008, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by bugalugs View Post
Why do you think that the statement implies that the warming trend is not anthropogenic? The article does not suggest that implication in any way.
Because he calls it a CYCLE.
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  #399 (permalink)  
Old 04-07-2008, 03:50 PM
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You were making the claims, so you need to support them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperDinoYoshi View Post
Thats funny, what with all of the scientific evidence that you have presented.... wait a second.

I was wrong, it was actually the 1990 report, here's an image of the graph:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:I...ann-moberg.png
How does your graph support your statment that the IPCC accepted cooling? Here's a summary of the IPCC first report from 1990. I don't see the word cooling anywhere.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperDinoYoshi View Post
And if you can't admit that Mann's Hockystick was blatantly wrong...
http://www.uoguelph.ca/~rmckitri/research/Climate_L.pdf

He either
1. Messed up horribly, horribly, wrong
--- In which case, what happened to the peer review process? Would you admit that the IPCC lets major flaws slip through their reports?

2. Fabricated the hockystick
--- In which case, if his rewriting of climate history was right, why did he need to lie?

Oh, and if anyone is up for a laugh, you can watch Mann blatantly lying, claiming that 1998 has been the hottest year in 1,000 years.
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_lis...12004CB098DE90
Sorry, your link gives me a list videos. If you'd care to provide a link right to his "lying", I'll take a look. If AGW was based on Mann's research you might have a point. But here's a list of other peer reviewed research which confirms Mann's evidence.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperDinoYoshi View Post
The Manhattan Declaration, The NYC Global Warming Conference... Are you saying you haven't heard about any of these?
Nope. I'll check them out and get back to you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperDinoYoshi View Post
Why do you keep calling me out on sources, shy away from my points, and not offer evidence yourself?
See the link above. That should be enough to keep you busy for a while. I'm just supposed to accept statements like "During the Industrial Ages, the globe cooled, it didn't warm." without proof? And after that statement I should just believe everything you post. And
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperDinoYoshi View Post
Aerosols are short-lived, so their effects would only reach areas close to where they were released.
So the effects of a volcanic eruption are localized?
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  #400 (permalink)  
Old 04-07-2008, 05:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eleanoraquitaine View Post
if this is such a crisis, then why is that CO2 levels have SOARED by 30% since 1938 but temperature has barely moved?
Because Global Warming is a hoax.
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