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  #101 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2008, 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted by PatriotNews View Post
I don't misinterpret their title, only take it for what it states, and not read more into it. Going forward, you should not interpret more into my posts than is acually there. You post a bunch of scientific analysis that does not come from my article then neglect to post where you got if from or why it is relevent to what I posted. Who says your sources more reliable for me to blindly trust? Are you consistanly telling me the truth?
You (and your source) clearly misinterpreted their abstract. If you disagree, you can email Dr. Baker, co-author of the study. Considering you seem to have a consistently terrible time admitting you're wrong, I doubt you will.

http://www.atmos.washington.edu/baker.html
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  #102 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2008, 06:39 PM
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Originally Posted by gmb92 View Post
You (and your source) clearly misinterpreted their abstract. If you disagree, you can email Dr. Baker, co-author of the study. Considering you seem to have a consistently terrible time admitting you're wrong, I doubt you will.

http://www.atmos.washington.edu/baker.html
Why don't you e-mail her? Again, you are the one who is so obviously and utterly misinterpreting not only what they are saying but adding more into it than what they are saying. Then you expect me to do your homework and prove myself wrong? What arrogance! Do your own home work pal, YOU E-MAIL HER!
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Last edited by PatriotNews; 12-20-2008 at 06:39 PM.
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  #103 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2008, 07:17 PM
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Default Gee, your graphs are different than mine, you must be wrong

Quote:
Originally Posted by MannieD View Post
Please show me where we were "7 degrees Fahrenheit warmer in the 13th century".
When are you going to understand the Heartland Institute are masters of spin and liars?






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  #104 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2008, 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted by MannieD View Post
That's really funny coming from you!
You are correct. This study does not confirm human influence on climate change.
I know I am correct...Why does that sound funny then?
Quote:
Originally Posted by MannieD View Post
However, you posted the study in a thread titled "Peer Reviewed Articles that Debunk AGW Theory". Are you willing to admit that their study does not "Debunk AGW Theory"? That it only confirms that there is a solar aspect of warming; something that no one denies.
These articles are intended to debunk AGW theory either as a whole or some aspect of the studies which support AGW. While some may prove only that the science behind supporters of AGW is faulty, others may seek to provide alternative explainations of why the Earth's climate is behaving as it has/is/will. Taken as a whole I would say that these articles put to shame the scientists and the politically correct garbage they are pushing on the governments and the people of the world. Don't worry, I'm sure there are many more article by AGW skeptics that I have not yet posted, as well as those yet to be wrritten.
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  #105 (permalink)  
Old 12-21-2008, 06:29 AM
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Originally Posted by PatriotNews View Post




You can forget about the graphs of European temperatures. Europe is not global.
And from the Loehle reconstruction :
"The mean series shows the Medieval Warm Period (MWP) and Little Ice Age (LIA) quite clearly, with the MWP being approximately 0.3°C warmer than 20th century values at these eighteen sites."

Can you tell me what the equivalent of .3 C is in Fahrenheit? I'll give you a hint: it ain't 7 degrees.
I'm also curious which 18 sites?
I've commented on your graph; care to comment on mine or will you just ignore it?
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  #106 (permalink)  
Old 12-21-2008, 08:31 AM
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Originally Posted by PatriotNews View Post
Why don't you e-mail her? Again, you are the one who is so obviously and utterly misinterpreting not only what they are saying but adding more into it than what they are saying. Then you expect me to do your homework and prove myself wrong? What arrogance! Do your own home work pal, YOU E-MAIL HER!
As I thought, you are too scared. You're making the erroneous claim that the study "debunks AGW" when in fact it hurts the denialist cause. You obviously haven't done your homework. Hint: stick with credible sources.
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  #107 (permalink)  
Old 12-21-2008, 08:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MannieD View Post
You can forget about the graphs of European temperatures. Europe is not global.
And from the Loehle reconstruction :
"The mean series shows the Medieval Warm Period (MWP) and Little Ice Age (LIA) quite clearly, with the MWP being approximately 0.3°C warmer than 20th century values at these eighteen sites."

Can you tell me what the equivalent of .3 C is in Fahrenheit? I'll give you a hint: it ain't 7 degrees.
I'm also curious which 18 sites?
I've commented on your graph; care to comment on mine or will you just ignore it?
Also an Energy and Environment publication:

1. It's a sub-standard journal, not even listed on ISI's Journal Citation Report

2. It's a journal set up for global warming skeptics, thus no credible balanced independent peer reviews

3. The editor has even admitted to following a political agenda.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_and_Environment

So it's about as useful as a self-published study. RC took the time to comment on it awhile back (a bit technical):

http://www.realclimate.org/index.php...constructions/

Your curiosity regarding the 18 sites...

"What does this imply for Loehle's reconstruction? Unfortunately, the number of unsuitable series, errors in dating and transcription, combined with a mis-interpretation of what was being averaged, and a lack of validation, do not leave very much to discuss. Of the 18 original records, only 5 are potentially useful for comparing late 20th Century temperatures to medieval times, and they don't have enough coverage to say anything significant about global trends. It's not clear to me what impact fixing the various problems would be or what that would imply for the error bars, but as it stands, this reconstruction unfortunately does not add anything to the discussion."
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"You have shown what history teaches us - that at defining moments like this one, the change we need doesn't come from Washington. Change comes to Washington."

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"To the average American who’s struggling, we’re in some other stratosphere. We’re the party of Big Business and Big Oil and the rich."

- Sen. Olympia Snowe (R)

Budget surplus inherited by Bush: $236 billion (CBO, 2000)

Budget deficit inherited by Obama: $1,667 billion (CBO projection, 3/2009)
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  #108 (permalink)  
Old 12-21-2008, 01:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PatriotNews View Post
I know I am correct...Why does that sound funny then?
That makes this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by PatriotNews View Post
You seem to read what you want to read.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MannieD View Post
That's really funny coming from you!
even funnier.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PatriotNews View Post
These articles are intended to debunk AGW theory either as a whole or some aspect of the studies which support AGW. While some may prove only that the science behind supporters of AGW is faulty, others may seek to provide alternative explainations of why the Earth's climate is behaving as it has/is/will. Taken as a whole I would say that these articles put to shame the scientists and the politically correct garbage they are pushing on the governments and the people of the world. Don't worry, I'm sure there are many more article by AGW skeptics that I have not yet posted, as well as those yet to be wrritten.
so does
Quote:
Originally Posted by PatriotNews View Post
An Indicator of Solar Activity Closely Associated with Climate

Science 1 November 1991:
Vol. 254. no. 5032, pp. 698 - 700
DOI: 10.1126/science.254.5032.698

E. FRIIS-CHRISTENSEN 1 and K. LASSEN


http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/conten...t/254/5032/698
1)"debunk AGW theory as a whole"
2)"or some aspect of the studies which support AGW."
3)"prove only that the science behind supporters of AGW is faulty"
4)"provide alternative explainations of why the Earth's climate is behaving as it has/is/will."
5) none of the above

BTW, I choose #5.
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  #109 (permalink)  
Old 12-21-2008, 01:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmb92 View Post
Also an Energy and Environment publication:

1. It's a sub-standard journal, not even listed on ISI's Journal Citation Report

2. It's a journal set up for global warming skeptics, thus no credible balanced independent peer reviews

3. The editor has even admitted to following a political agenda.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_and_Environment

So it's about as useful as a self-published study. RC took the time to comment on it awhile back (a bit technical):

http://www.realclimate.org/index.php...constructions/

Your curiosity regarding the 18 sites...

"What does this imply for Loehle's reconstruction? Unfortunately, the number of unsuitable series, errors in dating and transcription, combined with a mis-interpretation of what was being averaged, and a lack of validation, do not leave very much to discuss. Of the 18 original records, only 5 are potentially useful for comparing late 20th Century temperatures to medieval times, and they don't have enough coverage to say anything significant about global trends. It's not clear to me what impact fixing the various problems would be or what that would imply for the error bars, but as it stands, this reconstruction unfortunately does not add anything to the discussion."
Thanks for the extra info.
I just realized that Loehle paper questions the tree ring proxies. But this page page shows that other proxies are in agreement. None of the proxies show the MWP as being 7 degrees F warmer.

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  #110 (permalink)  
Old 12-21-2008, 01:48 PM
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Originally Posted by wyly View Post
and show us the cooling of the last ten years



solar activity and how it parts from the upward temp trend



fossil fuel use and temp rise



a combination of fossil fuel and solar activity



denial is ridiculous in face of the evidence
Explain Jan.2008.
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