Frankly, I like Taiwan's approach and unlike many on this forum I believe healthcare to be basic human right. I also think that the disadvantages of having a large portion of the population uninsured far outwiegh the disadvantages of a socialized health care system.

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I'm a Tarty Fart, What! You want some of this?
Ignorance is treatable. Stupidity ain't.

"The world is a dangerous place to live, not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don't do anything about it." ---Albert Einstien

Food, Water and a place to live are all more helpful than healthcare. That doesn't mean we should hand control of said industries to the government.

Taiwan's approach is a very good one, but it isn't the kind any of the democrats are for. They want something along the lines of HillaryCare, I don't care much for the Republicans, but I'd much rather have them create some form of universal health care insurance than the democrats.

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Woodrow Wilson

if i may ask....WHY?

I'll take it you never read or glanced at HillaryCare.

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Woodrow Wilson

the reason i asked is because of the statement you made regarding republicans....i would then have thought you would just as soon have a third party come up with something.....

Oh I would much rather have a third party come up with something. Given the choice between a Democratic Health Care Plan and a Republican Health Care Plan, I would take the Republican one over the Democratic one.

The Republicans are a little cheap sometimes, but the Democrats would put the entire operation into the Government's hands, and well... We've seen how thats worked with our Education system.

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Woodrow Wilson

I think that discussion about health care shouldn't be limited to free market vs. government because I don't think either one will provide the best solution. I share the skepticism with a government-run health care system, as the case of England illustrates. As for a free market solution, there is the asymmetric information problem (I can't just explain in a few words, so if anyone interested, you guys can research on it - or you can read about it in "the undercover economist" by Tim Harford that deals with health care).

So in my opinion, an integration of both system that can maximize their strengths and minimize their weaknesses can create a better solution.

And more importantly, US or any country can benefit greatly by look at what other countries have done and learn from them and the thread starter (DanteAugustusGermanicus) has provided an excellent set of examples

Just one more interesting example, Tim Harford spoke of the example of Singapore and their health care system (pretty similar to the Swiss system actually). Their system employs market forces, self-responsibility and public interventions, creating a very innovative and effective solution (I don't remember exact details of the plan, but you get the idea):

It's a universal health care plan. Everyone pays a $1000 per year (pretty low compared to their income; their income is almost as high as Americans). This money is put into a health saving account. If you get into an accident and need an expensive procedure (which most people can't afford), the government will help out.

However, when you need inexpensive medical things (buying viagra, cold medicines, hair loss, seeing doctors etc) you will pay out of the $1000/year saving account. Since this is your money, it's putting the responsibility on you to choose what is cost-effective.

This solution solves the asymmetric information problem that free market has, increasing efficiency and reduce cost. It also solves the bureaucracy that government has since government only intervenes when the bill is very large (usually life-saving surgery or procedures, and luckily most of us don't have many of those in our lives). And of course, it gives the customers a lot of choices over their health care plan

Since the "supply" knows the government will pick up the tab for stuff 1k+, what market forces are used to control the cost of expensive procedures?

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True knowledge exists in being aware of what you don't know.

The $1,000 is the payment in Singapore...we can modify it applying to America, the exact number I don't know, but I think economists can figure that out.

As for the procedures above the X amount that we have to pay, they're usually are emergencies - unfortunate and almost unavoidable events. I guess that's the minimal cost to maintain a healthy society (and most economists agree that a healthier society will be a more productive society)

As the Singapore example has illustrated, the plan has worked: the cost of health care was controlled, even the expensive procedures and Singaporean health care system is very good

Two of the main problems with American health-care systems are caused by wastefulness and bureaucracy. Because people have to pay a fixed amount of money for the insurance, so you're either going to use it or lose it. So in reality, many people will buy more than what they need i.e: 10 cold pills instead of just 1. That creates waste.

The insurance companies know about this problem too and they will try to guard against it, creating a lot of red tapes.

The Singaporean example achieve two goals at the same times: reducing cost significantly and maintaining its people's health.

That didn't quite address the question. the issue is that a virtue of free market is that a variety of suppliers and a variety of demanders allows competition to control prices and holds costs to market. For procedures costing "X" +, suppliers of medicine will know that the government, and not the individual, will pick up the tab. So, in theory, suppliers will be encouraged to make things, first of all, cost more than 1k if possible, and second of all, to charge whatever outrageous amount they want for things that are "x" +. I'm wondering how within their system the single payer government manages to keep costs down when that "x" + creates a small threshold to get over and into the government's deep wallet?

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