Saw an interview with the killers online. They still insist the episode revolved around drugs and robbery, not sexual orientation.

They were on a meth binge, Shepard promised them more drugs for sex, they decided it was easier to beat him up and take the drugs than pay.

While I still believe they should have been executed soon after, it's interesting the difference between what they say and what the media told us.

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What have you done for your people today?

It sure wasn't a love-crime, right?

I don't think it should matter whether the motive was drugs or intolerance. We should not be increasing sentences because the motive was one thing instead of another. It should not matter why the criminal commits his crime; only the crime should matter.

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"George W. Bush surrounds himself with smart people the way a hole surrounds itself with a donut." —Dennis Miller

I have an interesting one for you though on that note. What about first degree murder versus second degree (all things being equal). I mean the only reason you get extra time on your sentence for the former is because of pre-meditation. If the crime is one of passion, you get less time in prison than if it is cold and calculated. So what is happening in your mind does factor in.

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lambaste me not

Your right, it is interesting and I have never thought about that. But it seems to me that premeditation is not merely something happening in your mind, but actions you take. Premeditation is more than just planning to commit murder; it is the actions beforehand (e.g. bringing a gun, or setting the trap) that facilitate that murder. The law imposes a duty to cool off when the passion to commit murder is formed. If the passion to commit murder forms and there is no time to cool off, that is seen as less of an offense against society than where the passion forms and the person indulges that desire even though he has the time to reflect on what he is preparing to do.

Instead of increasing the penalty because of what is in the murderer's mind, it is more true that the law allows the lower penalty because the murderer didn't have time to properly reflect on what is in his mind.

And first degree murder is not just for premeditation. A murderer is also subject to a first degre murder charge when he kills a member of a protected class (e.g. police officer) or when he is a prisoner who kills a fellow inmate.

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"George W. Bush surrounds himself with smart people the way a hole surrounds itself with a donut." —Dennis Miller

it was still first degree pre-meditated murder, regardless of whether it had to do with sexual orientation or not.

Catz

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I'll get nicer when you get smarter.

'Given that this was a planned drug robbery/murder,"

drug rips are surprisingly common crimes in the west.

Catz

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I'll get nicer when you get smarter.

next thing you know these guys will have their own radio show and program on Fox "news" since they are already convicted felons....

I’d love to know what exactly makes two murderers credible sources. Why should we believe them over what the police say?

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“Been living here in galus for a life too long" - Matisyahu

the difference between first and second degree is there becausei it is generally considered that if someone commits first degree murder they are more of a threat and a true killer. Whereas that most often is not the case with second degree. It doesn't have anything to do what was in your head as it does the situation as well as the threat level. Generally speaking, if a husband catches his wife in bed with another man and kills one of them in the heat of the moment he is not as dangerous as someone who is a serial killer and methodically plans out what they will do. Involuntary manslaughter is (esentially) a mistake due to carelessness. 2nd degree falls in between that and first degree. More than a mistake, but less than a cold blooded killer.

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All you need to know about the energy crisis:
ANWR Exploration Republicans: 91% Supported. Democrats: 86% Opposed.
Coal-to-liquid R's: 90% YES. D's: 78% NO.
Oil Shale Exploration R's: 90% YES. D's: 86% NO.
Outer Continental Shelf Exploration R's: 81% YES. D's: 83% NO.
Increased Refinery Capacity R's: 97% YES. D's: 96% NO

SUMMARY: 91% of House Republicans have historically voted to increase the production of America’s own oil and gas. 86% of House Democrats have historically voted against.