I don't work for any pro illegal group.

Contradictory.

In the first link you provided, I pulled this from the link:

* Illegal immigrants are barred from the following federal public benefits: grants, contracts, loans, licenses, retirement, welfare, health, disability, public or assisted housing, post secondary education, food assistance, and unemployment benefits. States are barred from providing state or locally funded benefits to illegal immigrants unless a state law is enacted granting such authority.9

Then in the second link you provided, the topic was:

2.2 Billion dollars a year is spent on food assistance programs such as food stamps, WIC, and free school lunches for illegal aliens.

As far as public education, they do pay towards that in rent or mortgage.

And this is also interesting:

Wife of Ozarks Minutemen Founder Admits She Lied

By: Gerri L. Elder

Last December, Angela D. Wilburn called 911 and reported that she had been raped and shot by three Hispanic men. When police arrived, she told investigators that the immigrants had broken into her mobile home and that one of them sexually assaulted her before shooting her in the knee with a handgun, according to a report by Ozarks First.

Wilburn, 44, is the wife of a founder of the Ozarks Minutemen, an active anti-illegal immigration organization, and later admitted that she lied about the attack. Now she says that she heard a noise and grabbed her husband's gun in a panic. She accidentally shot herself in the knee as she reached for a flashlight. Deputies in Greene County, Missouri had spent more than 100 man-hours on the case, presumably looking for Hispanic immigrants who may have attacked Wilburn, when she confessed that the attack had been a figment of her own imagination.


The fictional story that Wilburn told investigators in December was not the first time she had reported to police that she had been attacked by Hispanic men. On June 6, 2007 Wilburn told police that a trio of men in a white van, who happened to speak Spanish, attempted to abduct her as she was walking down a road. She reported that she fought off one of the men and was able to run away. Following her report, a statewide alert and a Crime Stoppers bulletin was issued. That case is still open, but investigators are not actively pursuing any leads.

Read this portion carefully:

Yet another reader sent me a great bad math link. (Keep 'em coming guys!) This one is an astonishingly nasty slight of hand, and a great example of how people misuse statistics to support a political agenda. It's by someone named "Dr. Deborah Schurman-Kauflin", and it's an attempt to paint illegal immigrants as a bunch of filthy criminal lowlifes. It's titled "The Dark Side of Illegal Immigration: Nearly One Million Sex Crimes Committed by Illegal Immigrants in the United States."

With a title like that, you'd think that she has actual data showing that nearly one million sex crimes were committed by illegal immigrants, wouldn't you? Well, you'd be wrong.

After conducting a 12 month in-depth study of illegal immigrants who committed sex crimes and murders for the time period of January 1999 through April 2006 , it is clear that the U.S. public faces a dangerous threat from sex predators who cross the U.S. borders illegally.

There were 1500 cases analyzed in depth. They included: serial rapes, serial murders, sexual homicides, and child molestation committed by illegal immigrants. Police reports, public records, interviews with police, and media accounts were all included. Offenders were located in 36 states, but it is clear, that the most of the offenders were located in states with the highest numbers of illegal immigrants. California was number one, followed by Texas, Arizona, New Jersey, New York, and Florida.

Based on population numbers of 12,000,000 illegal immigrants and the fact that young males make up more of this population than the general U.S. population, sex offenders in the illegal immigrant group make up a higher percentage. When examining ICE reports and public records, it is consistent to find sex offenders comprising 2% of illegals apprehended. Based on this 2% figure, which is conservative, there are approximately 240,000 illegal immigrant sex offenders in the United States.

This translates to 93 sex offenders and 12 serial sexual offenders coming across U.S. borders illegally per day. The 1500 offenders in this study had a total of 5,999 victims. Each sex offender averaged 4 victims. This places the estimate for victimization numbers around 960,000 for the 88 months examined in this study.

That's the meat of the paper - the rest is essentially a list of statistics about the 1500 crimes she actually studied.

So her argument is:

1. Of the illegal immigrants arrested for a crime, 2% were sex offenders.
2. The total numbers of illegal immigrants is approximately 12 million.
3. Therefore, you can determine the number of sex offenders in the entire population of illegal immigrants by multiplying the size of the population (12 million) by 2%, giving you 960,000.

If you actually pay attention to the numbers and how she's trying to slip them past you, it's pretty obvious what kind of scam she's pulling, but she tries to mask it behind a lot of talk about kinds of sex crimes, and why we should expect the number to be high among illegal immigrants.

Here's the trick. 2% of the convicted criminals who happen to be illegal immigrants are guilty of some kind of sex crime. Not 2% of the population of illegal immigrants. The population of convicted criminals is quite different from the population of people as a whole.

To give you an idea: according to this article by the Minnesota Department of Public Safety, in 2001, approximately 5% of the population of people in state prisons were guilty of sex offenses. The estimate of the number of people in the general population guilty of sex crimes varies - but it's generally cited as somewhere between 1/3 of 1%, and 1%.

Now - the number of people in prison is different from the number of people arrested - so those two numbers are not directly comparable. But it should give you an idea of how different statistics about people convicted of crimes can be different from the statistics about the public in general.

So, looking at real statistics, the percentage of illegals guilty of sexual crimes is probably not particularly different from the percentage of non-illegals guilty of sexual crimes. And neither percentage says much of anything about the number of guilty individuals in the population as a whole.

In summary, Dr. Schurman-Kauflin is nothing but another two-bit racist who's trying to trick people using bad math.

http://scienceblogs.com/goodmath/200..._immigra_1.php


So it is fair to say that there may be some who are shifting their statistics to better fit their agenda??

If what I post is true, I think there is plenty left over for roads.

Well, you're definitely pro illegal, whether you get paid or not.

Great investigative work there. Illegals are barred from obtaining social services. Wow. I guess that stopped the illegal border jumpers cold, didn't it? The fact is that just about any illegal alien can get social services with fake documents. The agencies aren't allowed to check if the documents presented by an illegal are valid.

Other than not particularly interesting what bearing does the fact that Angela Wilburn lied have on the cost of illegals.

We may have to take another look at the number of sex crimes committed by illegals in the US.

I fail to see, though, where you put much of a dent in the 338 billion total cost of illegals in the US figure. We subtact the 7 billion from the Social Security suspense fund from the 338 Billion total cost figure and you're down to 331 billions total cost net.

We're still not getting any roads built are we?

I only support the group that has done nothing wrong, who have contributed to society, and who are trying to live a peaceful life here working their butts off for what they have, just as any person living here legally. I don't believe it's fair we put these same illegal immigrants in the group who are malicious, drug dealing murderers and rapists. They don't deserve that. I can't give you a percentage of how many there are in that specific group I support, but this group doesn't cost us 331 billion dollars.

There are plenty of misconceptions regarding illegal immigrants and the anti illegal immigrant media hounds contribute to it. I have given links that show your inaccurate in some of your findings and there are more.

I found this opinionated piece which shows a different view as well:

People who are against issuing driver's licenses to illegal immigrants argue that it does not make our roads safer. The argument that illegal immigrants are "the same drivers as the day before they were granted a license," as Carl Ross wrote in his letter to the editor in Tuesday's Kernel, lacks any notion of logic.

To obtain a driver's license, an individual must pass the written test, vision test and road test so that they can be certified as a valid driver. Issuing illegal immigrants licenses doesn't mean lowering the standard requirements for them. Instead, they have to practice and become competent drivers before they are issued a driver's license.

Driver's licenses are often used in the United States for identification purposes, but they do not give illegal immigrants rights to which they are not entitled, as some people assume falsely. Such photo IDs are not used in the U.S. in order to grant rights but to ensure that an individual's civil identity corresponds with only one physical person.

I am a legal alien who has a valid driver's license in spite of not being an American citizen. I am also aware that under the Military Commissions Act of 2006, the executive branch has the power to detain indefinitely legal aliens like myself on U.S. soil without a writ of habeas corpus. My having a driver's license does not grant me any right to revise my status and demand from a court that I be treated as a citizen in the event that I am put in prison indefinitely. The same applies to other rights that I lack, such as the right to vote.

A May 2007 poll by CBS found that 69 percent of American adults believe illegal immigrants should "be prosecuted and deported for being in the U.S. illegally," although 62 percent also said that aliens who have been in the United States at least two years should be "given a chance to keep their jobs and eventually apply for legal status."

People do, indeed, lack familiarity with the economic reality of illegal immigration in the United States. This state of confusion is reflected on poll results, which vary depending on how the issue is approached and who the respondents are.

http://media.www.kykernel.com/media/...-3106527.shtml

There really isn't anything wrong with giving the people I support a chance is there??

Heck no. I encourage all of these illegal Mexican scabs to self deport back to their Mexican hellholes and apply for American citizenship from their hellholes.

Why are you that way?

I don't want to say it, but I don't think you'd give a (*)(*)(*)(*) even if they were legal. Why pinpoint nationality if it weren't true?

Even if they were legal, are you calling Mexico a hellhole?

Sheesh.

Well I guess I'm fed up with up to 10,000 p(*)(*)(*)(*)'n illegal mostly Mexican scabs breaking in every day, day after day, the vast majority of which are from just one country, Mexico.

Well, why would up to 10,000 mostly Mexican scabs leave Mexico daily, day after day, if Mexico wasn't a hellhole.

When did you leave?

I was born here remember? And I'm not spanish at all, not that you have to know that.

Some are poverty stricken, some need extra money, our country offers it and they come.

I think your mad at the wrong people Clay.

Well, to be specific, I'm most mad at jorge for letting himself be bought off by the scumbag Republican employers of illegals into not enforcing immigration laws which allowed the flood of illegal Mexican scabs into the country. Impeach the SOB. Next I'm most mad at the scumbag Repubican employers of illegals who bought off jorge and had him not enforce immigration laws so that the illegal Mexican scabs could flood into the country, providing the so called cheap labor which is subsidized by taxpayers. Next, I'm mad at the hispandering Democratic politicians trying to engineer an amnesty for 20 million illegal aliens who would mostly be Democratic voters if amnestied, even if it ruined the country. Next I'm most mad at the pro illegal open border lobby activists with their agendas and sob stories and lies. Lastly, I am mad at the illegal Mexican scabs themselves that have invaded our country using fraudulent documents, fraudulently obstaining social services, overcrowding ERs, overcrowding our schools and ruining the quality of our education, prisons full to the brim with illegals, etc. The illegal Mexican scabs need to sent back to their hellholes.

Did I leave anyone out.

For many, the only law they have ever broken was crossing the border illegally. They have been in this country for many years and have contributed to society; they follow the right paths to do the right thing.

I provided the listing of jobs, that Americans will not do, either because it's a low paying job, or it's a dirty job. Even if it paid a $1 or $2 more, Americans will not do it. Comprende?

Even if some illegal immigrants were put on a guest worker program, they would be paid minimum wage and then you would be complaining they're getting paid too much right?

Quit lying. Illegals break numerous laws daily to stay and work in this country.

Again, there are NO jobs that some Americans won't do if the pay is a livable wage.

No, I would be complaining that they shouldn't be any guest workers at all if there were any American citizens available to take the job and get paid a livable wage.