Part 5 of Post Your Tough Questions Regarding Christianity

I'm asking you to be consistent with the Bible. Even though I don't believe in the truth of the Bible, I do believe in consistency. You have made arguments that are just directly contradictory to Scripture and yet you seem to hold it to such a high esteem. It's puzzling.

 

You keep making this claim and yet I have seen no proof for it. According to my reading of history, Mohammad went to Medina and created the Constitution of Medina, giving equal rights to pagans, Jews, Christians and Muslims.

The action of kicking out Jews or attacking them were the actions of individual leaders of certain crusade groups and the Catholic church condemn their actions which eventually did stop. The rights of non-Muslims included:

And how is the Muslim limitation on Christians, which only began in the century leading up to the Crusades, any justification for an extermination? Would the Jews have been justified in slaughtering the inhabitants of Jerusalem when it was controlled by Christians because they were kicked out of the city?

Uh... except the Byzantines didn't get Jerusalem, the Crusaders kept it for themselves. Nice try.

You do realize that there were different nations of Muslims, right? That's like trying to say that France was representative of all of Christianity.

 

Huh? I still see no one other that abraham at that time, being aware of God. Who in the Amorites or caananites was revealed?

14 But I will punish the nation they serve as slaves, and afterward they will come out with great possessions.
According to the book they were slaves in egypt. So why the punishment of amorites/caananites?

15 You, however, will go to your ancestors in peace and be buried at a good old age. 16 In the fourth generation your descendants will come back here, for the sin of the Amorites has not yet reached its full measure.”
So God didn't reveal himself to get them to change their ways, if he even revealed him/they/themselves to them, but had to wait for their sins to become even more sinful? That is how I read it. Maybe I'm illogical.

Anyways, I should expect the reply to this around christmas, 2013?

 

Well you are making enormous strides in the last couple days.

 

Silly...
God reveal himself to the sexually promiscuous whoredoms that surrounded the Hebrew patriarchs?

That is like expecting Islam to tolerate the incursions and proximity of the present Western culture which working to expand and profit from its pornography and sexual aggressiveness.
The young people are easy targets for the pided pipers of sex, who these patriarchs want to raise up to resist sex before marriage and to avoid divorce and fatherless families.

God has been revealing the consequences to ignoring what he says by pointing to how easily those decadent societies are destroyed.

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Silly...
God reveal himself to the sexually promiscuous whoredoms that surrounded the Hebrew patriarchs?

That is like expecting Islam to tolerate the incursions and proximity of the present Western culture which working to expand and profit from its pornography and sexual aggressiveness.
The young people are easy targets for the pided pipers of sex, who these patriarchs want to raise up to resist sex before marriage and to avoid divorce and fatherless families.

God has been revealing the consequences to ignoring what he says by pointing to how easily those decadent societies are destroyed.

 

Almost all the Hebrew patriarchs were sexually promiscuous.


You got no argument.

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Almost all the Hebrew patriarchs were sexually promiscuous.


You got no argument.

 

The Muslims combine their new found religion Islam, power and wealth and that gave all Muslim steppe and desert warriors the very reason and excuse to take everything by force and it would be their Islam that would galvanize them to carry out wars of aggression and conversion. The Byzantine were not prepared to fight this new threat because the Byzantines were fighting for territories not religion it will take 400 years for the Byzantine to realise that what is motivating the Muslims to great success in the battlefield is their extreme faith not just plundering, their religion gave them the excuse to plunder and kill these Muslims are not like the Huns, the Huns come and go that's it. Until it was too late and only Christian West is left, finally calling for a Crusade only a Crusade can match the jihadist of Islam.

I suggest you look at the past and present what Muslim colonizers and conqeurors have done to Turkey, Middle East, India, Afghanistan, Iran and Iraq.

Ayatollah Khomeini was so popular because that is what Islam is all about since 680 AD it was and is all about regression, repression and oppression, all you need to do is to open your eyes and see what is happening in Muslim countries and none of it is due to Christians or the West. In fact if it wasn't for the West the security and stability of the free world will be gone.

Sweden and Israel don't kick other religious people out because they respect freedom of religion, unlike Muslim countries and again I point out to you the current wars and struggles that Muslim countries are experiencing that has drag us into their affairs because good Muslims are not capable of defending themselves.

Yes, and that is why the Crusaders in spite of being outnumber they still find ways to defeat the stronger and larger Muslim armies in fact Salahadin knew that if Muslims continue to oppress Christians and deny them access to the Holy Land Muslims might loose Syria, Egypt and worse Mecca and Medina to the Crusades. Remember, Muslims after taking back Jerusalem never stop their plans to conquer Europe until finally led by the Turks in 1500's Muslim armies once again invaded mainland Europe, so stop kidding yourself that Muslim have no interest in Europe, look at present day Europe.

Is that an excuse why Muslim failed to conquer Europe? If it is, it just clearly show the failure of Muslim leaders to modernize and again present current situation in Turkey, Saudi Arabia and most Muslim countries is showing that same failure the failure to modernize through respect of freedom.

We could, if we are not being constantly threaten by Muslim conquerors.

 

I have a tough question for a Christian.
Why would God give someone the pride to believe they can compellingly represent the faith, but not the skill?

 

...but there daughters weren't, because of the practice of honor killings.

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What do you mean by the faith?

 

Since the question was directed at Christians, what would be your guess?

 

Yeah, pretty much if they could get that lucky with the women being virtuous and prudent.

The men are aggressive sexually.
They do chase after the girls who are supposed to catch them, and keep them as husbands.

The social problems begin when this reverses, and the women can chase after the man of the moment who offers the best opportunities for whatever is her life pursuit.
That harlotry destroys the purpose of Family, which is supposed to the only reason that girls will keep one man whom they manage to catch.

 

One can get way off guessing.

Especially Christians get way off defining faith, too.

Do they mean Faith or faith?
Do they mean a specific denominational Christian religion?
Do they mean faith in the same way as belief, when they can not make concrete arguments for a particular opinion they hold??

Is faith not common for and to all people, though held in regard to different views?

In other words, what are you talking about???

 

He cannot answer that. He cannot even explain why the Pyramids show no signs of ever having been under water. If memory serves me correct he claimed they were built after the flood but they predate the flood so how is that possible?

 

Abraham and David had wives and concubines, hundreds of the latter in fact. Do they advance the "purpose of the family"?
Your argument is just misogyny. Outdated by approximately 100 years.

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You are inadvertently proving my point.

 

I have maintain consistency that the Bible is the Word of God, what ever you think is contradictory is because you refuse to see the Bible for all it's worth instead you want to supplant it with un-biblical claims.

 

I don't need to make claims facts and current events speaks for its self. You want proof??? You are telling me that present condition and situations in Muslim countries are not proof enough??? That so called Constitution of Medina, tell me has any of the materials written there such as freedom of religion, equality etc. is it being practice since its inception in 630 AD? If you say it is then tell me why are women discriminated, why are Christians not allowed to expand or practice their faith without fear of attacks, what kind of freedom are you referring?

The oppression of Christians especially their access to the Holy Land is what precipitated the Crusades. Any justification of the extermination of Christians and Jews in Mecca and Medina?

Byzantine were interested in their whole territory not just Jerusalem, Crusades were interested only on the Holy Land.

Yes, there are several Muslim groups and the largest are the sunnis and shiits that have been at each others throats even before the Crusades, in fact the Kabaa was once destroy not by Christians but by rival Muslims.

 

Why has the Christian Church rejected the original Nicene Creed 325 which taught that there were three different beings in the Godhead and that only one of those beings, the Father, was the one God?

Why has the Christian Church rejected the Sabbath Commandment?

 

You aren't even addressing anything I'm saying anymore. YOU said that humans other than Noah's family survived in other parts of the world. THE BIBLE says that all humans were wiped from the face of the Earth (except for Noah's family). YOU said that the Bible doesn't even use the word "Earth", but rather "world". I provided you the verses that show that you were completely wrong. ADDRESS THESE ISSUES and stop avoiding them by tap dancing with rhetoric.

 

... Surely you're joking. How in the world would modern conditions tell you anything about what happened in the past? We learn what happened in the past through written records, not looking at modern conditions and guessing about what happened.

I'd like it if you actually read the links I provided and had some intellectual integrity. The link answers these questions.

I thought you said that it was Muslim aggression. Which one is it?

How about you provide a source that this actually even happened?

The Byzantine Empire was not restored, the Crusaders STOLE the old Byzantine territory for themselves.

This isn't what I'm talking about. There were separate NATIONS composed of Muslims. Which one of these nations was representative of Islam?

 

You have been consistent. But in some cases in direct opposition to the bible. That is what he's asking. How?
You claim the bible to be perfect, you claim to understand it and then post consistently in opposition to the exact words in the bible. Is the world = earth? That kind of BS.

 

He does do a lot of dancing. However not really tap. More like a bull dancing in a china shop. And no, this isn't a racial statement.

 

No. That is wrong.

 

Firstly, world and earth, yes you are correct and I did admit I think it was on dairyair post that I said the Bible said "earth" I brought that to check if you did read the Bible or not properly and you did at the same time if you interpret the Bible the way you wanted you will never understand it you have to understand the Bible the way God wanted it to be understood. As far as the Noah flood I will repeat, the Bible said the earth and humankind were wipe out there is two ways to understand the Noah flood:
1. Metaphorically; the earth is indeed full of wickedness, right do you agree? such as child sacrifices, wars, child soldiers, slavery, ethnic cleansing, criminality, torture, head heading, etc. you name it wars are fought with such brutality. Noah represent hope, peace, and civility, flood represent the punishment which is death or the concept live by the sword die by the sword, crime doe snot pay. People may think they can get away with their evilness because they kill every one that stands in their way but at the end of the road justice will be serve they will be punish and that is where the Noah's flood come in.
2. Factually; The Bible said earth now 4000 years ago or at the estimated time line of the flood which according to historians is around 2300 BC during Noah's flood we don't know what was happening in other parts of the world what we know is a general picture example in China, India, great floods wiping out rice fields, wars and natural disaster, Central America rise of Incas and Mayan empires build on heavy ethnic cleansing blood sacrifices to appease the gods and calm natural disasters, Pacific we have probably volcanic eruption, earthquakes, typhoons massive tidal waves wiping out entire villages great famine, Western Europe was still unpopulated or has a scarce population, Egypt and other parts of the Middle East probably great sand storms it was during that era that pyramids were build to honour the gods. A world wide calamity the Bible said 150 days the earth was flooded so for 150 days the world was experiencing a worldwide natural calamity it was the end of the world for the people that are affected.

Dose historians have an exact answer for the 150 days as to what has happen? No they have presented was a general idea with civilization and that was the bronze age, the advancement of literature etc. but how about the exact dates? None they have none only a generalization that there was advancement in civilization and they are right there was advancement in civilization in that era because after 150 days God vow that He will never destroy humanity again and that mark the beginning of human progression.
Genesis 7
21 The Lord smelled the pleasing aroma and said in his heart: “Never again will I curse the ground because of humans, even though[a] every inclination of the human heart is evil from childhood. And never again will I destroy all living creatures, as I have done.

My point is science does not know what happen the exact date of the 150 days that the Bible said the earth experience a worldwide natural calamity, but science do agree that the natural disaster can be disastrous to ancient villages and cities were whole cities and villages are wiped out and science have discover many such destruction and are still in the process of researching what happen.

After the flood were their survivors? yes, in other parts of the world and this survivors build structure to honour and pray for their gods to thank them . Survivors not from Noah's region.

 

The modern condition especially in Muslim countries is exactly what it was nothing has change and for you to treat the ill treatment of women, none Muslims, and the oppression and regression in those Muslim countries as a joke is really very concerning

I did, the Medina Constitution is a ruse or trickery to get the Christians and Jews guards down because when it was written Mohammed was not ready to age war he needed time so he came up with this constitution remember according to their koran Muslim are allow to lie and use all kinds of trickery against the infidels. And it work, Christians and Jews even the Byzantine trusted the Muslims only to find themselves one by one getting wipe out.

Yes it was Muslim aggression and oppression of Christian and Jews, thanks for correcting me.

Read some real history such as those written by Muslims and you will learn just how Mohammed betrayed his Christian and Jewish allies.

No they were not, because the Crusades was not about the restoration of the Byzantine it was about securing the Holy Land.

All of those Muslim nations compose of Muslim represent Islam go and ask them they will all say they are the real representation of Islam.

 

No, you've got it backwards; most steppe horsemen made empires and then converted to Islam. Most would then attempt to expand, but they were generally intent on expansion independent of what their religion was. For instance, the Mongols were Nestorian Christians, Tengrists, Muslims, Buddhists, and animists. Religion did not particularly influence their desire to engage in empire-building.

No, the Byzantines' main problem was internal strife, as the position of Emperor was very unstable. There was constant infighting, subterfuge, and politicking for a member of the aristocracy to assume the imperial throne with little regard for external enemies of any stripe. There's a reason for the adjective byzantine (with a lowercase "b") meaning "of, relating to, or characterized by a devious and usually surreptitious manner of operation <a Byzantine power struggle>" (source: Merriam-Webster).

Outside of Turkey, all of those nations and regions were colonized by Britain and France. Turkey, conversely, is one of the most secularized nations with an Islamic majority outside of the former Soviet Union. It is comparable to many Latin American nations as far as civil rights go. It's not perfect, but it's not a terrible nation, either.

That point flew right over your head. To give you a brief summary: the US and UK supported the Shah, who used a brutal secret police force to oppress the population and use the oil wealth of the nation to enrich foreigners rather than benefiting native Iranians. The main opposition was Ayatollah Khomeini, and when the Shah started to get too dictatorial, there was a widespread revolt based on what Khomeini was saying (namely: oust the imperialists and install a native Iranian government based on traditional Islamic values).

And similar stories arise throughout Dar al-Islam. In Afghanistan, the Taliban rose in power in response to the Soviet invasion (funding from the US to support the mujahadin helped too) and al-Qaida developed from the foreign mujahadin coming in from all over the Muslim world, especially Saudi Arabia. The Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt got as popular as it has because for a long time it was the only popular movement that opposed the US-supported dictator Mubarik. And so on and so forth. Islamicist movements are popular in many regions because they are often the only groups with strong bona fides for consistent and strong opposition to colonial governments in their nations.

[quoe]Sweden and Israel don't kick other religious people out because they respect freedom of religion, unlike Muslim countries[/quote]

Sweden, maybe not, but Israel has definitely been expelling Arabs (both Christian and Muslim, but primarily Muslim) from their land.

[quoe]and again I point out to you the current wars and struggles that Muslim countries are experiencing that has drag us into their affairs because good Muslims are not capable of defending themselves.[/quote]

Or maybe it's because of centuries of European colonialism?

Not really. The First Crusade was the only successful one, and that was well before Saladin was around. Most of the time, the Crusaders were flailing around in the desert rather unsuccessfully because, as it turns out, tactics that work out great in temperate European plains tend to fail in hot deserts.

Plus, there were a bunch of Islamic states in the region and many of them were untouched by the Crusaders. The Turkish states in Anatolia were rarely pushed back by any Crusader armies, for instance.

You realize that by the 1500s, Europe had become an attractive target due to the wealth coming in from the Americas?

And there are very, very few Muslims who think there should be an invasion of Europe. There are Muslims who migrate there, but that's due to economic opportunities that are absent in their home nations. It's the same reason Christian Africans immigrate to Europe, Canada, or the United States. It's not a nefarious plot to conquer Europe.

The Ottomans are not the sole representatives of Islam. The various Islamic nations in SE Asia, for instance, had no desire to invade Europe, nor the means to do so.

Most nations, Muslim, Christian, or otherwise, are "modernized" and respectful of civic freedoms. That's more a result of how societies work than anything else. After all, most of Europe and the Americas haven't been respectful of such things for more than, oh, 50ish years. The First Nations in Canada were oppressed very thoroughly prior to about the 1970s, black people in the United States were legally second-class citizens until the Civil Rights Bill was signed into law (and for a while afterward as old laws were slowly dismantled), while France was brutalizing its second-class citizens (native Algerians) in Algeria.

So, yeah, you probably shouldn't be going on about how civilized European Christians and Americans are since they only started to shape up about a generation ago.

And this, class, is how we blame the victim.