Gender doesn't exist...

Discussion in 'Gay & Lesbian Rights' started by Yant0s, Mar 12, 2021.

  1. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    Not my problem that the FACTS expose your opinion as FALLACIOUS.

    And neither is it anyone else's problem that YOU cannot grasp the CONCEPT of gender.
     
  2. Yant0s

    Yant0s Active Member

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    You're arguing that gender/sex isn't a social construct (which is true). I understand sex is purely down to biological reasons.

    The studies you're linking confirm this. Therefore sex isn't EVER a preference nor can it be changed as it's in your DNA . This is why gender doesn't exist.

    I completely agree with your point. Yes you're right. I'm not disagreeing with you.

    All I'm saying is the concept identify yourself with a socially constructed gender is nonsense. Like you're saying you are your biology "sex" and gender preference doesn't exist (which your studies confirm).

    So yeah, gender doesn't exist. Only biological sex and you're litrerally arguing my point for me and linking studies that confirm this.
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2021
  3. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    So is a biological male body with a biological female brain a male of a female?

    That was in the link that I just posted where it established that you can have a male body with a female brain.

    So if gender does not exist what does the female brain in the male body identify as according to YOU?
     
  4. Yant0s

    Yant0s Active Member

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    They are simply are what they are. The studies you've linked confirm this.

    I'm not denying that a biological female brain can be inside a males skull. I get that. The studies confirm this.

    Why can't you understand that the studies you're linking are confirming that sexual identity is purely biological.

    If sexual identity is purely biological the studies are literally PROVING gender is NOT a social construct. You are your biological/sex.

    Which confirms my argument that gender doesn't exist only biology.
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2021
  5. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    You did NOT answer my question!

    Why not?

    If YOU had a female brain in a male body how would YOU identify yourself?

    Your BODY is attracted to females.

    Your MIND is attracted to males.

    Your BRAIN is in CONFLICT with your PHYSICAL appearance as a male.

    Your BRAIN wants your body to wear female clothing.

    Your BRAIN is afraid that if you wear female clothing you will be beaten up.

    People around YOU treat you like a male. Women are SUSPICIOUS of you and men wonder WHY you are NOT one of the guys.

    YOU do NOT fit into society because you are NEITHER male nor female because you are BOTH male AND female.

    How do YOU explain this WITHOUT the CONCEPT of GENDER?
     
  6. Yant0s

    Yant0s Active Member

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    Why are you not getting this ?

    Everything you're saying is irrelevant to my point.
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2021
  7. Yant0s

    Yant0s Active Member

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    Please read my original answer. The trauma felt by trans I sympathise with , but it is completely irrelevant to the fact that the studies are clearly showing that sexual identity is purely biological.

    This proves idea that gender is a social construct is FALSE. I also find that the idea that "gender" is a social construct/ preference is very insulting to trans.

    You are your biology and that is that.
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2021
  8. ToddWB

    ToddWB Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Transgender doesn't exist, even if you remove the sex organs (used to call that a sp.), DNA defines your gender, and it's 99.09 % of the time either male or female.
     
  9. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    I am saying this because it is YOU that is NOT getting any of it!

    The REALITY is that you CANNOT answer those questions because you do NOT understand what it would be like to be in that SITUATION which is REALITY for MILLIONS of transgenders.
     
  10. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    GENDER identity is NOT the same thing as sexual identity and YOU have just CONCEDED that it is POSSIBLE to have a BRAIN that does NOT align with the SEX of the physical body which is WHY the CONCEPT of GENDER exists.

    If you are your biology then WHICH biology are YOU referring to?

    The BODY or the BRAIN because BOTH are BIOLOGICAL?
     
  11. Yant0s

    Yant0s Active Member

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    I don't need to feel what it feels like to be trans.

    It's completely irrelevant. We literally scientific studies including what you liked the ones you linked proving what I am saying to be true.
     
  12. Yant0s

    Yant0s Active Member

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    If you believe this why did you go to the trouble of linking actual scientific studies that completely undermine your whole argument and prove your belief to be wrong!
     
  13. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    The studies prove that what you are saying about gender is FALSE!
     
  14. Yant0s

    Yant0s Active Member

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    Nope they prove that sexual identity (gender if you will) is purely biological. If that's the case (which it is) gender cannot be a social construct.
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2021
  15. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for CONFIRMING that you are INCAPABLE of understanding the CONCEPT of GENDER and thereby DISQUALIFYING yourself from discussing this topic.

    Have a nice day!
     
  16. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    Thank for CONFIRMING that YOU do NOT understand the studies.
     
  17. Yant0s

    Yant0s Active Member

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    Stop behaving rude and acting obnoxiously. It's not my fault that you're completely undermining your own beliefs.

    Why take the time to prove that sexual identity is purely biological and then turn around and argue it's a social construct.
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2021
  18. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    I NEVER did anything of the sort!

    I am NOT responsible for your INABILITY to comprehend BOTH the studies AND the CONTENT of my posts.

    But thanks for CONFIRMING your self disqualification on this matter.
     
  19. Yant0s

    Yant0s Active Member

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    "identical twins are more often both transgender than fraternal twins, indicating that there is indeed a genetic influence for this identity. So, what genes might be responsible?

    [​IMG]Figure 2: Transgender women tend to have brain structures that resemble cisgender women, rather than cisgender men. Two sexually dimorphic (differing between men and women) areas of the brain are often compared between men and women. The bed nucleus of the stria terminalus (BSTc) and sexually dimorphic nucleus of transgender women are more similar to those of cisgender woman than to those of cisgender men, suggesting that the general brain structure of these women is in keeping with their gender identity.
    Several studies confirmed previous findings, showing once more that transgender people appear to be born with brains more similar to gender with which they identify, rather than the one to which they were assigned."






    I'll link one of you posts again.

    Why are you arguing that sexual identity is down to biology if you don't believe in it?

    I agree with your post I've linked . Why have you changed your mind?

    The fact is if sexual identity is down to ones biology. It's impossible for it to be a social construct.

    It doesn't matter how rude and toxic your replies are it still doesn't make up for the blatant inconsistencies and complete lack of logic in what you're saying.
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2021
  20. Maquiscat

    Maquiscat Well-Known Member

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    At no point have I said that gender doesn't exist. If you look at the thread you will find me claiming that gender is indeed an innate trait of every individual. However if you are going to claim something as shown by science, as you did with the aggression and maternal traits, then be prepared to back it up. Otherwise you do more damage to the cause than aid.



    If you don't want to debate the science then don't bring it up.

    Which is great and fine, but we are not discussing the LBGT community as a whole. We are discussing transgender specifically. Therefore bringing the community numbers in as a whole distorts the argument. Transgenders are probably closer to 1 to 2% of the overall population.

    That's a guess as to what the numbers mean. For all we know there just really isn't that many men. That's the problem with trying to guess how many are still in denial/hiding. We can never be sure. I could as easily put out that same idea of male rape victims of women rapists. Way more underrepresented than women victims because there is even more denial of their victimization than women experience.


    I don't disagree with that. I have no doubt that as the older generations die out, and the younger ones age, that any new ideas will become more accepted. That's pretty much history 101. Still not anything I said.



    Is your browser broken somehow? Even on my phone I can touch one of these buttons:
    upload_2021-3-17_19-36-23.png
    I can hit them with my mouse as well.
     

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  21. Maquiscat

    Maquiscat Well-Known Member

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    While I agree with you on the first part, labels are not meant to be about a person as a whole. They are shortcut descriptors of various parts of the person. That's why several labels can apply at the same time. And granted many labels can be used in many different ways.

    It's only restricting if there is an attempt to restrict it. If you are going to hold that gender is tied to sex, or that there is only two genders, then that would be an artificial restriction, but that does not prove that gender is false.

    Why not? Gender should not be used as a weapon or a means of discrimination, same as skin color, religion, sex itself, nationality, even disorders. But why should gender not be part of the various descriptors of ourselves?

    No we are not beyond labels. Labels are an essential part of language. The problem only comes when some people try to prevent labels from evolving with language and knowledge.

    No stereotyping itself does this, and anything can be stereotyped. Hair color, skin color, interests (ex:geeks), religion, sex, political lean, and so much more. Just because something is stereotyped, doesn't mean it does not exist.

    You and I are on the same page when it comes to the damage that stereotyping does. But noting that does not support any argument of whether or not gender exists.

    Yes. I don't always understand why, but I do understand who. But I do acknowledge that it has taken me years to sort it all out and that others may never manage it. HOwever, It is my belief that such a problem comes from others trying to insist on what you are. And when I state that people have a gender, I do not say what that gender is. I can make educated guesses based upon other data, but only that person can know.

    Because we are the ones determining our own labels. Now that doesn't automatically mean that we determine what a given label means. That is a matter of lingual evolution. However, simply having a penis doesn't mean that I automatically have to apply the label man, or aggressive, or alpha, or anything else. Someone else trying to insist whether or not a label applies to me is them trying to stereotype.

    Non-Sequitur. There is no logical link there. That's like saying that if you believe in hair color then you must believe in stereotyping (ex: redheads have fiery tempers). Again, stereotyping something does not provide any evidence that it doesn't exist.
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2021
  22. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

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    A dad from Kansas City, Missouri named Brandon Boulware has gone viral after testifying in front of the Missouri House of Representatives emergency issues committee. Boulware, the father of a transgender daughter, was there to ask lawmakers to stop discriminating against trans youth. His testimony was on March 3 – his daughter's birthday.


    Boulware introduced himself as a lifelong Missourian, business lawyer, Christian, son of a Methodist minister, husband and father to four children, "including a wonderful and beautiful transgender daughter."

    "Today happens to be her birthday. And I chose to be here," Boulware said. "She doesn't know that. She thinks I'm at work."
    https://www.cbsnews.com/news/brandon-boulware-missouri-transgender-student-athlete-bill/


    Parents of transgender people disagree with your premise.
     
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  23. The Rhetoric of Life

    The Rhetoric of Life Banned

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    I know a transgender parent who's also a cop.

    Sometimes I feel like Fry from Futurama when I think about it, but I think I'm lucky.
     
  24. Maquiscat

    Maquiscat Well-Known Member

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    Yant0s, brother, I love you, but this is clearly a case of the pot calling the kettle black.
     
  25. Maquiscat

    Maquiscat Well-Known Member

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    Again this is non-sequitur. You are not making a logical link. Especially in the light of the linked studies showing that sex and gender are not linked in a definitive set. Yes, there is a common pairing, but it is not guarenteed. Same as there is a common paring with one's sex and their sexual attraction, but it is not guarenteed.

    .

    I think you missed a conceptual step here. What is socially constructed is that a given gender means that for gender X, A B and C traits will be present. But that is the stereotyping, not the existence of what you are. My gender is man, but that doesn't mean that the stereotype of liking sports applies to me. For that matter, those stereotypes do not even remain consistent throughout history.
     

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