a lot of the misunderstandings about Christianity come from a lack of wisdom about human nature

That's the problem, man can't ever be good enough. Man needs a Savior.

 

How about you just read the newspaper?

 

It didn't say slavery is good, it moderated in a more humane way a human institution, and it NEVER said raping women is acceptable. This should clear up your misunderstanding:

https://www.answering-islam.org/Shamoun/ot_and_rape.htm

'Rape' is a bad translation, it means if a man seduces a woman he must take responsibility by either marrying her with no possibility of divorce or paying the equivalent of a year's wages. Unlike today where women are used like kleenix.

 

Why? A dead universe doesn't care, might makes right in that case.

 

I will reply in couple weeks, after my infractions expire.

 

Just curious, how is it you can respond to this? I may need to know someday.

 

Apparently he intends to say something he thinks might earn him another infraction and thus a banning... I think for once he might be right about something.

 

An argument that would hold more weight if not for the endless examples of immoral and amoral behavior of those who label themselves as Christians. Example being the Evangelical support of Trump, an obviously amoral man and the relative silence in calling him out for his amoral behavior. Romney (a Mormon) called him out and is told by Trump that Romney should be impeached. So in Trumpland sticking to one’s Christian principles and placing country over party loyalty is the real sin. Theater of the absurd.

This is how I see it; Christians get a bad rap because they demand others follow codes of conduct they they cannot even follow themselves. Christians need to remove the plank from their own eye before trying to help others with the plank speck of dust in their own. Talking the talk is easy yet unimpressive.

In general I see no moral difference between those who do not believe like me, and those who do like you. Morality does not require belief in a God.

 

I don't believe that 'sinful' is even a valid concept 95% of the time.

 

Fine I'll prove it. But first.
1. Sin is a religious term, actually it's an ancient archery term for essentially anything but a bullseye. To miss the mark.
2. What constitutes sinning is defined by God not by man.

So with that in mind if you answer yes to any of the following you are a sinner and have missed the mark.

1. Ever looked at a woman and wish you could have sex with her?

2. Ever been so mad you wished harm on someone?

3. Ever envied anything your neighbor has?

4. Ever lied?

5. Ever thought of anything as more important than God?

If you answered yes to any of these you're a sinner.
If you answered no to all of them you lied about #4. And are a sinner.

 

Exactly. And we will be judged by our own standard. If we ever criticized someone else for lying, what happens when we lie?

 

I am merely avoiding this place in protest for what I consider arbitrary and unfair infraction to avoid the possibility of further actions leading to a ban.

 

Ms kazenatsu referred me to this thread to demonstrate her knowledge of human nature. Well, it didn't go well. It seems to be a dark and distorted view of reality.

And this from her: "There are a bunch of naive idealists out there who believe "humanity is mostly good, humanity is inherently good". Well, that's really the root at which they go wrong."


She couldn't be more wrong. In a social setting what do we mean by good and bad. Good is smooth, polite, productive social contacts, it means cooperation, civilized behavior, being law abiding. It insures a stable productive society. It is how we evolved as a social animal to be successful.

If man is inherently bad society would breakdown, the social contract would be broken, we would not be evolutionarily successful and would have died out long ago. You can point to man's failures, but they only hindered the success of the species and have not been the dominant force.

On balance man is inherently more good than bad or we would not be a success as a species.

 

My argument was that society probably would break down. And that the fact it doesn't may have more to do with miraculous intervention behind the scenes than the actual nature of humans who appear to be running things.

Besides that, just try to imagine what things would be like if you removed the better half of humanity. I have a feeling this could lead to problems becoming exponentially worse. (probably not a linear mathematical relationship)

 

Or just read some of the various threads I've posted:

Globalists couldn't care less about human rights violations around the world (check post #5 here)

 

They NEVER provide proof for their supernatural claims.

 

I would append "without evidence" to "Just not BELIEVING in him." One has to believe without actually having any evidence to support believing. This never made any sense to me but it apparently makes sense to a lot of other people.

 

On balance man is inherently more good than bad or we would not be a success as a species.
In other words you are wrong. BTW cynicism is not a healthy attitude.

 

Aside from a handful of actual psychopaths, I've never heard of a a person as "inherently sinful" as the God that's described in the Bible. In fact, even the psychopaths don't quite stack up.

 

I sometimes wonder if all of us our not a product of our environment ? I believe one could take a course on human behavior and still come away confused by the actions of some. I often lay in bed at night and contemplate the days news and wonder how did we get to this place.

I look at my own life as I lived with many people of different ways of bringing up a child. Looking back I found myself treating most people better than my own family. When I watch some fathers and how they have such a loving and happy relationship with their children and the kids return love it makes me sad. My relationship with my dad was distant as he was in the service during WWII and when he returned he was always working, never abusive, but never much involved either. He died when I was 14. Someone told me the only parenting skills I had also died then also as I had nothing to base fatherhood on. This was true with my kids. I also find my relationship with God is mediocre at best. I believe in God but I don't love or dislike God. The word sin itself just means: to be off the mark. I have always hated that word as it conjures up images of some sort of depravity. I believe we have life easier with a good family, civics taught in school, religion and proper council when we go off the mark. Today must be very hard with the internet social sites.

 

Man has progressed substantially in ethics. Its social evolution has given rights to animals, children, women, races, groups and sexes they have never had before in the past. We treat each other better than we ever did in the past.
As for the believe that human nature is inherently sinful, that is pure nonsense. It may have flaws as any being does but inherently sinful? What is sin? A transgression against divine law? That is open to many interpretations. It is lack of conformity to the ethics of the day. Littering and beating your wife weren't "sins" at one time. Most everyone, as best they can, behaves ethically. If they don't it tears the social fabric and it breaks down which is not good for a social species and it would become extinct. If we were inherently sinful we would have faced extinction long ago.
Do I repeat myself?

 

Man can afford to have better ethics than in the past. We are not in a survival mode where it is difficult to get adequate food and water or avoid being killed by other humans or wild animals mode, To a large degree this has been made possible by technology. When or if the system collapses the ethics of surviving humans will revert to the stone age.

 

I understand what you are saying all too well. My father was of the same generation as yours. Acted the same as yours. My mother was borderline abusive and likely had some mental health issues. I think for people of that era there were some generational issues that impacted their parenting skills that we cannot fully understand today.

 

The theists avoid the idea that God sends us to hell. According to them we send ourselves.

This video shows how this sort of thinking works.

 

Are you sure you are not ignoring the New Testament which states "For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law" -- this scripture seems to mean the Old Testament still applies.