History of the universe in 10 minutes

So return to a holding place, until judgement B4 Him as Son?

And God 'cant' go to Hell, as He has confined Himself from it, or His righteousness wont allow Him in there?

Ergo, God is NOT everywhere....case close.

 

There is no where that exist where His presence is not. Like I said before, the place where all the dead goes (saints and sinners) is back to God. It goes back to Him because our spirit is Himself that He gave to us at conception.

 

Do you believe in 'Total Restoration?' As the total coming back together of the inital perfect creation.

Some believe that eternity may be different than infinity.

As eternity is limited by God to a segment (altho very, very, very long period to we mortals to comprehend): whereas, infinity is forever & beyond.

And so, those who are cast into the lake of fire, or are as fallen angels, including Satan, may be restored wayyyy down the line after eternity; and that all creation will come back together and be united in harmony with God the Father of lights et al, and Creation will be restored to as God desired & planned it. And all will be with the Lord God 'forever!'

 

The Bible says that God will make all things new and the former things will not be remembered or come to mind.

Well, yes it is. Eternity is a state of being.......Jesus said, this is eternal life, is to know God and Jesus whom He has sent. But infinity is without end or begining.

Believe it or not the lake of fire that the wicked will be cast into will be the Earth. What I mean is the entire Earth will be set ablaze and all and everything on the surface will be consumed in the heat and flame...excepting those who have been glorified.....the fire cannot harm them. The scriptures say the wicked will be ash under the saint’s feet. This is where God begins to make all things new. Satan and his demons will be destroyed and will exist no more.

 

And so, 'total restoration' of all in all is off the table for your then?

So when God created everything in 6 days (or eras) and said it was 'good,' He purposely did not say 'perfect,' and He expected to have an imperfect creation? Foreknowledge of the imperfections, with His plan of His Son to come to restore all things. And what does 'restoring all things' entail? Guess it is w/o some of his creations? As His final creation will be perfect!

 

I can see infinity as having no beginning nor end, as a circle.

Then eternity would have a starting point, such as creation, and go on forever, as in traveling along with infinity....eternity is a portion of infinity, and looks just as infinity once it starts to an observer at that start.

 

Good.

Great!

So "we don't know, but we're working on it" doesn't work for you, then? Because that's the honest answer.

Um... no. That is absolute, complete and utter BS.

As long as the matter exists, then any explanation for the origin of life is good to go. A scientist studying the origin of life does not need to know where matter came from, because it is not important to her studies.

I'm sorry to break it to you, but that's simply the way it is.

I'm glad to know it.

I think I know what my next signature is going to be:

Most atheists do NOT make the knowledge claim that gods absolutely do not exist. Atheism is the lack of belief in a higher power or powers. "Belief" is the operative word, here.

You are aware that belief and knowledge are two different things... right? They are NOT synonyms.

In other words, the only reason to believe in God is because we don't know the origin of matter?

Congratulations. You have shown yourself to be impressed by a fallacy. I hope you're proud.

Into things that have absolutely nothing to do with it.

Yeah?

And?

So?

What?

So you go from "there is no evidence" to "it can't be done".

There's an old phrase... "absence of evidence does not equal evidence of absence."

So scientists don't currently know how matter "came in to" existence. So what? That's an argument for "we don't know, so let's figure it out", not "Goddidit".

Why?

Here's a way to look at it:

Infinity has no starting or end point. It's goes both backwards, forwards, up, down, and to the sides without end.

Eternity, on the other, actually has a starting point. So while it goes on forever, it does have a point that it can be traced back to.

 

How nice for you. Now, back to the point: you are NOT using logical reason here, because you employ a non-sequitur. I take it you know what that means? It's called a 'logical fallacy', which means it is NOT sound logic, quite the opposite. Not knowing one thing, has no bearing on whether we know another unrelated thing. It really is that simple.

 

That's okay.

http://youtu.be/UZ1CgIhKF8k

 

Jesus the Christ - son of god and true god from true god - does not promote rape, genocide and hatred. And also Christians don't promote rape, genocide and hatred.

http://youtu.be/niS4Emp64q8

 

The making of all things now is not a restoration of the way things were before sin......it is a new creation. It new where nether sin or Satan and his demons will exist or even be remembered or the world as it was will come to mind.....it will be as if they had never existed. The world in the new creation will not look like it did in the Garden of Eden. In the new creation there won't be any sea, any animals, any air and no night, no death and no one will need any of the things that is needed to support life nor will we be subjected to the physical laws that we are currently subjected to.

What is called the six day creation is not a creation but a renewing or repairing. Most Christians are unaware that before God made Adam and Eve Satan or Lucifer's as he was named before he rebelled had his throne kingd on the Earth......his throne is still here by the way. He was not in Heaven when he sinned but on the Earth. The Bible said that Satan said in his heart (mind) I will ascend above the heights of the cloud, I will be like the most high......this is describing the Earth, not Heaven. Satan's rebellion caused massive destruction worldwide to the Earth.....it is possible that is what caused the destruction of the dinosaurs and all those animals that existed before God made Adam and Eve.

 

I think that would be looking at eternity the way man would see it. I prefer to see it the way Jesus said it is……He has more authority on that subject than anyone else since He experienced it.

 

Ok, but then you can't tell us that Christians are wrong for saying God exist.

And that explanation is based on the premise that God does not exist. The Bible said that God created it all.....its possibly one reason why evolutionist never tries to theorize how matter came into being.

Not the ones that are on this board or have talked to personally......they absolutely say that God does not exist.

Nope.....as I said before my conviction goes way beyond that but reasoning is the only level that I can come down to in which you should be able to understand what I am talking about.

If one can prove that matter cannot come into existence by itself then it was at least suggest that someone that is outside of matter did it. And if such a one did it it would also mean that that person is also responsible for what comes after the Big Bang.

You can't say we are incorrect when we say God created the universe.

Because I know it is impossble and what is impossble there will be no evdidence.....so its not a contradiction.

I have seen atheist use that as a reason to say God does not exist.....they can't see Him, hear Him, or feel Him so they conclude His does not exist.

Like I said before, you can't say we are incorrect about what we believe.

Because design tells us that there is a designer. I don't have to see the builders of the pyramid to know that someone designed and build it. How much more complex is life than a pyramid? How much more harder and complex is it to bring the material that is needed than it is to used what is already in existence?

 

Is it logical reasoning to say that life comes from life or that intelligent design proves that there is a mind that is responsible for it?

 

And so, we are basically saying the same thing about infinity & eternity?!

However, if infinity were a circle as I suggested as an analogy, it would repeat itself over & over again.

Some have theorized that the Big Bang is merely another 'start,' where the expanding universe will eventually reached a point where it will start collapsing, and then repeat the cycle...as a God who had no beginning nor ending lives in such a realm.

This 'cycling universe' would be similar to a cosmic 'heart beat' (the heart beat of the Creator?) and explains no real 'start' to all things, we are merely observing a portion of that cycling as we live today.

 

Yes, I see Lucifer as part of His initial creations, and a kingdom in 'heaven' B4 the creation of the earth, and Lucifer eventually being cast down to that earth. As some have said there are several levels of 'the heavens,' as Lucifer, now called Satan after his fall, has some access to God as he did in Job. In a spiritual realm of one of the levels of heaven.

And so the 'mighty men of old' in Genesis who inter-married with the daughters of the sons of men, some believe were from the previous fallen creation, or some say 'the fallen angels or sons of God.'

 

For the 'science only' crew: What would initiate a singlular Big Bang if not just part of an infinite cycle..the question would be "Why?" to those of that ilk..

 

And as our observable universe is made up of solar systems (like mega-atoms), and spiraling galaxies (like mega-mega-atoms), etc. and we as humans are made up of atoms only, but the consistency of design is apparent, how do we know that the universe that we can only observe a portion of isnt just a 'cell' in a cosmic body of infinite size, ergo just one of many universes or 'cells' in the 'body of God?' Or for the science only crowd, the cosmic total entity?

For just as we are life in a single solar system, how do we know that there is not 'life' on our atoms that makes us up (altho a micro-micro-form of life). And, that life 'sees' and knows about the other atoms next to it, but it does not know the big picture of that it is just a small part of a larger entity called our body. And that, that body has an intelligence via the mind/brain, and thus controls, directly or indirectly, the life of those atoms by various means. Thus we are part of a larger creation which is the body, and there is an intelligence that affects our existence..directly (thru intervention) or indirectly (by physical design of the all)! And that intelligence we may call God...

 

Natural science is not able to give any answer to the question "why", natural science is only able to say "how" something happens. In case time was born in the big bang we could perhaps say the universe is without cause (without reason). And if something is without cause (without reason, without mathematics, without understandable logic, ... ) we are not able to say anything about "how" this birth had happened. We would need a metaposition "outside" of time and space - but an "outside" of time and space is not physically existing as far as I heard. But if this world here would be indeed without any reason - and it often looks like if I discuss with antichtristians - how came reason into this world? And still there's also the mystic of the existance of chaos and cosmos - altough we can see today that sometimes chaos has a lot to do with life and sometimes the cosmos may be even deadly.

http://youtu.be/jFCY6PVblb4

 

Well, we observe life coming from life all the time, so it's logical to say that. However, it would not be terribly logical to extend that to say that ALL life comes from other life. Unless you believe in an infinite regression then there has to be some living thing that did not come from another living thing.

 

Except for we have evidence that life can form from nonlife:

Building block of life found on comet

Found: A Batch of DNA Molecules That Seem To Have Originated in Space

Life’s First Spark Re-Created in the Laboratory

American scientist who created artificial life denies 'playing God'

Miller–Urey experiment

Specifically from the Miller–Urey:

Proteins forming over time.

Going from inert matter to life isn’t instantaneous. It is a process.

 

Neither can you say that you are right.

You really think that?

Yeah, well, over on a forum called CARM, one of the members, a physicist who's username is HRG, once told us that his cat created everything last Thursday.

Why should I believe the Bible's many authors over him? They have the same amount of evidence for their claims...

I would love to see some evidence for that assertion. Please link to some posts.

I'm telling you, as an agnostic atheist, that while I don't believe in a higher power (atheist), I'm not prepared to make a knowledge claim as far as his/her/its/their existence (agnostic).

But your reasoning is flawed. That's the point. God of the gaps, which is exactly what your arguing for, here, is a logical fallacy.

Correct.

Huh? Why couldn't this being have just "lit the fuse on the Big Bang", as it were, then let nature take its course?

And yet you can't say that you are correct.

How? Are you a physicist?

It is a contradiction because you are basing it off a premise - matter cannot "create itself" - that has not been proven.

And it is a very poor argument against the existence of God. Those particular atheists would do well to drop it.

And like I said before, you can't say that you are correct.

What design?

Um... okay...

Enough so that life is full of mistakes... like the recurrent laryngeal nerve, for example.

Sorry. Yeah. I was agreeing with you.

Except that the universe is being torn apart, so...

 

So, you believe in and 'end' to it? Had a singular start and will just end up fading away...

 

That seems to be the most likely course for it, yes. Chances are, astronomers 1,000,000 years from will look at an almost blank night sky, seeing only the moon (if that's even still there... some evidence suggests that it might be very slowly flying away from us), the sun, the Milky Way, and the Andromeda galaxy, which is slowly getting closer because the Milky Way and Andromeda are on a collision course...

Of course, future observations could prove that wrong, in which case I would apologize and admit my error.

As of now, though, it seems likely that the universe will just fade out to nothingness as, eventually, even atoms themselves will get ripped apart.

 

Your general commentary seems to be accepted by many.

What will rip the atoms apart?

I look at atoms (and sub-atomic particles) as being an equivalent to our solar system, and also galaxies. Atoms are like 99.999% free space (as is our solar system and galaxies, altho at a distance they look 'crowded), and the electrons are such as our planets, altho we treat all electrons as the same, but they many differ as our planets do from one another, and their differences are indiscernible to us with our limitations of observation. If the universe can be infinite in it's size and extent; I also believe that it can be infinitely small, w/o end. But if it is finite in largeness, then most likely, it is finite in smallness too.

All that 'Pharting-Around Philosophy" to ask the question: with the moon slowly leaving us, will we and the other planets also leave the sun, esp if it doesnt nova (super-nova?) 1st? Is the model for atoms ripping apart similar to our extended and ultimate future as part of the solar system?