Does anyone have any ideas on where this Universe came from?

You missed it. The issue at hand is not intelligence. The issue at hand is the state of being, as in whether God has form. She does not.

 

No.

The Laws of Nature are the very spirit of God, so to try to argue that God is outside of the Creation is very true.


Gen. 1:2 And the earth was without form, (a spinning cloud of molten matter and gases), and void: (not valid as a sphere yet- an accretion disk), and darkness: [choshek: obscurity] was upon the face of the deep: [tehowm: the deep primeval abyss].
And (the great Shechinah), the spirit, (the pan-en-theistic Natural Laws) of God moved upon the face: [paniym: presence] of the "waters" (i.e.; of these transitory things: [mayim: Hebrew])

 

You disagree and agree at the same time? Very masterful!

What?

 

Dimensional rift. A cataclism piercing dimensions. Maybe some idiotic beings like us, playing with things we shouldn't, creating an event horizon.


Seems more plausible than... other theories. Maybe that is what gravity is leaking through... giving rise to the universe as we know it.

I have no evidence. Was just an idea... we would have to know a whole lot more about... things... to even come close to testing the theory.

 

How can you imagine nothing? That would be something without any atoms or subatomic particles at all. So how could you possibly experience such a thing? Since everything in the universe exists it's impossible for such a thing as nothing to exist. There simply isn't any room for nothing to exist.

 

[video=youtube;SwmbnVRRS8k]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SwmbnVRRS8k&feature=player_detailpage#t=12 8s[/video]

 

The universe was created when the great "Space Gerbil" had to take a (*)(*)(*)(*). We are all riding on a giant gerbil turd.

 

That's silly because if such a thing as a singularity exists then it couldn't be composed of matter. As long as an electron moves it creates time. So what could your singularity possible be made of? Remember, it's generally accpeted as true that two things can't occupy the same space at the same time.

 

And you know that because....?

According to your logic if you were in the vicinity of VY Canis Majoris you could live forever.

 

Right, the thought is not what we see in MRI pictures.
Those only show us what parts of the brain are active when the thoughs are being generated.

The thoughts themselves are as intnagible as dreams.
They are like angels which deliver messages to us.
They are actually electromagnetic impulses that leave our skull.

 

I was responding to the statement that: "God is an intelligent being?"

Originally Posted by loving grace


We are intelligent, and have no reason to assume anything about a god or whether "he' could fair well in regard totaling Intelligence Tests.

What we can says is that because we are intelligent, it seems some very orderly set of rules are at work which we can understand and define mathematically such as to anticipath the future that unfolds moment by moment.
We can go one step further and even say that this unfolding is like an god who holds life and death in the balance for us.

 

Isn't it funny that the brain causes all of our troubles?

 

That pic is made from an illustartor at Time magazine.

There aint 7 stages. There are at least 20.

And aint none of that found in the bible.

 

Short information: The word "Word" means logos (=~>"intelligence")

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. In him was life, and that life was the light of all people. The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it. http://youtu.be/2k5_MAJgUaE

 

Yes, I agree. But as I tried to elucidate earlier, the issue I have is not whether God is intelligent, but whether God has being.

Did you know that the Qur'an refers to Allah in both the singular (I, You and He) as well as plural (We and Us). Quite frankly, Islamic scholars don't really know what to make of that, although they have decided that it is inclusive and not literal. In other words, it is the royal "We".

Allah (Islam) is without form and is infinite, and is nothing like what we observe in the world. Brahman (Vedanta Hinduism) is also without form and is infinite.

What if it really means that God is One AND God is the Many, at the same time? So if God is both singular AND plural, what is her being?

 

A singularity is a big word for any point on an imaginary Cartesan Graph that we mentally superimpose over Space.

On the space of a common street map, for instance, the coordinate system is the imaginary horizontal and vertical lines we use to locate a place on the Map.
We use the coordinates across the top and down the side of the map so we can refer to variious locations.
Each location is a singularity or location on our map.

When we imagine this coordinate system superimposed upon the whole universe, we can locate stars and galaxies in relation to their proximity to one another, and we can locate various points or singualities we wish to discuss.

One important singularity is that point from which all matter in space appears to be fleeing from, or what we might call the Center of the Universe.
It would be comparable to the point (0,0,0) on grphs we use in mathematics.

So the Singularity is NOT matter, not energy, but merely the location of that placewhere the Big Bang suddenly appeared.

 

Oh,..
sorry that I missed "it."
I thought that you had said, "God is an intelligent being."

 

Not exactly.

What Christ said was that Truth when it is imaged by our brain actually saves us from opposing the Reality that encounters us at every turn.

When men use theoir brain to create fantasies about the world which are built on lies, then, yes, our brain does get us into trouble.

To live in a Fantasy World is insane.

But what Jesus was saying was that, this is exactly what we do when we misinterpret scripture.
We set up Laws we think the Bible is suggesting.
As a theocracy we require others to abide these rukes.
We make everyone acknowledge and conform as the muslims are doing with their Sharia Law.

Bu the truth is that America separated the religious rules self imposed upon memebrs who want to acknowledge trhem from us, the people who want as few laws as possible imposed by any government, political or theocratic.

 

True.

The Bible doesn't get so detailed, and the number of events one might want to subdivide the event into could be argued.

But since the whole of Genesis continues to list events which use the numbers sevn, thre, twelve, etc, it is usefulto choose to go with those scientist who explain the over all event as seven in number.

That is to say, whereas it may depend on who you ask in this case, I choose to ask those scientists who have chosen to enumeratre seven divisions in the formation of the Universe.

In fact, the whole Genesis story is parallel to a larger picture of seven kinds of Evolution experience by the unfolding Reality up until this moment in time:




Why tgis is important is that it is the basis of a Kabbalah which the Jews acknowledg as part of their Judaism so I am constantly showing how that "wisdom" is used.
The idea is that Judaism is saying that we ought organize our thinking in accord with a certain Pattern if we all want to be on the same "page" mentally.

 

Yes, logos can mean intelliegence.
But that misses the point.

Intelligence is Truth.

To say that accepting lies is stupid would be a little strong, but it would make my point.
Jesus said, "I am the Truth."
And as the Reality unfolded in the beginning, as the Big Bang expanded the Cosmic experience we now look back upon, Truth was sired as the record of what had actually taken place.

We are intelligent because we can accept the Truth of the events.

For us, Truth is the Reality it images, because we are not able to directly experience Reality but must use our seven senses to figure it out.



John1:1
In the beginning was the Word, (i.e.; Truth: [John 14:6]), and the Word, (Truth, itself), was (synonymous) with God, (i.e.; Reality), and the Word, (Truth: [John 14:6]), was (indistinguishable from Reality), God (almigty for all men).

2 "He," (Truth, the symbolic Word to come: [Jud 1:3]) was with God, (i.e., the ever unfolding Reality, itself), in the beginning, (that is, the Big Bang initial unfolding of Reality into what actually was the Creation).

Jn 1:3 ALL (real) THINGS, (phenomenally, i.e.; mentally), came into existence through him, (this concept of Truth), and apart from him, (this ideal of Truth), not even ONE (real) thing came into (actual) existence.

 

In answer to the OP.

I have absolutely no idea. That is why I am an agnostic and not an atheist.
Whether the original cause is anthropomorphic (I doubt this strongly) or a causation we can not fathom, I have no idea.
I am, however, fairly confident that the bible is a very poor source for discovering the truth of this issue.

 

Very good. This is the correct starting point, as there is no evidence against the existence of God.

Why do you doubt this? Based on what? Intuition is a valid response here. You could definitely say "it just doesn't feel right".

Very good.

You are fairly confident, based on what? In this case, intuition is still a valid answer, except that intuition against the Bible strongly implies disbelief, not agnosticism.

 

The word that is translated Word does not mean truth. It was translated from the Greek word Logos and it means something said (including the thought) . Jesus is the mind and utterance of God. Of course Jesus is the truth and the life but we should not put a different meaning on a word that the word does not mean. The word truth in John 14:6 is translated from the Greek word alētheia and means truth: - true, × truly, truth, verity. As anyone can see two different words with two different meanings.

When we let the Bible speaks for itself and not make up our own meaning to words we cannot never go wrong. This advice also goes for the rest of your personal interpretions in John 1.

 

That energy exists now .. something can not come out of nothing.

 

Very poor conclusion. It does nothing of the kind. It shows a careful reading of scripture and the many problems that it has internally. It show a serious doubt in the bible, but shows nothing about a conclusion about God. It shows doubt in the description of God as represented in the bible. Big difference. Horrible logic on your part.
Did you know you can be an agnostic atheist? Or an agnostic theist? Do you know what the word means?