Soldier 50 dies of heart attack. Thank God it wasn't a woman

The ban on women serving in combat arms units is already being ignored. Women go along with patrols, because in Islamic culture, men aren't supposed to interact with females.

Women are in helicopter gunships, fighter planes, attack planes...they are part of security teams. They deploy to forward operating bases with no delineation of a "front line." Lifting the ban will legitimize what they are already doing, and acknowledge that women in combat is a reality. 144 women have been killed in action.

The combat arms:

Infantry
Armoured
Artillery
Combat Engineers

You can't tell me, that women are in incapable from all the military occupation specialites in the combat arms.

It's not just ground pounders that comprise the combat arms.

Many of the MOS descriptors do involve heavy lifting, and if a woman can't do that, she doesn't belong...however an across the board ban without giving them the oppportunity...is wrong.

We need soldiers with good order and discipline...not just "muscles" and brute strength.

If they can't change a tank tread, fine wash them out of tanker school...but give them a chance.

During the past decade the military already provided lots of moral waivers and education waivers...they've already lowered standards.
Right now, with a shrinking military, it's very possible that we already have enough qualified men to serve in the combat arms...that's now.
In the future, if another large scale military operation is required and the military remains all-volunteer, opening up the combat arms to female recruits to
APPLY for a combat MOS, makes sense. The pool of eligible males who volunteer isn't that large. It's a numbers game really.

 

We agree. No special treatment. If they can't lift 70 lbs. as part of an artillery team...wash them out.
Same as a man, you can't cut it...you wash out and take a job you can do.

That's really all I'd like to see...open up some of the combat MOS to female recruits. Treat them like any other candidate...if they don't pass muster...
Adios.

It's possible not a single female who applies, may pass the training...hey at least the argument is proved valid. Women have no place in the ground combat arms.

I couldn't argue otherwise.

 

Women will make fine combat soldiers after the military lowers the standards for what a combat soldier is expected to do.

 

Shouldn't that be true in all of the military?

 

Infantry men on the front lines who see combat have the hardest lives, they chew tobacco and engage in high risk lifestyles under the stress of war.

Of course they would be more predisposed to cardiac conditions, especially now when they will have to carry the heavy guns for new women recruits.

There will have to be special provisions for infantry women, because they are not physically capable of carrying as much as men so that will increase their burden.

 

Can't keep the physical standards the same, unless women are allowed to take testosterone injections like the female body builders

But that would be cruel punishment for the women who don't want it.

 

With all due respect you keep repeating this little spiel but other than your own personal feelings and cherrypicked examples no one has produced definitive evidence that we are all of a sudden going to start losing wars because we recruit healthy 20 year old females versus using 50 year old dead guys.

 

They've already lowered standards for males...
I don't hear much talk about that.

Moral waivers, age waivers, education waivers...vision waivers...health waivers...and yes, for jobs in the combat arms.

Where's the complaint on that?

When the services need warm bodies, standards are dropped.

In a bad economy and troop draw downs, the miltary could affod to be picky.

We've seen guardsman and reservists with extended deployments, sometimes multiple deployments.

Why?

Because the all-volunteer system was not meeting quotas and the burden was placed on the reserve components.

Suicides, strained relationships...is the result...

No one said a word.
Not one word.

Bring up women in combat...and all heck breaks loose.

No way! it will kill people...ignoring the fact that people have already been killed because of reduced standards and an increase in the burden on those
who have volunteered.

Opening up the pool for females to apply....give them no special treatment.

can't hurt...because believe me, when the (*)(*)(*)(*) hit the fan Post-9/11 less than 1% of the popluation actually did something about it and served their country.

It's very easy to sit in the bleachers and (*)(*)(*)(*)(*) about "women in combat will kill people" and never stepping up yourself.
For EVERY person who serves, who places themselves in harm's way, who answers the call to duty...not the video game...the reality of serving in a theater of war...
means someone else who doesn't want to...doesn't have to.

We rely on an all-volunteer military for a reason....and opening up jobs to females in the combat arms, who qualify...
can't hurt.

*end of rant*

 

As long as they get a fair shot at it.

 

80 isn't the male standard. Besides, as Herc said, supply clerks are in COMBAT!!!

They need to be ready to roll in the dirt with Islamists and stick their COMBAT! knife into their vitals.

 

You are exactly right. People consider being a foot soldier to be a low tech job, so they are all experts.

 

I am sure they will lower the standards just to be politically correct but if some woman wants to go fight I say let her.

 

As has already been stated numerous times there are tasks that male combat troops cannot perform as well as female combat troops. That doesn't mean we should purge the ranks of men.

Why don't you just let it play out and see what happens. If there are major problems they will come to light and the military will make adjustments. I don't see what you are so afraid of.

 

We're forgetting another reality...
combat veterans have unusually high rates of unemployment

There is not much call in the civilian world for land navigation skills, or disassembly and re-assembly of an M249 SAW.

You learn skills that are vital to keep you alive in time of war, that are useless in time of peace.
There's law enforcement or moving furniture.

All war's eventually end.
In the up or out doctrine, it's increasingly difficult to make the profession of arms, a career. At some point, everyone in uniform is civilianized.

Honestly, if I had a daughter, niece or younger sister interested in the combat arms, I would steer her away from that.

There's not much future in it, away from it.

So jingoism and propaganda is intesified to attract the 11 Bravos..you ain't (*)(*)(*)(*) if you ain't infantry.
The last bastion of military culture that has not integrated females into the fold...the ground combat arms. So it's a stubborn sub-culture of the military culture. I saw the same thing in combat aviation. Hold-outs who saw an influx of females as a challenge to their masculinity...a profession suited for men and only men.

There are legitimate reasons, valid reasons, females are ill suited for serving in direct ground combat units. Physiology, etc.

There's also a certain mindset that is reluctant to see it "feminized"...as having it "feminized" would therefore reduce it's readiness and effectiveness.

You have to cut throught the chaff to see the legitimacy of keeping women out of certain combat jobs, and some jobs, they simply may not be able to do....
but the military culture as a whole...is very anti-female...it's indoctrinated into male military recruits from the get go...
females are not to be trusted...only the man on your riight and on your left can be trusted...Jodie calls..keeping in time with marching drills...often talk of girl friends cheating on you while you're away...
Female troops are two types: You're either a whore or a butch dyke...

It's machismo...on steroids.

The simple reality is...that the more embedded you are in warfighting, the more difficult it is to re-adjust to non-warfighting...
and all wars end. All solders grow old and are replaced by younger soldiers...

I wouldn't advise women to go into the combat arms, even if they could.

 

Actually with my example it is the man who would have to perform to the woman's standards. And would fail.

One of my best friends was in artillery. He is now getting ready to go to law school. It's what you make of it.

 

Women in combat?? Great idea. Especially in the Middle East where the young guys have no contact with women. How would you like to be in a fire fight with a hot chick and five horn dogs risking their lives to protect her sweet ass wile your ass is hanging over the edge of hell?? The guys will not see the women as brothers or sisters and the women and the men will be in greater danger.

Let the women that qualify for combat fight as all women teams??

 

Women have performed as infantry, with some degree of success, even against technologicly superior forces.

The Mino of Dahomey kicked some serious French ass.