Is the United States a violent nation? Perhaps not.

Discussion in 'Gun Control' started by eeeseee, May 21, 2014.

  1. eeeseee

    eeeseee New Member

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    The violent crime rate of the United States (386.9 per 100,000 persons) and the murder rate (4.7 per 100,000 persons). People claim the United States has a violence problem, although the data claims the opposite. (Data presented as of 2012, the most recent accumulative rate) Lets put the rates into a percentage perspective. That would be 0.003869 or 0.3869% for violent crime rate and 0.000047 or 0.0047% for murder rate.
    http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/uc..._per_100000_inhabitants_1993-2012.xls



    Which is significantly lower than the data presented from the home office (The UK crime data. I understand we shouldn't compare countries, but most people do it anyway. So i'll just appeal to common belief here. :S)

    Data wise, the UK has a violent crime rate 3x that of the US, and the US murder rate is only ~4% higher than the UK.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/116435/hosb0812.pdf





    Just the Aussie violent crime rate and Murder rate as of 2006/2007. Hope you're keeping up. (Which 2006 is the most recent of all accumulative data, some data is missing for 2007+ unfortunately)

    http://www.aic.gov.au/statistics/violent crime.html

    Australia Violent Crime:
    840 per 100,000 persons for assault/2007
    Different Year. Didn't add---->623 per 100,000 persons for assault/1996
    (Note the time when they enacted their new laws)

    94 per 100,000 Persons for sexual Assault

    4 per 100,000 persons for kidnapping

    86 per 100,000 for armed robbery

    A whooping 1024 per 100,000 persons for violent crime rate. YEESH that is VERY bad for a nation of 22,000,000 people....

    Murder rate: 1.9/100,000 persons

    Our murder rate is ~3-4x higher, but their violent crime rate is also ~2x higher. So your fear of being shot in the U.S. is driven by ignorance and media.
     
  2. Regular Joe

    Regular Joe Well-Known Member

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    An interesting aspect of the much higher gun ownership and concealed carry in the US is that for those who are paying attention, the whole mindset of conflict avoidance is stressed.
    I was talking to a fine young fellow last week who teaches an extremely aggressive method of self defense. He was keen to point out that conflict avoidance is a larger part of the course than actual fighting, but when it comes down to conflict resolution, a severely mutilated opponent is easiest to deal with.
    I think that the more widespread availability of training in America deserves some credit for keeping the number of actual conflicts at a minimum. If a person is confident that they are in control of a situation at every point, they are less likely to resort to premature panic. You can't develop a mature attitude about the use of deadly force unless you have the means of carrying it out. How would a person in a disarmed society learn that?
     
  3. onalandline

    onalandline Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  4. Steady Pie

    Steady Pie Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Unfortunately this issue is already decided. We've got maybe a few generations before guns are made illegal entirely, and there's absolutely nothing we can do about it.
     
  5. AlpinLuke

    AlpinLuke Well-Known Member

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    So that only criminals will be able to get guns [through their usual illegal methods ...].
     
  6. perdidochas

    perdidochas Well-Known Member

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    Really? Guns are less restricted than they were 11 yrs ago.
     
  7. OrlandoChuck

    OrlandoChuck Well-Known Member

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    Unfortunately, in the years to come, the political makeup of the supreme court is going to change. I believe if we keep electing liberal presidents, they will appoint liberal justices. It's probably just a matter of time before they amend the 2A.
     
  8. Wolverine

    Wolverine New Member Past Donor

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    If the gun control activists want to delude themselves in believing the US is so terribly violent, there are plenty of countries in the world that would be more to their liking.

    I imagine the paths to citizenship are readily found online.
     
  9. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    This page does not exist - not surprising since those figures would represent a halving of the homicide rate for America

    I DID however find this
    http://www.fbi.gov/news/pressrel/press-releases/fbi-releases-2012-crime-statistics.

    Which talks of a murder arrest rate close to your figures but remembering that the arrest rate is not equal to the homicide rate

    However on that page there is also this

    Caution Against Ranking:

    Each year when Crime in the United States is published, some entities use the figures to compile rankings of cities and counties. These rough rankings provide no insight into the numerous variables that mold crime in a particular town, city, county, state, tribal area, or region. Consequently, they lead to simplistic and/or incomplete analyses that often create misleading perceptions adversely affecting communities and their residents. Valid assessments are possible only with careful study and analysis of the range of unique conditions affecting each local law enforcement jurisdiction.

    Which has different laws, policing methods and methods for collecting statistics
    Are you aware that in Australia you will be charged with serious assault if you spit on or near a cop? Are you aware there is a vast difference between "sexual assault" and "rape"?

    We include pub brawls in our violent crime statistics - you apparently do not

    And which would you rather punched in the face or shot in the head?
     
  10. stjames1_53

    stjames1_53 Banned

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    you keep bleating about shot in the face or shot in the head........ what's the statistics on that?
    Rather I shot the perp before he shot me
     
  11. Colonel K

    Colonel K Well-Known Member

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    Some people are like computers, the information needs to be punched in. There are more than a few here who gaily compare unlike statistics, despite the included warnings, yet wonder why everyone excepting the like-minded regard their steaming contribution with the contempt it deserves.

    The numbers are generated differently, from different criteria, including/discounting different crimes, by different countries. As has been said, the UK annual gun death number is barley half the American DAILY figure it's an order of magnitude smaller, yet the UK numbers recording drunken yobs punching each others' lights out on a Saturday night, are held up to falsely show that Britan is more violent.
    That's where the Punch in the head vs Shot in the head choice comes in. Which would you prefer?
     
  12. stjames1_53

    stjames1_53 Banned

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    well, since I have the Right to self-defense, I guess it's up to the other guy to chose NOT to assault me.
    Simple enough. I chose not to live in fear and terror while cringing and begging for my life. Some would take the cowardly way out and beg. Like that would give them a chance.
    Where are the statistics for being shot in the face, btw?
     
  13. eeeseee

    eeeseee New Member

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    New link:

    http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/uc...and_rate_per_100000_inhabitants_1993-2012.xls


    They unfortunately use a python server side script. So the links don't last more than a week. If it happens again, just ask me for a new link.
     
  14. onalandline

    onalandline Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I am afraid you are correct, unless we can get liberals out of Washington and court rooms. I see a revolution before it's over.

    - - - Updated - - -

    This is what I am afraid of. The worst thing Obama is doing, is appointing liberal judges.
     
  15. onalandline

    onalandline Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  16. DentalFloss

    DentalFloss Well-Known Member

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    I think a lot of people honestly, but mistakenly, believe that crime and violence is getting worse. Anyone who has actually studied the stats knows better, but technology has changed so much that we receive much more information much quicker than we did in the past. Therefore, we hear about things (for example, the ex-cop in Florida who shot a guy in the movie theater) that in days gone by would have only been local news, but we hear about them within minutes of them having occurred.

    Ergo, people are being made aware of in a more timely basis more incidents, which gives the false impression that things are getting worse when the reality is that it's just information overload.
     

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