Are you pro-war, anti-war, or somewhere in between?

Discussion in 'Warfare / Military' started by Anglicus, Nov 11, 2015.

  1. lsz91

    lsz91 New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2015
    Messages:
    30
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    War is business people, essentially war is business, and there is nothing you can do about it.

    Even if their is justice in whatever is being done, it is business and that is the main motivating factors, which allow unilateral militaristic action that leads us to ISIS. Watch this video, a suggested way of building transparent world politics https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BxVEfBFgTtM
     
  2. Mushroom

    Mushroom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2009
    Messages:
    12,614
    Likes Received:
    2,492
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Actually, I simply buy into reality and not propaganda.

    But please, give us some kind of verifyable reference to prove what you are claiming. Because in all of my years of service, i have seen no such thing.
     
  3. Nightmare515

    Nightmare515 Ragin' Cajun Staff Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2011
    Messages:
    11,139
    Likes Received:
    4,912
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I guess I could be considered in the middle. I'm not pro war in a sense that I think we should run around attacking anybody to disrespects us on TV, but I am a rational person who understands that war is an absolute necessity. Saying that war is never the answer and being super passive sounds cute on paper but the real world doesn't work that way.

    I believe in preemptive strikes as well. I do not hold on to the belief that war should only be waged in direct self defense situations such as waiting for somebody to show up at our doorstep before we do anything about them. Defense isn't simply fighting back once somebody punches you in the mouth, defense is doing everything you can to make sure somebody can't get strong enough or close enough to punch you in the mouth. If that means going to their house and punching them out first because you know they don't like you and are working out in their basement gearing up for a fight then so be it.

    People love to fantasize about a utopia where we all live happily ever after together and all of that. Saying things like if we just all laid down our guns then it would all be ok. Sure, but I will ALWAYS hold on to the notion of "You first". No taking the initiative or setting the example or any of that. Only a fool would follow such a protocol.

    Now this isn't to paint a picture that I love war, quite the opposite. As somebody who has fought in plenty of them I absolutely hate them, as does anybody else who has actually been in one and isn't medically psychotic. Those who think war is cool are usually children who grew up playing video games or those arm chair generals who watch tv and read books and think about how awesome a real life Tom Clancy novel would be. But no, war is not fun, at all, none of it is even remotely fun. Like the old saying goes, war is 90% boredom and 10% sheer terror. Neither of those two things qualify as "fun".

    But it is necessary, diplomacy doesn't always work. It sounds cute to say things like "war is never the answer or if diplomacy fails then you have failed". No, this is real life. Sometimes you can't solve issues via diplomacy and appeasement is NEVER the right answer. Sometimes war is the only answer.

    I would absolutely LOVE a world that lived in peace. I am a huge space guy, I always imagine what advances we could make in space exploration if all nations could dump their defense budgets in their science and especially space organizations. What would NASA and the ESA be like if we dumped 800 billion dollars into them per year instead of bombs and bullets? Would we already have humans on Mars? Would our James Webb telescope already be out there snapping pictures of exoplanets? Would we already have drilled through Europa's ice sheet and dropped a probe in the ocean below?

    We'll never know because we can't afford it right now, we can't afford it because we have to spend so much money on bombs and bullets and ensure that we remain alone atop the mountain when it comes to warfare. Now as much as I LOVE space I would NEVER advocate we cut the massive defense budget to give NASA a pay raise. Not until the world learns how to act right. Being as powerful as America is happens to be a weapon within itself. The majority of our foreign problems can be solved via diplomacy simply because we usually have the cards stacked in our favor due to the massive military and economic machine at our disposal. Intimidation plays a huge role in world politics and I have no issue with us being the ones doing the intimidating. As it stands now a conventional war with the US is simply not fair because our military is so much more powerful than everyone elses. And I personally have no issue with widening the gap even further and keeping it that way.

    Maybe one day our future generations will see a world without war. I highly doubt it, but maybe, hopefully. But right now, war is a reality and a part of life. Don't praise it, don't enjoy it, and don't advocate it, but when the time comes, don't run.
     
  4. Mr_Truth

    Mr_Truth Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2012
    Messages:
    33,372
    Likes Received:
    36,882
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male





    I join with these conservatives who are patriotic and oppose war:


    www.antiwar.com
     
  5. Amadeus

    Amadeus New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2013
    Messages:
    462
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    0
    The Iraq Invasion produced up to a million civilian deaths, thousands of American deaths, created over half a million orphans, exponentially benefited terrorism, and sundered the Middle East. The refugee crisis can be directly linked to the 2003 decision to invade Iraq.

    There's your pro-war results.
     
  6. Rollo1066

    Rollo1066 Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2011
    Messages:
    384
    Likes Received:
    14
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Generally I am anti-war but is rare cases war is justified. Lets look at my country's (USA) wars.

    1. American revolution - no. George III wasn't a bad enough ruler to justify bloodshed to get rid of him.
    I realize that without this one the USA might not exist or be a dominion like Canada. Also it might have
    led to a global British Empire but that wouldn't have been so bad.
    2. War of 1812 no.
    3. Mexican war no for USA possibly yes for Mexico.
    4. Civil war (this is the toughest one) probably yes as the South was trying to tear the country apart to preserve slavery..
    5. Spanish American War. No just because WR Hurst's newspapers said Spain had blown up the battleship
    Maine didn't make it true. No serious effort to determine what had really happened was made before declaring war.
    6. WW I ( a somewhat tough one but no). All the countries involved were bad actors.
    7. WW II. Yes we were directly attacked and the NAZI's and Japanese militarists were threat to us and the rest of the world.
    8. Korea probably yes. Neither side were saints but the North attacked the South and were the worse of the two.
    9. Vietnam war probably no. There were some similarities to the Korea war, but also differences. No participants conduct
    was good, but it would have better if we had stayed out of this civil war.
    10. Gulf war I - yes the invasion of Kuwait by Iraq could not be allowed to stand.
    11. Afgan war - yes we were attacked and they refused to stop helping Bin Laden.
    12 Gulf war II - no we weren't attacked and the harm caused by the war was too
    great.

    Many invasions of weaker nations in the Western hemisphere - no - possible exception of Grenada because after
    chaos and murder of PM the Governor General invited us.

    Many wars against native people - no.
     

Share This Page