In what way(s) are you better than Jesus (if any)?

If that's what makes you feel good.

 

So what you saying is that if my spouse cheats on me that I should do what god did (since god is all-knowing, and a great role model, right) and drown my spouse.....but Modern Secular Humanism is more moral than the Bible, so of course I won't stoop to the low moral level of the Bible/Jesus/his dad. Also, by following god's lead I'd end up in jail.

 

Unlike religious people, it 's not about "what makes me feel good", it's about what is true - and a man living inside a fish for 3 days is certainly not true so I reject the wild supernatural claims in that book (such as a magic talking dead guy who will magically let me survive my own death if I just believe in him.)
I don't believe in zombies, so I don't believe in Jesus.

"Surviving my own death to go up into a bigoted Buddhist-free, Muslim-free, Hindu-free place in the sky (heaven)" would make me feel good - well, except for the bigotry of course - but it's not true so I don't put any stock in it.

 

If your particular unique invisible friend in the sky (there are thousands and thousands who have been claimed throughout history) invented logic, then why doesn't he himself follow it?

 

Well heck, you caught me, as yes, I'm a supreme egomaniac (Trump is envious of me), as I once said "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."....yep, it's all about me, me, ME!

 

Like I said whatever makes you feel good.

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Hey, deny truth and adhere to whatever makes you feel good.

 

It is extremely annoying when Christians say that NO ONE can know the mind of God....and proceed to speak as if THEY know the mind of God with absolute authority.

 

I am not sure we can make a good case that the historical Jesus would have accepted slavery. I realize that Jesus is claimed to have said that not on element of the OT would be changed but, then we have examples of him changing OT law and basically saying "Moses got it wrong".

OK so if Moses got some things in the OT wrong, then which are reliable ?

If we go with the main message and teaching of Jesus = "The Golden Rule" = "Do unto others as you would have done to you" It is hard to see how Jesus would have accepted slavery.

Unfortunately, Christianity ignored this rule for most of it's existence and, in fact fought hard against this rule.

 

The fact that you cannot stand spending eternity in the lake of fire, results in your denial of truth. So yes, whatever makes you feel good.

 

Use your head, to know the mind of anybody is impossible. We have however been told the word of God, and the laws to obey from Him. Spin it how you want.

 

Jesus does not accept slavery whatsoever. Jesus did say if you have to be a slave, be the best slave you can.

 

Okay...you have been told through ancient literature that was created from even more ancient writing that were based on a different "God" and then revised, edited, changed and adjusted for political reasons for centuries. That is not "Spin" it is "Using my head" to review history and evaluate reality.

Try it sometime...It's pretty cool.

 

Your naked claim (a claim with out support) adds nothing to the discussion.

 

I'll write down information that's needed by either myself or others for future reference; the Rabbi Yeshua wrote nothing down.

 

Well this zombie obviously didn't follow said rule because what sane person would send others ("do unto others") to eternal torture (they deserve it, apparently) because no one would want eternal torture "done to you". He was sick. He also angrily condemned those 3 villages in the Bible to hellfire because they didn't believe that his magic was real.....obviously no one would want than done to themselves!.....he clearly was a hypocrite ("do as I say, not as I do", basically.) Terrible role model.

 

Great one!
Yes, if Jesus had half a brain he would have said: "write this down, so it's doesn't just get inaccurately handed down haphazardly by word of mouth, with much of it getting lost, added to and altered, over the next 40 - 80 years, because that would be just plain dumb for this most important message of all time!!"
But alas, Jesus wasn't too bright, obviously.
It didn't get written down for 40 - 80 years!!

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Wait, if he was a Jew then how come moral Jews don't get to "heaven" (like moral Hindus, moral Buddhists, etc.)
Sounds like our boy Jesus was a bigot....worse than even Trump.

 

Yes, claims like "I am the son of god", or "I am the final prophet of Allah", etc., which of course have no court-room level of evidence/support, don't add anything to the discussion, because they are probably just lies. They do lead to bloody Inquisitions, bloody Crusades, bloody witch burnings, bloody Jihads, etc., but nothing useful (that couldn't be arrived at in a secular manner.)

PS if you're going to claim to be a prophet of some invisible man in the sky, for goodness sake's people please provide court-room level of physical evidence!!

 

You are smarter than Jesus. And because I'm gonna bet that you'd speak out against slavery if you saw it all around you (especially if you claim to be a moral teacher, you know, by giving moral sermons on a "mount"), you're more moral than Jesus, too. So you're smarter and more moral than Jesus, I think.

I'll worship you before I'll ever worship Jesus again.

 

Stop thinking tecoyah, and just let the fear of not getting an "after-life" drive your every action, no matter how illogical or intellectually inconsistent!!!!!!! It's a whole heck of a lot easier to "let go, let god", than it is to think for yourself!!!






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Holy crud you just showed Jesus approved of slavery!

 

If you had Jesus allegedly magic super-ninja super-powers would you show me court-room level of evidence that this "lake of fire" exists, in a compassionate and gallant effort to help a fellow human being out and avoid that eternal torture? I would for you....would you do that for me (that would seem the "Christian" thing to do, if "Christian" equates to "kindness and compassion", right?
Thanks.

 

LOL ok fair enough. I do not assume that this Jesus fellow necessarily said everything attributed to him in the OT. It is pretty conclusive that at least some of the stories are interpolation/ made up after the fact.

Obviously, against the literalist your argument is 100% sound.

I tend to try and take the good from various Philosophers (Jesus included). Given that 1) The Golden Rule was not created by Jesus and espoused by a number of legal systems and great thinkers prior to Jesus, and 2) the mass number of atrocity and horror committed in the name of "Christ"

It might be best to throw the baby out with the bathwater in this case.

 

I don't want to post religion views but I will have to in this case since it hits me to the core with my own personal beliefs. I understand you are publicizing your own beliefs as well and I support that but here is my response as you are asking for some since you bring up a controversial topic into a website with multiple backgrounds and cultures/religions.

As a Christian I stand by what I believe to be true, The Bible. You could say otherwise and that is your opinion as well.

SO the Bible is easily accessible to all...it isn't a secret to anyone, you can find all of its contents on the internet as well as its Latin version I'm sure. God didn't create a Test or Exam by any means for us mere mortals to take in order to get into Heaven. The steps are easy enough...it is simply accepting a FREE gift of acknowledging a fact and accepting the Son of God into your life/heart. That easy. If a person receives the option between torture or a gift and chooses torture...whose fault is it?

 

So how is it the Religious Right/conservative Christians are able to use the Bible to "support" or "oppose" a whole host of political issues.....that didn't exist in 1st Century Judea? Like gun control or abortion pills?

 

Well, with the kind of alleged power the Rabbi Yeshua was said to have, I'd expect SOMETHING he'd written to survive the rigors of time. ANYTHING useful, like the cure for dementia or a scientific formula for cold fusion or energy storage.....but his writers saw fit to trap him in the same time period THEY were in.

 

Never mind "Son of God" how on earth do folks rationalize the "Jesus was God" given what are supposedly his last words on the Cross ( My God, My God, Why have you forsaken me)

It is interesting that this is the version in Mark - the earliest version of the story, and that later gospels change the wording but, I digress.

Assuming that Jesus is in fact "God - God of Abraham", why on earth would God figure that letting the Romans hang him on a cross and crucify him would convince anyone of anything ?

Now if God would have gotten down from the cross and hurled a few lightning bolts ... that is going to turn some heads. Seeing yet another victim of Roman Justice ? Not so much.

Then as this fellow is dying he starts calling out his God for forsaking him. Hold on here ? If this is God hang there ... what is going on there.

Are we to believe that God, in the throws of his self induced masochistic delirium, forgets who he is and starts fantasizing that some other God has done this to him ?

Are we supposed to feel sorry for this God for doing this to himself ... essentially causing himself pain ?

The story that the author of Mark tells is of a man, who was deified (or at least thinks he is) at his baptism. There is no virgin birth in the original version of the story.

This man then goes on to give what he purports to be a new message from God and attracts a following. These disciples are a rag tag bunch, many of whom are not portrayed very well in the original version of the story.

Jesus promotes a message appealing to the common folk and attracts a following. Supposedly he is able to do a few magic tricks but, apparently his closest followers (disciples) were not all that impressed as they betray and deny this Jesus fellow as soon as the going gets tough.

Then at his death, Jesus ends up rebuking this God that he was promoting since his baptism.

How is this story supposed to convince anyone of anything ? Ohh ... but wait. After Jesus gets killed the go to the cave/tomb where Jesus remains were supposedly taken and find it empty.

This is how the original version of the story ends. We are supposed to believe that because the remains of Jesus vanished, that this was God taking Jesus up to heaven.

What makes this conclusion even harder to accept is the fact that "pious fraud" was the rule rather than the exception "back in the day". Making a body "disappear" is not exactly a tough trick to accomplish.

A few decades later, promoters of this new religion recognize the deficiencies in original version of the story and make a few corrections, additions, and interpolations. The author of Matt seeks to make the story more believable by having Jesus wandering around talking to people in the flesh after death.

The author keeps almost the entire original story but, takes out a few passages that he finds derogatory to Jesus. He also increases the status of Jesus by giving him a virgin birth - borrowing from some other "man-God" stories of the day.

and so on ... The author of John, writing a few decades after the destruction of the temple when Christianity is trying to separate itself from anything Jewish, elevates Jesus further - making him pre-existing with God - calling him "the Logos". The author is wanting to increase the appeal of Christianity using terms that are familiar to the average person. "The Logos" meant an intermediary between God an man.

It still takes another 200 years after that to turn Jesus into God !