Why Do Republicans Hate Hillary?

You know, that old expression about the pot, and kettle, right?

 

By trying to make a false equivalency like this, you might make yourself feel less guilty for being part of this hate filled tribe but other than helping yourself to a healthy dose of self-delusion, there is nothing to your statement that is based upon truth. The sad truth is as old as conservatism itself. The modern GOP was born out of fear of government, fear of intellectualism, fear of others and fear of free thought. Conservatism was considered quackery in the late 60s. The growth of an entire ecosystem of conservative ideology born from the John Birch Society has produced the modern conservative propaganda machine. In order to be a conservative today, you must first declare any and all non-conservatives your enemy. Remember the little absurdity Ronnie said "I'm from the government and I am here to help." He said it mockingly to make a central point. Government is the problem and he was there to declare that he was going to destroy it bit by bit. Everything flows from this idiotic notion. When an entire party makes hate their basic trait, it is fairly predictable that the objects of their hate will finally call them on the carpet for it. A fool will call it tit for tat, a realist will call it as a normal reaction to a sick and demented ideology.

 

So do you pay more income taxes than you have to?

 

What a joke calling politicians public servants. They think we are the servants , especially Hillary thinks so.

 

I think that the right is desperate to create some moral equivalency between Clinton and Trump so they can feel better about supporting such a defective character.
Clinton is nowhere near as defective or incapable as Trump but they have to push the crooked Hillary meme to distract from Trump's miserable record as a wife beater, serial adulterer, mafia lapdog and bankruptcy addict. And that's not even getting into personal character, where Trump really reaches for the puerile gutter every time he opens his mouth while Clinton comes off as an adult.
These people have screwed themselves into the ground and the only chance for their great orange hope is to assassinate Clinton's character.
They got nothing else to offer except hate, fear and hysteria and they know it, hence the Hillary meme.

 

For what its worth, I am independent. I have voted for both Republicans and Democrats in state and federal races. I hold beliefs that Democrats are generally stronger on than Republicans and vice versa. So no, I am not predisposed - emotionally or otherwise - to believe that Clinton is the devil incarnate. I believe it, but I am not predisposed to it. Furthermore, I dislike the entrenched and disconnected Washington political establishment a lot, and I see Hillary Clinton as just another reason for that dislike. There are a great many Americans who feel the same way. They have expressed that mistrust and anger with their support of the Sanders and Trump campaigns. It is the one thing those two blocks of Americans - Sanders and Trump supporters - have in common.

I will agree with you that she is a political pro. You'll get no quarrel from me on that one. But history has well known examples of some very bad people being very good at politics.

You mentioned her years as Sec/State. I think they were a disaster. I shall not go into a long dissertation about Libya and Syria, except to say that I knew both of these wars - one a direct attack and one a proxy war - were mistakes from the beginning. And even today, after these horrific and entirely predictable failures, she is still committed to the violent overthrow of Syria's government. Whatever else I may think of her, I do think she is an intelligent woman, so this continued headlong charge baffles me.

I have often stated here on this site that Trump is a flawed candidate. I have often cringed at his statements, such as the one about McCain. I wish he was more articulate. I don't like the way he lashes out at his critics.

But I am also aware that a president has little power to really change anything. The president may propose things to the Congress, and that's about it. Obama's tenure as president is a good example of that. He really only got one thing done in eight years that represents any change, and that was Obamacare. And that, like I said, was a proposal he made to the Congress. So I think it's worthwhile to ask ourselves what proposals a Trump administration would make to the Congress vs a Clinton administration.

I think Trump would want laws that addressed our trade imbalance ($500 billion this year) and that made it easier for manufacturers to operate in the U.S. I don't believe Clinton would do that.
I think Trump would want the border secured and I think he would press for a solution to our immigration concerns. I don't believe Clinton is interested in securing the border. Cynically, I think immigration is one of those hot button issues that keep the nation polarized, and I think there are many in Washington - both R's and D's - who want it that way, and who really don't want a rational solution. I think Clinton falls into that camp.

On other issues ...

I don't believe Trump is a racist in his heart. I think it is a demonstrable fact that open borders let in criminals and drive down wages, and I think the U.S. has an obligation to its people to be careful about the immigration of Muslims into the country. The 9/11 attacks should have taught us that, as well as the recent attacks in Paris and elsewhere in Europe. Honestly, I actually do see racism by politicians, but where I see it is in the Democratic Party establishment as much as anywhere. And it is found in the subtle, yet toxic, "plantation owner" mentality of the Democrats. I see it in their silence. I see it in their lack of any groundbreaking initiatives. And I see it in what I consider to be verbal pandering, while doing nothing. I see it in open border and free trade policies as I ask myself, "Who does that hurt the most?"

I have a son who was severely wounded in Iraq and almost died that day. Since then, he has deployed to Afghanistan twice. As "war parents", my wife and I have taken the full ride. So has my son. I cannot adequately express what this means without writing a small book. But I will say this ...

I know that ISIS and AQ are our enemies, and I know they must be defeated in Iraq and Syria. I know these two organizations pose an existential threat to our country and those of our friends and that no president is going to just end this threat overnight. I expect that civilized nations of the world are going to be in conflict with these organizations for many years to come. Furthermore, I am satisfied with one aspect of the conduct of our war in Iraq and Syria as it pertains to ISIS, and that one aspect is that we are sustaining very few casualties. It is slow, but we are grinding them down slowly at very little human cost to us.

But I have not forgotten that the U.S. (on the Obama/Clinton watch) fanned the flames of war and chaos in Syria by publicly siding with the rebels, and by then arming them and training them. This is the aspect of the war in Syria I don't like, and this is the sort of action I want the U.S. to stop doing in the future. And so this is a very important reason why I don't want Hillary Clinton to be our president, and I am inclined to vote for someone who states his view that the U.S. should not act like the policeman of the world all the time. I want us to knock out ISIS in Iraq and Syria, and then I was us to LEAVE THESE COUNTRIES ALONE. For this reason alone, Hillary Clinton is not and cannot be the person I would vote for.

I also think she is a liar and habitually deceptive.

Quite frankly, Trump is unpolished and undisciplined with his words, and, quite frankly, yes, he is imperfect in many ways. But also, quite frankly, my concerns about war and peace outweigh my concerns about impoliteness and lack of political polish. No one dies.

I'd probably vote for Jim Webb if the Democrats had nominated him. Shame they didn't ...

My two cents ...

 

Lol, the lengths you shills go to convince yourselves that you better than the other partisan zealots from the right, is hilarious.

I don't have to hate Hillary, all I have to do is use facts.
She has a track record of lying. That's a fact. I'm sorry the the truth doesn't jive with what you got going on.

 

We have a political pro in office now that dwarfs her. He is a great campaigner but a horrible president. We dont need Obama in pant suits.

 

There you have it.

 

What about the Bush administration doing the same thing?

Hasn't trump though? Im not convinced he's even a republican. I think they all have to adapt and evolve to current climate.

Neither was Obama. Gay marriage is an issue that has taken a lot of people time to change their minds. We've asked politicians to change their minds for decades, I don't think we should punish them when they finally do.

I think you also have to look at minimum wage. Does trump say anything about that? Or do you think that isn't part of the issue?

He also says that the world doesn't fear or respect us anymore and that we need to be "stronger" which I take to mean bombing the living day lights out of people. What does he mean if it's not an aggressive military presence?

Chump change compared to Trump. People like Trump are the ones who "own" Clinton.

Trump doesn't include any detail though. Nothing new or old.

Trump claims Mexico will build a wall. What would he actually do to secure the border? A wall is no good if it's not monitored.

That's what worries me. I can see him Tweet something that ruins international relationships or puts our military overseas at risk. The president should have a filter.

They didn't get what was promised them. He preyed on vulnerable desperate people who he knew would never get anything out of those seminars. It's like a slimy used car salesman. Is it illegal? In some cases. Is it slimy and unethical? Definitely.

This the problem. Why should the banks for his bill? Bankruptcy is there for poor people who have no options. Not for billionaires who are taking advantage of legal loopholes.

Then why can't Hilary take or give support for her own business reasons?

Haha sorry! Good chat though



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It appears Seth has his eyes open further than you and is quite articulate about it.

 

Ahahahaha! Now you're going to do it to me again. I will try to be brief, but I have a pattern of being long and windy. Oh brother ...

I confess to not being an expert on the Bush administration doing the same thing. I have only merely scanned a few things on the subject. From that, my impression was that there was some "bleed over" of some work-related material onto some administration members' private email. It seems to me this was the case with Colin Powell. But I do not recall learning that any administration members used a private email exclusively for their work. I also don't recall any administration members setting up a private email server in their house for this purpose over which they had complete control.

I think that is a reasonable take on it. What bothers me is that I think she floats around on the political winds and goes wherever they take her. As I might have said earlier, I sincerely believe her make-up is such that if the country was 70% conservative Republican, she would be conservative Republican. I don't think principle or core belief enters into her career ambition. She has just been for and against too many of the same things according to the political winds of the times for me to believe anything else. She's a chameleon - changes color to match the environment she's in. Trump too has evolved, but not as much on so many things. I remember watching an interview of him in the 1990's where he was saying the same things about trade that he is saying now.

I don't think it is part of the issue. I'm not against gradually raising the MW, but that is not what I mean when I say "good jobs", and not what I mean by "opportunity".

I think he means he wants a strong military. But I also think this is typical campaign rhetoric. Anyways, having a strong military is fine. Using it irresponsibly is terrible on many levels.

Ha! Now we're getting somewhere! I wholeheartedly agree with you that Clinton is "owned".

Yes, he is light on details. But at least he is proposing a general outline of change that covers jobs, trade, immigration, and war. He can be attacked and criticized because he actually is proposing these initiatives. Clinton, cleverly as usual, cannot be attacked on her initiatives because she has none really.

I agree. I believe border security is a combination of things. It is physical barriers that are actually monitored and guarded. It is also a mechanism for legal immigration and visitation. And, it is also a mechanism to induce illegals to self-report or self-deport. I think Trump emphasizes the wall to illustrate that he is actually determined to end illegal immigration because "the wall" is the one thing other politicians - both R and D - don't want to do.

That's a fair concern. Honestly though, I doubt any wars start over some ill-advised Tweet. There's good and bad I guess. International leaders would get straight talk from the man.

Not an expert on this either. My understanding is that there is one kind of bankruptcy for individuals and another kind for businesses. I could be wrong. But anyways, I just see it as business.

I'm not saying she can't. But I do think there is "intentional blindness" by political supporters. For example, you can provide a list of the corporations and CEO's and foreign interests who have given her millions and millions of dollars, and you can still hear her supporters saying none of that will have any influence on her.

"Intentional blindness" works both ways, though (headin' you off at the pass, there). Yeah, I know. There are some things about Trump I just don't like. And I do have concerns about some things about him, but I guess the difference is that I don't see them as "fatal flaws".

I'm sorry, and I know this will sound pretty harsh, but I just think Hillary Clinton is toxic. So, in making my choice, I find that I am willing to accept Trump's down sides over her down sides.

Haha, that didn't take me too long! I think I was actually ... dare I say it? ...

brief!

 

Articles I've read say Rice and Powell had private servers and used gmail and that the administration deleted 20 million emails never turning them in. I don't know what pieces are true, but I question why there's been no investigation? To me it looks like only a Clinton investigation because of her campaign.

I would attribute that to listening to the people. Politicians are supposed to represent the people, not themselves. If she's changing positions could it be because her voters are changing positions?

It is part of the issue, not the whole issue. You said young people need a pathway to opportunity. It's almost impossible for them to join the workforce and be independent because entry level jobs don't pay enough to actually live separate from your parents.

But we have the strongest military in the world. Why does he say we're weak?

Haha but don't ignore the second part of my statement. People like Trump are the ones you don't want owning people like Clinton.

Clinton has released far more detail on nearly every subject. I think we'll have to disagree on this point.

Because the wall is a terrible idea. It's an idea that will never happen yet he talks about it like it's a done deal. That makes me think he'll say anything to get elected no matter how insane. It has taken 2 years for the section of highway near my house to be completed, that wall will never happen. Nor should it. Unless we are prepared to man it and shoot people as they cross, it will never work. Why doesn't he propose immigration reform that could actually happen? And how come he gets away with having no real immigration solutions when the GOP is the party so focused on that issue?

Isn't that how ISIS functions? I thought they were entirely social media based. Not to mention war in 2016 is very different than even 50 years ago. I wouldn't rule anything out. Plus what if his lack of filter released confidential information? People were worried about Hillary's emails getting hacked, but a live post on Twitter can't be taken back and is instantly seen by millions.

As a former banker that really sucks. The bank takes that loss, why should they? He has billions of dollars, made a poor investment and should foot his own bill. People can say all the bad things they want about banks, they still employe real people and write offs of that size have huge consequences to regular Americans. Why should I pay for his crappy investment with my job?

You'll get that with any candidate though. They will owe them because of votes, money or endorsements. Look at Trump's endorsements... some are not good. KKK and the NRA for example. They give their support in votes, and a candidate owes his or her voters by promising to represent their interests. It's really no different.

They both are a bit toxic in that they are divisive. We need to be the UNITED states again but I'm not sure either candidate is capable of achieving that. Either way, this November shall be quite interesting!



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The same way Them Clintons Love republicans and any Opposition.
Google the word ... Arkancide

 

Seth being a nice Catholic first name ... eh ?