The Hitler-Stalin Pact (1939)

They produced hundreds of them, yet they were mostly worthless, and only a few saw combat. They had a huge 'Wow!!' effect, but no military effectiveness. Same for the V-2's. We were doing much better just two years later, and that would have been a year earlier if many of the German jets were somehow gotten off the ground, so Hitler would still have lost. American and Brit engineers simply had better resources and larger numbers, and would win any arms race hands down, just as they do today.

 

It didn't help Japan wouldn't invade Russia which freed up a massive force of fresh troops, dedicated to protecting their nation and revenge, and who were experts in winter warfare. As for the atomic bomb it was who got there first with a working field capable bomb that mattered the USA had the will to play the long game as did Russia and our other allies Germany and Japan couldn't survive a grinding war it was only a matter of how it ended.

 

Fun fact: The German V-2 program and the American B-29 program has roughly the same amounts of money spent on them. For those billions of dollars/reichsmarks, the Germans got a rocket with a tiny payload that could hit London and scare people. The Americans got the most advanced heavy bomber in the world and the capability to level entire cities with impunity.

 

The really interesting thing about Hitler, is while he despised Americans in general, he admired the democratic party, because he believed them to be fellow socialist's.

 

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Yet, military historical experts claim that had the Nazi's begun using jet planes in 1943 against bombers over Germany things might have turned out differently. Many of the innovations of the implements of war developed by the Nazi's came too late for them to be effective to win their side of the war.

 

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OMG, you let the cat out of the bag. How could you do that? You mean all those Democrat Bund rallies, Joe Kennedy, Lindbergh, the refusal to take in the boat load of Jewish refugees. But hey, its those right wingers we have to worry about.

 

Some might. Others will note they would have still been pieces of crap by 1945, and would have been countered. Germany couldn't produce enough cheap planes to even maintain air superiority on either front, and had to strip the East of air support and anti-aircraft to defend Germany, and inadequately at that. Then there was the costs, maintenance and special fuel needed. They were never going to field many, and in the meantime most of their pilots would have died landing them sooner or later. We were already learning their weaknesses and how to counter them.

 

Hitler admired General Sherman more, for his genocidal scorched earth looting in his march through the South. Sherman was the poster child for the 'total war' fashion later copied by Hitler, Stalin, and Mao.

 

The UK & France (& to a lesser extent, Belgium, Netherlands, Luxemburg) had already agreed to coordinate defenses & militaries, in the event of a German invasion of the West as in WWI. See Dunkirk : fight to the last man / Hugh Sebag-Montefiore, c2006, Harvard U. Press - or any good history of the Western Front. France was thought to have the most powerful army @ the time.

The Soviet army was in bad shape, because of constant purges of the officer corps. Also, Stalin was well aware of the growing Nazi military strength - the USSR had been selling raw materials to Germany, leasing them exercise space, housing German aircraft & tanks & artillery beyond what was allowed by treaty - for a fee.

 

Stalin had no stomach for wars he might lose

the Red Army looked toothless when it invaded Finland

And the soviet union swallowed up half of Poland in 1939 which liberals may not like to remember

 

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Correct..... All adding to the treaty of Versailles onerous impositions on Germany and the appeasement policies of prime minister Neville Chamberlain.

 

Yes, I mentioned that as the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact which split Poland upon the coordinated invasion of both Germany and Russia. Which led to the Katyn Forrest massacre of Polish Army Officers, falsely blamed on the Nazi's.

Katyn massacre - Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katyn_massacre
The victims were executed in the Katyn Forest in Russia, ... The Sejm also requested Russia to classify the Katyn massacre as a crime of genocide.

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Soviets admit to Katyn Massacre - HISTORY.com
http://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/soviets-admit-to-katyn-massacre
On this day in History, Soviets admit to Katyn Massacre on Apr 13, 1990. Learn more about what happened today on History.

 

I doubt if 1 out of 1000 liberal snowflakes attending college know any of that

 

Why the hell would liberals have a problem remembering that? Stalin was as big a homicidal maniac as Hitler and communism was an abject failure.

Do you just troll for the sake of it?

 

Since the fall of the soviet empire liberals have been rewriting history to help everyone forget how much the left loved world communism

So maybe stalin is not as revered now as he used to be

 

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I'd put the ratio higher, but that's just me. Have you noticed that no factual responses from the Marxist Left to defend Stalin and his Commies?

 

If Hitler had a nuclear weapon, I expect he would have used it in the field. He certainly didn't hesitate to use poison gas on Jews, Soviet POWs, Gypsies, any political enemies, & so on. Nor work the same populations to death, on scanty food & shelter & clothing, with no medical care.

Yah, Germany had a long head start on missiles & jet aircraft - but Hitler wouldn't devote the resources needed for missiles early on, he was hoping to win a conventional war. They had jet aircraft, which Hitler insisted be turned into a bomber (Germany never did develop a long-range heavy bomber). By the time they realized they truly needed a jet interceptor (against massive bomber raids), it was too late - the logistics were shot, the German air force had lost a lot of pilots (mostly over UK).

 

Maybe they are having one of their rare lucid moments

 

Yah, the B-29 was particularly effective against urban Japanese targets - their paper & wood & fabric construction made them very susceptible to fire - always a concern in urban very crowded Japan (from earthquakes & fires going out of control afterwards). By that point, we had downed most of the IJ fighter pilots with experience, they were short of aircraft & pilots & POL. We had to adjust our tactics - strip out most MGs & their crew, fly lower, fly masses of bombers @ a time, load bombs to the max (mixed explosives & incendiaries - we had to more or less invent the incendiaries, & work out the manufacture & transport & deployment). I don't know how well the B-29 would have done against more substantial construction in Europe - B-29s were not assigned to the ETO, as far as I know. They were designed for the distances & conditions in the PTO - specifically to reach Japan with a substantial bomb load from a long distance, with a reasonable chance of completing the mission, returning to base, & sortieing again.

The B-29s were bleeding edge tech - if you see any photos of them on the start line, notice that there's always @ least one ground crew standing by with a huge fire extinguisher - engine & turbocharger problems were common, & operating on desert isles in the middle of the Pacific, under a blazing sun, storms & whatever else fell out of the sky, & doing maintenance & repair in open air, was very very ugly.

 

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Totally in agreement except for a few facts. Stalinist Russia used gas to kill political prisoner using trucks. He also rounded up Russians including thousands of Jews sending them to Gulags to work in the mines and other places in Siberia to get the natural resources, mineral and gold. The Nazi's improved upon the use of gas as a killer and also utilized their prisoners. BTW it wasn't only Jews that they massacred by poison gas and working to death, there were Jehovah Witnesses, Homosexuals, Gypsies, Catholics and Russian POW's targeted by the Nazi's.

See:
German mistreatment of Soviet prisoners of war
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_mistreatment_of_Soviet_prisoners_of_war
It is estimated that at least 3.3 million Soviet POWs died in Nazi custody, out of 5.7 million. This figure represents a total of 57% of all Soviet POWs and may be contrasted with 8,300 out of 231,000 British and U.S. prisoners, or 3.6%. About 5% of the Soviet prisoners who died were of Jewish ethnicity.

 

Agreed, and not to bud into your post. However incendiaries were developed during WWI and expanded in WWII. During WWII, both the Nazi's and the allies used thermite a mixture of Iron and Aluminum powder ignited by magnesium and White Phosphorus. In the case of Germany, the bombing of London and Coventry and the UK for their fire bombing raids on Dresden, Hamburg etc. Pfizer developed Palmitic Acid and gasoline/Kerosene (either can be used) to make Napalm. Lemay adopted the fire bombing technique from 'Bomber Harris'.

 

Was the Nazi party Socialist? I don't think so - any party that includes only people of the correct race is a racist party. A Socialist party - would be more concerned about the common good & building up society & its institutions, not merely deforming them by looting the property & persons of victim races &/or religions &/or ethnicities. For all its faults @ the time, the US Democratic Party was then forming the coalition of farmers, blue collar, ethnicities, religions & urban & so on that would carry the US through WWII.

FDR's main concern was to get the US economy going again. He tried a lot of different ideas & plans, but clearly the resurgent demand for food & goods as the World fell into WWII (& even earlier in the soon-to-be-PTO, as Imperial Japan invaded Korea & China & Manchuria) jump-started the US economy back to heights of production that were amazing.

the democratic party - Yah, but when it suited his interest, he cultivated Charles Lindbergh (whose father was Republican). Lindbergh wound up favoring Germany & against US intervention in WWII (& for America First), & spoke against aiding UK nor the Jewish population in Europe. He took a beating for that, especially after the attack on Pearl Harbor. He tried to reenlist in the USAAC, but neither FDR nor Churchill would have him. Lindbergh's public persona never recovered - although he did serve as a consultant in the PTO, & flew some missions.

 

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Please note:
National Socialist. The word "Nazi" is an abbreviation for the word "Nationalsozialist". The full name of the political party was the "Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei" - the National Socialist German Worker's Party.

Whatever happened to Joseph Kennedy's pro-Nazi leanings and his recall as ambassador from the UK?
THE KENNEDY-NAZI CONNECTION - BeyondWeird
www.beyondweird.com/ufos/One_Who_Knows_Fire_From_The_Sky_Part_30.html
Return to the main index FIRE FROM THE SKY by "One Who Knows" PART 30: THE KENNEDY-NAZI CONNECTION JFK's father, Joseph Kennedy, had a reputation of being pro Nazi...

 

Was it genocide? Did Sherman & the Union forces target Plantation Society as they marched through the South? Once Sherman cast loose from his supply lines, everything his forces ate, wore, horses, mules, wagons, gunpowder, shot & so on would necessarily come from the countryside. As former Black slaves rallied to the Union forces, they guided Sherman & scouted for him. Total war wouldn't truly come until the industrialized war of WWII, when major cities were destroyed by the fighting & bombing.

 

Yep, those were the secret terms of the German-USSR Non-intervention agreement. Is this somehow the fault of Liberals? If so, How? The Soviets saved the West, basically (& themselves, of course; their main concern) - they lost lots of formations, crops, cities, civilians. & yet they kept reforming & attacking again & again - most of the Axis ETO casualties were on the Eastern Front, & the Soviets suffered horrible losses.

The USSR felt isolated diplomatically, as I recall. & without the Soviet forces, the outcome in ETO would have been in doubt for much longer than it took in history. It was the Soviets who blunted the Germany forces & their allies, & eventually pushed them back.