This is the gun control legislation Mitch McConnell won't allow senators to vote on

If your dogma dictates that you must deny the data, so be it. I assume that you also regard anthropogenic climate change as being a Chines hoax.

 

First, are you an American?

 

I asked in order that you would post something like this. None of those nations is the same as ours. None of them have the same culture. You can't compare apples to oranges.

 

Firearm fanatics are facing a formidable opponent in their defense of permissiveness.

Most Americans, by a wide margin, have had enough of the horrific level of gun slaughter that befouls America.

Facilitated by the scandals of "Fancy Pants" LaP and his prissy pantywaists, progress is now inevitable.

At some point, elected representatives must place public safety and the will of the People before the special interests.

2020 may be High Noon for those who thwart democratic rule.

​

 

I grew up in the 1950's, born right after WWII. There was exactly one mass shooting in that entire decade. Today that shooting would be classified as a terrorist attack. It happened in 1954, known as the United States Capitol Shooting Incident: Four Puerto Rican nationalists shot from the Ladies Gallery of the House of Representatives chamber and wounded five Representatives.

I'd say there have been many changes, some good, some bad. Which ones led to this epidemic of mass shootings and killings, I think that is left with those with the knowledge to figure out. I don't think it was video games though. As a kid we played cowboys and indians, war etc with toy guns all the time. Probably the same as video games today. We also took our toy guns to school to play with during recess.

I know the 1950's gets mocked as the Ozzie and Harriet, the Danny Thomas Father Knows best era. Even so, mass shootings we didn't have. One big difference is most kids were raised by two parents with a stay at home mom to teach the kids right and wrong and to help with their homework. That's one big difference, another is religious. Do those contribute, I honestly don't know.

Perhaps the lack of discipline, I don't know about that either. I do know if I misbehaved in school, got spanked, I'd be getting another at home for getting spanked in school. I turned out alright. I do think we need a huge investigation. Without finding the causes, these mass killings will continue.

 

The times, they are a-changin'.

The degree of firearm permissiveness and the level of its tragic consequences sets the US apart from every other advanced nation.

Is there a correlation?

Most Americans believe there is, and with the corrupt, absolutist NRA imploding, the democratic will - as expressed especially by younger Americans and women, is much more likely to make progress than had been the case.

Sensible Second Amendment enthusiasts do not pretend that it confers absolute power over society upon gunsters:

 

What I do know is criminals don't obey gun laws, it is nothing but useless virtue signaling by the LW whose real goal is disarming us for political reasons. Family breakdown and a rejection of God have a lot more to do with these crimes than our laws, which haven't changed.

 

So you think once all guns are banned, that ends all mass killings? That there is no underlying reason or cause for the sky rocketing numbers of mass killings since 1970, especially since 2000 when we have had somewhere between 150-200.

I don't think the mass killings will stop until we know why they occur. The means will change. We entered an era where these mass killers are killing for killing sake's. They kill in public places, they kill people they never knew, they kill innocent bystanders. Pre-1970 most mass killings or shootings were familicides or felony related where the shooter knew his victims. Where one could point to a reason, a cause if you will. Not today. Seeking revenge, protecting or expanding one's turf, greed, vengeance, even going postal. Not today, those reasons don't apply anymore.

Unless we're willing to dig into society, to find the causes, taking guns won't solve the problem. The means will change and the killings continue. You can take this to the bank.

 

Natty, pass whatever useless gun law you want, I and millions of others won't obey them. Even when liberal CT passed an AWB, very few turned them in.

 

It was a different world wasn't it.

 

Completely different.

 

I don't think it will happen. They look for the easy fixes. It's really tough to admit mistakes.

 

Sadly, I'm sure you're right.

 

My brother was 14 and I was 12, we used to ride our bicycles to the train station. We'd take the New Haven Railroad to grand central and the subway to Madison Square Garden. We'd go to car shows, Knicks and Rangers games by ourselves and never had a single problem with anyone. I guess the thought of the electric chair for harming a child was very real.

 

I don't know if it was the electric chair or just the way folks were raised different. Perhaps right and wrong which was written in black and white back then, which today has been placed into the gray area has made all the difference. Back then most kids were taught being responsible for themselves, for their actions and decisions. Today, it is always someone else's or something else's fault.

Speaking as a kid, when I was 12 or 13 my dad gave me a .410. I remember riding my bike around 5 miles into town and buying shells for it at the local Western Auto. This was the late 1950's. No questions asked. I was born and raised on a farm, so I'm no city kid.

 

He's a bit young but he says it perfectly.

 

Exactly, I couldn't have put it any better. It was a different world, a different time, a bygone era. One of fine memories and one that I could wax on all day.

 

There's your problem, clearly you don't comprehend what America is a union of sovereign states not some totalitarian hellhole like Australia...

 

The US federal Constitution is ancient legislation. Don't you want to hear about a right to a jury trial, freedom from unreasonable searches and seizures, freedom of speech and religion, equal protection under the law?

 

The States can grant more rights than the Federal Constitution, Read them. All federal gun laws are unconstitutional because the States have never given the federal government the power to regulate guns. Some busybodies in Congress took it upon themselves to become tyrants and seized power that the States did not give them.

 

The discussion is about guns. So read that section =

Text of Section 23:
Right to Keep and Bear Arms
Every citizen shall have the right to keep and bear arms in the lawful defense of himself or the State; but the Legislature shall have power, by law, to regulate the wearing of arms, with a view to prevent crime.
https://ballotpedia.org/Article_1,_Texas_Constitution

 

State Constitutions plainly say that the right to bear arms is an individual right. All gun issues are State matters and not Federal concerns and all federal gun control laws are unconstitutional because the States have never given the Federal government to the power to regulate guns. Under the Federal Constitution the States have to allow citizens the right to bear arms but the States can regulate guns. It is not a Federal issue.

 

Yeah its not the best of language individual rightswise here in Texas. Still, incorporation fixes all that

 

Compare the Texas State Constitution language to the Florida State language =

Text of Section 8:
Right to Bear Arms
(a) The right of the people to keep and bear arms in defense of themselves and of the lawful authority of the state shall not be infringed, except that the manner of bearing arms may be regulated by law.

(b) There shall be a mandatory period of three days, excluding weekends and legal holidays, between the purchase and delivery at retail of any handgun. For the purposes of this section, "purchase" means the transfer of money or other valuable consideration to the retailer, and "handgun" means a firearm capable of being carried and used by one hand, such as a pistol or revolver. Holders of a concealed weapon permit as prescribed in Florida law shall not be subject to the provisions of this paragraph.

(c) The legislature shall enact legislation implementing subsection (b) of this section, effective no later than December 31, 1991, which shall provide that anyone violating the provisions of subsection (b) shall be guilty of a felony.

(d) This restriction shall not apply to a trade in of another handgun.
https://ballotpedia.org/Article_I,_Florida_Constitution

or the Pennsylvania State Constitution

Text of Section 21:
Right to Bear Arms
The right of the citizens to bear arms in defense of themselves and the State shall not be questioned.
https://ballotpedia.org/Article_I,_Pennsylvania_Constitution

 

I don't think one needs done. We already know if a bit of common sense is used.

Our education system sucks. We should be studying what other countries are doing better than us in this department and adopt/mix/use parts of each system adjusted for our culture.
We need to start teaching kids what "responsibility" means again. Part of that also means looking out for others more than just ones self. No more of this "If I'm not directly involved then it has nothing to do with me" BS. Of course this does have to be tempered with individualism also. IE: A mix of the two...not just one or the other.
We need to change our "Justice" system from one of strictly punishment to one of reform AND punishment. Not one or the other. But a mix.
And of course there's the mental issue. Something that so called "red flag" laws are supposed to fix but go about it in the wrong way.
Poverty is another reason for so much crime/deaths.

And then you have to take the media into account. Do we really have so many mass shootings that its actually a problem? Depending on what statistics you go by we have around 250 some odd mass shootings per year more or less. Depending on how you define "mass shooting". That means that roughly only 250 people (assuming one person per mass shooting which is generally the case) caused a mass shooting. Out of 325 million people. That's so statistically small that most scientists wouldn't even consider it a factor in most mathematical equations.

Ok so lets broaden that to a gun control advocates numbers that include all types of killings with a gun regardless of circumstance. We'll even go high end. 40,000 gun deaths in a year. Again, out of 325 million people. That's less than 1% of our total population. So...is it really a problem? No, its not. Does it suck? HELL YES!!! But there are lots of things that contribute to such things, all of which has nothing to do with a gun. Most "gun violence" (stupid term that) can be drastically reduced via the above suggestions.