The Erdoğan/Trump Slaughter Has Begun

We did not ally with the Kurds to be their forever buddy, to help them defeat everyone in the region against whom they swear an oath to eliminate. We allied with them temporarily because we wanted the same thing, which is to defeat ISIS. That is done. If I work with my neighbor to clean up the streets and common grounds after a storm. It does not mean that I am then beholden to pay my neighbors mortgage and car payment or everything to which my neighbor has obligated himself, like a second mortgage for leisure cash, or an expensive luxury car. The Kurds should sue or surrender to Turkey for peace and abandon their aggressive designs against them.

 

Risking the release of thousands of Islamic State prisoners whilst precipitously abandoning the Syrian Democratic Forces, a stalwart and effective ally in an extremely hostile region, is a "downside," indeed.

"Over four years, the SDF ... sustained nearly 11,000 casualties.
By comparison, six U.S. service members, as well as two civilians,
have been killed in the anti-ISIS campaign."

Gen. Joseph Votel, Commander of U.S. forces in the Middle East
​

The repercussions of cutting and running are liable to be very costly for the United States, but not just for the United States:

What a disgrace.

​

 

Raw, untreated Trumpery.

Abandoning a loyal ally that has sustained nearly all the losses and now risking the release of thousands of Islamic State prisoners cannot be spun as anything other than crapping on American values and interests.

"Over four years, the SDF ... sustained nearly 11,000 casualties.
By comparison, six U.S. service members, as well as
two civilians, have been killed in the anti-ISIS campaign."

Gen. Joseph Votel, Commander of U.S. forces in the Middle East​

 

Why do the Turks or the Kurds have to pay for Assad's cruelty?

 

Erdogan: Don, I'd like you to facilitate the slaughter of innocent Kurds, your ally in fighting ISIS, by removing the US military presence in northern Syria.

Trump: No problem, Recep. Just keep sending business to my hotel in Istanbul.

Donald Trump's longtime business connections in Turkey back in the spotlight
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/tr...ss-connections-turkey-back-spotlight-n1064011

“I have a little conflict of interest because I have a major, major building in Istanbul,” Trump said in 2015. “It’s a tremendously successful job. It’s called Trump Towers — two towers, instead of one, not the usual one, it’s two,” Trump said in an interview with Stephen Bannon, then chairman of Breitbart News.

Turkey’s invasion in Syria is creating even more refugees — just as the US shuts the door
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-poli...60/turkey-invasion-syria-refugee-crisis-trump

 

Even Fake Don's self-righteous Trumpthumpers who thrilled at his p*ssy grabbing and rutting behind the backs of trophy wives are now sickened by his perfidy.

Trump's Syria pullout endangers Christians,
other minorities, evangelicals warn
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2019/oct/9/trump-syria-pullout-endangers-christians-evangelic/

​

 

Assad and Trump are the fellow apostates from the global climate accord. Maybe, there is a bond.

 

Could be.. Trump is more like Momar Ghaddafi than most people realize. Ignorant, arrogant, grandiose and delusional.

I think Erdogan is much smarter and tougher than Trump... and I 'm not an admirer of Erdogan, but Erdogan is justified.. Trump is not. Turkey has been sheltering MILLIONS of refugees since Gulf war one and two.

Neither Turkey nor the Kurds should be paying for what Assad has done.

 

Your fake "all these people" crap aside, how do you attempt to reconcile this with your worship of your cut n' run slimeball?

On Friday, Trump's deployment of an additional 2,000 U.S. military personnel
to Saudi Arabia. was announced.


https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/...abandon-the-kurds-send-troops-to-saudi-arabia
​

 

Nothing fake about it. You and others who wish for the U.S. to be in an endless state of war are proof enough of that.

I am so thankful that we have an independent minded president who remembers why we elected him.

 

You can worship your p*ssy-grabbing deity and his deployment of US troops to Saudi Arabia if you want to, but please stop falsely claiming that I "wish for the U.S. to be in an endless state of war."

Like most patriotic Americans, I support the US keeping its vital commitment to its allies, the Syrian Democratic Forces. Your messiah's cutting and running, with its consequent slaughter of innocents and his liberating Islamic State prisoners is repugnant and antithetical to American values.

"Over four years, the SDF ... sustained nearly 11,000 casualties.​

By comparison, six U.S. service members, as well as​

two civilians, have been killed in the anti-ISIS campaign."​

Gen. Joseph Votel, Commander of U.S. forces in the Middle East
​

 

Once again, you failed to answer the questions.

@BotPolice

 

You can desperately contrive all the feeble diversions you need.

Your messiah's precipitous abandonment of stalwart democratic allies and liberation of Islamic State prisoners is indefensible.

 

If you get the balls to answer the question, I'm right here. Did I just assume your gender?

(I take it you'll only focus on the second part in bold)

 

Stings, doesn't it? The truth hurts.

What I find interesting is that you make many, many posts in favor of liberal points of view. But you are exposing yourself as being a neo-con who thinks it's the job of the U.S. to police the world. And if we lose a few young people and get a few legs blown off of them and spend trillions of dollars doing it, it's worth it. This is the thinking of Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama, Lindsey Graham, the late John McCain, and others I can think of. Conservatives are split on this, and I lean strongly towards having the strongest military in the world, but being very, very prudent and cautious about actually using it. Where I stand now is that our military should be used only in the defense of our country or in defense of our traditional, longstanding historical allies. The destruction of the ISIS caliphate met that high bar. ISIS was threatening to take two countries in the ME, and their goal was to take a lot more. Terrorist attacks in the name of ISIS were happening in Europe and the U.S. We had to take action.

Now, that mission in Syria and Iraq is complete.

But standing on Syrian ground, with no end in sight, as a buffer between these two age-old enemies does not meet that high bar. That is "mission creep". I would not risk American lives for this.

Another thing that seems to get lost in this debate is the fact that the Kurds had to fight ISIS. They had no choice, for ISIS would have completely wiped them out if they didn't fight. Instead, politicians and pundits are portraying the Kurds as being these "warriors for good" who selflessly helped the U.S. stamp out terrorists. The truth is, it was a matter of survival for them. They had no choice. If U.S. air power and other support hadn't arrived in time, they were all going to have to flee or die fighting. So they had to fight; they didn't choose to fight. It was us - the U.S. - who enabled them to win their fight for survival. So for the Kurds and the U.S., our mutual interests were the same as far as defeating ISIS, and thus, we became allies in that fight.

It is unfortunate that the Kurds don't have their own country. Instead, their people are spread out over several countries - Turkey, Iraq, and Syria. If I could be omnipotent like God, I would give them a country that is now parts of those countries. Of course, that is not possible. So they are understandably frustrated, and that lends itself to terrorism. It makes sense that some Kurdish militants would hide in Syria. It is a natural. There is no Syrian government control in the Syrian Kurdish area right now. I have mixed emotions about the Turks. I don't want them to commit genocide against the Syrian Kurds, but I can understand them not wanting to tolerate terrorist attacks in Turkey that originate in Syria. The U.S. has done much the same thing, by the way. We have hit Pakistani territory hundreds, if not thousands, of times because northern Pakistan is a lawless safe haven for the Afghan taliban and Al Qaeda. They use that area to train fighters and plan attacks on U.S. and Afghan government forces. Just imagine for a moment what would happen if some separatist terrorist group was staging terrorist attacks from their safe haven in northern Mexico, with no Mexican government control over the area. What would we do? Well ... you know what we would do.

Our mission against ISIS in Syria and Iraq is complete. If ISIS should ever rear its ugly head in Syria or Iraq to a level where they're actually taking ground, we can always pound them into oblivion again.

But I oppose mission creep. I want our young people out of there now. I find it interesting that all of these warhawks have no end game for our military presence in Syria. They have criticism of Trump, but no solution other than the status quo which is to stay there indefinitely.

I support President Trump warning the Turks of consequences if they go too far. If they act like savages, they're going to pay a dear price. It is not our soldiers who will pay the price though, and that's a good thing, for this isn't worth it.

I didn't know you were an American.

"Cutting and running" implies that we had an obligation to stay. And, in this case, with no end game. It implies that the enemy has won. This, obviously is not true. And, we have stayed for years now. So this is where we disagree.

For me, this has nothing to do with who the president is.

There are a lot of armchair generals around here who have never seen the consequences of war up close. I have.

I used to be much more hawkish than I am now. But what I have seen up close has changed me forever. Hence, my belief that there must be a very high bar for putting our troops into harm's way, and this Kurdish-Turkish conflict just doesn't reach that bar.

Seth

​

 

And there were two breakout attempts by ISIS prisoners today.

The Kurds were able to hold them ...this time...but that won't last long

 

Trump Orders Troops and Weapons to Saudi Arabia
October 11, 2019

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I dismiss those who blatantly lie and claim that a vital, humanitarian mission with minimal risk to US forces equates with "policing the world."

You cannot make Trump's treachery palatable for decent, patriotic Americans.

Fake Don precipitously cut and ran with no warning, no consultation with US allies, none with his own military advisers. You can applaud his facilitating the slaughter of civilians and the release of 10,000 Islamic State prisoners if you wish.

I don't.

 

We didn't go there to protect the Kurds. We went to eliminate ISIS from Iraq which was accomplished. Then we aided the Kurds in Syria to finish off ISIS. That is accomplished. If the Kurds have declared war against Turkey, what is that to America? As for the ISIS prisoners, they are the responsibility of their home countries, not America. As far as I am concerned, they are soulless monsters who should be killed.

 

We didn't go there as a humanitarian mission. It was combat mission and with good reason. When you call it a "humanitarian mission" you are agreeing to mission creep. And where does that ever stop?

The very idea that anyone who doesn't agree with you is not decent or patriotic is patently absurd. You are nuts if you don't think I am decent or patriotic because I don't agree with you.

For f*cks sake! Grow up!

No, he did not pull them out precipitously. He told of his intentions publicly back in April of 2018.

You don't know who he talked to about this decision. Very likely, Secretary of Defense Mattis and National Intelligence Advisor Bolton resigned over this impending decision. So yes, he talked about it within his administration, and he simply rejected their advice, and they left. That was their prerogative. But part of what he ran on was a promise not to get stuck in Middle Eastern wars endlessly, and I'm glad he has had the balls to stick to that promise.

 

Our mission in Syria is obviously not complete other wise we wouldn't be there. We ARE STILL THERE. Why is everyone overlooking this fact? Why is everyone overlooking the FACT that the 50 or so soldiers who were actually stopping a humanitarian crises have been moved to another part of Syria, just to let Turkey (our so called ally) have full power to ILLEGALLY attack sovereign territory and OUR friends, the Kurds. Turkey has been violating human rights for decades and yet we bow to their every whim. Why? I have an idea and it has something to do with decades of corruption and the fact we have a president who acts like a child who won't even talk to his advisors. My opinion about Turkey? They should be sanctioned and kicked out of NATO.

Not to mention we just we just sent 1000 more troops to another firehouse in the ME, Saudi Arabia. Don't talk to me about mission complete leaving the ME nonsense. Complete BS. This is the opposite.

 

Which might make some sense except Trump is ramping up US Troop presence in Saudi Arabia, so its pure bull crap to claim that Trump is only interested in getting out of the MidEast. The Turkey move is all about Trump’s business holdings in Istanbul, nothing else. Trump is a dick.

 

You mean the independent president who is sending more troops to Saudi Arabia? Right.

Sell that crap somewhere else.

 

They are going in the support role-air missile defense-a limited and relatively safe role.

Far different than Syria.

 

Excellent post.

We went in, achieved our goals, and should pull out.

 

Nope. Exactly the same - except the Saudi’s can afford to finance Trump’s business concerns.